|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 10, 2015 17:53:18 GMT -5
PhantasmScript by Jim Owsley Art by Luke McDonnell and Armando Gil This is one story that makes one take notice, but definitely not in a good way. It is basically Avengers #200 in its implications, but with a Hyborian age slant. Jim Owlsey saved the colour Conan book in the '80s, as far as I'm concerned; he put an end to the monster-of-the-month era led by Bruce Jones and Michael Fleisher and reintroduced things like continued plot and supporting characters. I am very grateful for that (and for his great handling of Conan the king, too). Here, however, he gives us a story that makes me want to go take a shower. It is basically a story of Conan the rapist. You've no doubt heard of Red Sonja's famous vow concerning her chastity. Way back in Conan the barbarian #24, she claimed that no man's lips would touch her own unless he had defeated her in battle. At the time, that sounded like a bold boast from a woman who would remain master of her own fate: if a boy wanted to woo her, he'd first have to prove his worth. The boast was quickly turned into something more constraining: no longer a bar set pretty high for potential suitors, it became a curse on Sonja herself: she had to give herself to the first churl who could manage to beat her. Ugh. What a terrible concept. Worse: her prowess with a sword was tied to this ridiculous oath, and if a boy could beat her, not only would she have to sleep with him, she'd also lose her ability to fight! How paternalistic and insulting! But anyway, that's the cards we were dealt for most of Sonja's career. Back to our tale. We have Conan unceremoniously claiming he wants to have sex with Sonja. All right, he's a boor and a lout but such behaviour is probably to be expected from a barbarian. He doesn't just ask her if she's interested, though, because he knows she's not; she's made that clear several times in the past. No, this time he wants to fight her to win the right to bed her. She declines again. Does he take no for an answer? Nope, he doesn't; he forces her to fight him, fully expecting to win. That's right. our hero means to use brute force to force a woman to have sex with him. That's pretty much the definition of rape.  Luckily, Sonja beats the crap out of him but it's still disgusting that she would have had to fight for her right to say no to unwanted advances. The conclusion, hinting that Sonja just might have wanted to bed Conan after all if she could have, is just the rotten cherry on this disgusting sundae.  A tale to be forgotten, definitely.
|
|
|
|
Post by senatortombstone on Dec 12, 2015 9:35:29 GMT -5
PhantasmScript by Jim Owsley Art by Luke McDonnell and Armando Gil This is one story that makes one take notice, but definitely not in a good way. It is basically Avengers #200 in its implications, but with a Hyborian age slant. Jim Owlsey saved the colour Conan book in the '80s, as far as I'm concerned; he put an end to the monster-of-the-month era led by Bruce Jones and Michael Fleisher and reintroduced things like continued plot and supporting characters. I am very grateful for that (and for his great handling of Conan the king, too). Here, however, he gives us a story that makes me want to go take a shower. It is basically a story of Conan the rapist. You've no doubt heard of Red Sonja's famous vow concerning her chastity. Way back in Conan the barbarian #24, she claimed that no man's lips would touch her own unless he had defeated her in battle. At the time, that sounded like a bold boast from a woman who would remain master of her own fate: if a boy wanted to woo her, he'd first have to prove his worth. The boast was quickly turned into something more constraining: no longer a bar set pretty high for potential suitors, it became a curse on Sonja herself: she had to give herself to the first churl who could manage to beat her. Ugh. What a terrible concept. Worse: her prowess with a sword was tied to this ridiculous oath, and if a boy could beat her, not only would she have to sleep with him, she'd also lose her ability to fight! How paternalistic and insulting! But anyway, that's the cards we were dealt for most of Sonja's career. Back to our tale. We have Conan unceremoniously claiming he wants to have sex with Sonja. All right, he's a boor and a lout but such behaviour is probably to be expected from a barbarian. He doesn't just ask her if she's interested, though, because he knows she's not; she's made that clear several times in the past. No, this time he wants to fight her to win the right to bed her. She declines again. Does he take no for an answer? Nope, he doesn't; he forces her to fight him, fully expecting to win. That's right. our hero means to use brute force to force a woman to have sex with him. That's pretty much the definition of rape. Luckily, Sonja beats the crap out of him but it's still disgusting that she would have had to fight for her right to say no to unwanted advances. The conclusion, hinting that Sonja just might have wanted to bed Conan after all if she could have, is just the rotten cherry on this disgusting sundae. A tale to be forgotten, definitely. For the most part, I never enjoyed these short-length stories (be they about Conan, Kane, Kull, etc.) and would have preferred that
the main story be longer or that there be more art, letters, or scholarly
musings, when the main feature did not fill out the issue.
However, I did find it amusing that once again, despite earnest effort, the
chronically cock-blocked Conan once again went without. Thus far, in all my
readings, only Sonya has never once fallen for Conan's charms - this seems to
be quite a feat for any woman. Even when he was a king, she wasn't interested
in him.
And I don't think Conan ever had any intention to rape her. Most likely, in his
view, her repeated refusals were not the final stamp of denial of the idea of
them coupling, but simply her way of telling him to try harder.
Once Conan realized that she really did not want to mate with him, he relented,
let her win the contest, and even offered up his gold - which she refused.
Conan has always made it clear that he would never force himself on a woman -
as only a madman does that. I agree; there is no doubt that some women like to
play hard to get, and that while no never means yes, it can mean try harder.
However, once that fails and he has been twice spurned, no self-respecting man
would ever want to bed a woman who was not interested in him.
