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Post by badwolf on Feb 23, 2021 10:37:18 GMT -5
I loved Xorn. It was the writers that came after it that ruined it.
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Post by impulse on Feb 23, 2021 13:01:42 GMT -5
I think it was about the disciples of Magneto, but I'm honestly not sure, X-Men #100 pitted new team against old team (even if it proved to be a deception), X-Men #200 was the trial of Magneto, and X-Men #300 was...something? What a waste of an anniversary issue. Edit: Thorough summary of the issue here. More teasers of things to come than a meaningful/satisfying story in its own rite. Yep, lots of set up for the rest of the events of 1993 (the big 30th anniversary year of both the X-Men and Avengers!). Even though I started buying Uncanny with #281, I didn't have easy access to an LCS and had to scour spinner racks every month to find my issues - which were inevitably damaged. When I finally set up a pull list, #300 was the first issue I picked up from the shop, and in pristine condition! Yes, I was appalled at the $3.95 price tag, but at least the spine wasn't cracked! Believe it or not, it was Alan Davis that drove me from the X-titles for the first time. The sloppy transition from Seagle and Kelly was a huge turn off, and it seemed like I didn't recognize the books overnight. I came back for Claremont's "Revolution" era a couple years later, and while it wasn't stellar quality, I stuck with both titles until their respective ends. It sounds like I started around the same time as you. I went back some and forward. I loved the original Age Apocalypse. It was fun, and I liked that it was temporary. I was also in middle school, though, so take that as you will. I hated what they did after and dropped after Onslaught. Awful reveal. I came back around Claremont's Revolution and liked his voice. His plots were meh but no one grasped those character quite like him. I can't even remember what happened in #300 anymore. I remember being excited that JRJR was back on the title, but that didn't amount to much. JRJr's short return to UXM (#300-311) might be the last time I really liked his work. He did some nice stuff on Spider-Man years later, but I credit the inker and colorist for saving it. But it's been a good 20 yrs that he's slowly gone downhill; his pencils on Bendis' Action Comics run were downright offensive. I have NEVER liked JR Jr.'s art. Even as a kid on issue # 300 I couldn't understand why the art was so bad on such an important issue. I've seen some stuff where he did layouts and others did the pencils, and I found that far more tolerable. No disrespect to the man. His success and fame are there for a reason, but his style has never gelled with me. JRJr's short return to UXM (#300-311) might be the last time I really liked his work. He did some nice stuff on Spider-Man years later, but I credit the inker and colorist for saving it. But it's been a good 20 yrs that he's slowly gone downhill; his pencils on Bendis' Action Comics run were downright offensive. Wasn't Uncanny write around the time that he was doing Man Without Fear? I really liked his run on Daredevil as a kid. His Thor stuff intrigued has always intrigued me from afar. As a former X-Men fan, I always wonder if I should read the Morrison run. Yes, you should. I got back into comics for real with Morrison's New X-MEN. I LOVED it, flawed though it was. Morrison was simultaneously homage to the classics plus dragging them forward through time and forcing the concept forward. It felt to me fresh and urgent and was the most interestingthing to happen to the X books in years. He did his version of pretty much every classic story. Some landed better than others, and the run suffered from grossly uneven art. Morrison also tends to somewhat botch the endings. This fits that bill, but IMO the first half of his run was essential reading for me. I could not wait to devour the next issue. It's a flawed but brilliant run IMO. Marvel utterly shat the bed after, though. I won't say more now in case you ever check it out. I loved Xorn. It was the writers that came after it that ruined it.
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Post by badwolf on Feb 23, 2021 13:36:56 GMT -5
I agree that Morrison's X-Men is a must-read. I actually ignored it when the issues first came out (even though I was a Morrison fan--I guess I was *still* sick of X-stuff) but read one of the collections later and was blown away.
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Post by impulse on Feb 23, 2021 14:47:42 GMT -5
I agree that Morrison's X-Men is a must-read. I actually ignored it when the issues first came out (even though I was a Morrison fan--I guess I was *still* sick of X-stuff) but read one of the collections later and was blown away. Whoops, I tagged you but forgot to respond. I agree it was great and that it was later writers who ruined the Xorn thing, similar to how later writers didn't know what to do with Miller's one-off alternate future Batman in The Dark Knight Returns. Their failure doesn't diminish the original accomplishment. Joe Q's determination to cram various genies back into their bottles did irreparable damage to a lot of Marvel books IMO.
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Post by profh0011 on Feb 23, 2021 17:31:28 GMT -5
I haven't read the issues in decades, but while there are certainly problematic aspects to the story, and while it's true storytelling techniques have changed, I certainly enjoyed the Claremont/Byrne issues when they came out.
I enjoyed Cockrum's art and loved Paul Smith's, but when Smith left, I left. Romita Jr's artwork was completely inappropriate for the slick style that the title had come to stand by, and from reading a friend's copies it seemed the series became only more depressing (to a point of nihilism) after that point, so I'm glad I left when I did.
In the words of "Riff Randall"... "TOTALLY!"
These days, I find the less I buy, the more I enjoy. That goes for comics, music and DVDs.
I often think Chris Claremont was "grim & gritty" before there was such a term in comics. After awhile, it wasn't an attitude, or a style... it was the ONLY point. Man, that's sad.
The last 20 years, the only "grim & gritty" I ever wanna see in comics, is when Timothy Truman is doing it. Because he's just BETTER at it than anybody else, ever, in my view.
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 23, 2021 17:42:39 GMT -5
Yes, you should. I got back into comics for real with Morrison's New X-MEN. I LOVED it, flawed though it was. Morrison was simultaneously homage to the classics plus dragging them forward through time and forcing the concept forward. It felt to me fresh and urgent and was the most interestingthing to happen to the X books in years. He did his version of pretty much every classic story. Some landed better than others, and the run suffered from grossly uneven art. Morrison also tends to somewhat botch the endings. This fits that bill, but IMO the first half of his run was essential reading for me. I could not wait to devour the next issue. It's a flawed but brilliant run IMO. Marvel utterly shat the bed after, though. I won't say more now in case you ever check it out. I loved Xorn. It was the writers that came after it that ruined it. I am not an X-men Fan but the only 2 runs that I enjoyed and still own are the Morrison run and the Whedon/Cassidy run. They both were able to be enjoyed without doing too much research. I remember Xorn being ruined by Morrison himself. Didn't he reveal him to be {Spoiler: Click to show} Magneto?
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Post by badwolf on Feb 23, 2021 21:30:55 GMT -5
Yes, you should. I got back into comics for real with Morrison's New X-MEN. I LOVED it, flawed though it was. Morrison was simultaneously homage to the classics plus dragging them forward through time and forcing the concept forward. It felt to me fresh and urgent and was the most interestingthing to happen to the X books in years. He did his version of pretty much every classic story. Some landed better than others, and the run suffered from grossly uneven art. Morrison also tends to somewhat botch the endings. This fits that bill, but IMO the first half of his run was essential reading for me. I could not wait to devour the next issue. It's a flawed but brilliant run IMO. Marvel utterly shat the bed after, though. I won't say more now in case you ever check it out. I am not an X-men Fan but the only 2 runs that I enjoyed and still own are the Morrison run and the Whedon/Cassidy run. They both were able to be enjoyed without doing too much research. I remember Xorn being ruined by Morrison himself. Didn't he reveal him to be {Spoiler: Click to show} Magneto? Yes...I thought it was a GREAT reveal!
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