That's how I took this story, anyway. Please correct me if I am wrong, but such as I understand
it, the origin of Marvel’s Red Sonja is that she was granted her battle prowess
by her patron, red-haired goddess Scáthach – after being helpless to prevent
the slaughter of her family and her own ravishment at the hands of Hyrkanian
bandits. The condition of her boon is that she will ever possess it, until she
is defeated by a man in fair combat and then lies with that man. Perhaps this stipulation of celibacy was created to keep in
line with the Comics Code Authority and/or because the idea of a sword-wielding,
unmarried female freely engaging in intimate relations with a myriad of men
would not have gone over well with the parents of children purchasing the Red
Sonja titles. I don’t find the divine origin of Red Sonja’s battle prowess
to be misogynistic or paternalistic. I think it actually makes more sense than saying
that she just fought in a lot of battles and got better over time. Red Sonja is
somewhat petite, busty, not overly muscular, and often wears outfits that
accentuate her womanly features and that offer scant protection from blade
points and arrowheads. She also keeps company with and even leads rough lots of
men, the sort of which that would not be averse to forcing themselves upon a
woman. Even though Red Sonja could be strong enough to fend off one or two
ravagers, eventually even she would be overwhelmed by a sufficient number of
blue-balled brigands driven mad with lust. What about her tempestuously
tantalizing table-top tavern dances that are just that and never lead to
anything more than starchy loincloths for the lust-filled onlookers? Surely,
she has had to fend off hordes of horny Hyborians who otherwise would have had
their way with her. That none of this has ever happened after being granted her
boon (ignoring the hopefully apocryphal CtB#197-198) is evidence to me that her
strength and prowess is more than what a normal woman could have attained
through hard work, practice, and diligence. Also, Red Sonja appears in Conan the King #28 and she still
looks as young as she did in chronologically antecedent issues of CtB and SSoC.
Assuming that she would be the same age as Conan, which would put her in her
late fifties or even early sixties, she looks nothing like a typical woman that
aged. She also still fights with the vigor of her youth. Now, I
know that some of King Conan’s physical feats and exploits are more than a
stretch (holding open the jaw of tyrannosaurus rex while in its maw? Ugh!), but
he is still a man who is peak human condition for his age. I just find it hard
to believe that a sixty year-old woman could be as physically fit and
attractive as Red Sonja was in CtK#28. Then again, artists have not always done
a great job of conveying Conan’s age, in all of his appearances as a
middle-aged and aging man. However, perhaps immortality or long-life was an added,
albeit undisclosed to the readers – boon granted to Red Sonja by Scáthach? Regarding the Iron Maidens, Bêlit, Valeria, and other
various femme fatales appearing in Conan comics over the years; these sorts of
women are less plausible to me than is Red Sonja. While there are definitely
tough women out there, who are capable of besting strong men, they are rare and
it is impossible for me to imagine that any woman or small group of women in
the Hyborian Age, who were as attractive as Bêlit, Valeria, or the Iron
Maidens, would have had the desire to become pirates or mercenaries – even if
they had the ability to do so and to do it well. This is not to say that I do not like these characters or
enjoy the stories they are featured in – quite the contrary, actually. I am
only saying that in in some instances of characterizations of women warriors, that
is there is difficulty in maintaining a suspension of disbelief. That suspension
is easier to maintain with Red Sonja, due to the divine origins of her battle
prowess. That Red Sonja’s prowess came from a goddess helps to
explain why it is that she can always hold off a horde of horny Hyborians. How
does Valeria captain a ship full of pirates without being set upon (Bêlit’s
crew believed she was a death goddess and so they not only left her alone, they
worshipped her)? If strong men are raped in prison, I cannot imagine how a
beautiful woman would fare as the sole female on a ship full of murderous
pirates and rogues. To me, Red Sonja is actually the most powerful of all these
women. She was once the weak victim of evil men and then was given the power to
defeat nearly any man in battle. This power came at the cost of not being able
to know a man and keep her powers at the same time. This might seem unfair, but
she was given a chance and a choice that no other similarly victimized woman
was given. She can live her life as she will, on her own terms, without a man
at her side, or she can surrender her security to the man who bests her in
battle. In the Hyborian age and in practically every other age, the only way
for a woman to be reasonably secure was to find a man to protect her. Red Sonja
has no need of any man; she knows this and constantly flaunts her femininity at
all of the men who want her – including strong men, worthy of her (e.g. Conan) –
and then snatches it back from them, before they can get a taste. There is
definitely part of her that wants to be conquered by a worthy man, but the part
of her that wants to be her own woman always wins in the end. She is a tease.
She knows it. Conan knows it. And they both love each other for it. She is the
only woman who has never yielded to Conan and the only woman to whom he would
surrender even his kingdom for a taste of - and that is makes her the most
powerful woman. |
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 12, 2015 16:13:19 GMT -5
Thanks for an interesting and detailed reply, senator! I’m afraid I disagree with a lot of it… But don’t worry, that is the essence of discussion! I do agree with you that Conan had no intention of hurting Sonja, at least not according to his own morality. He has indeed often said that he would never force himself on a woman, but here I find that it is exactly what he is doing: he does not force Sonja to have sex with him per se, but he forces her to fight with him… and since he is convinced that he will win and he knows of her oath, it pretty much amounts to the same thing. Without forcing her physically, he is tricking her into having sex, using his strength to do so. I much preferred the way he went at it in a Dixon-written story we reviewed not long ago: he told Sonja that if she were ever to tire of her vow, he'd be there. That showed interest, but also respect. That would be all right if he had indeed let her win, but that’s not what happened : after a very convincing struggle, Conan pinned Sonja to the ground and said : …and then Sonja flipped him over her in a Hyborian tomoe nage and managed to land a good kick to his head. She then grabbed her sword and hit him hard with the pommel on the back. The blade upon his throat, Conan was offered a choice: “yield or die”. “Crom and Mitra… I’ll… I’ll… very well, I yield”. To his credit, he accepted defeat and offered to pay the gold he had bet. But I really, really don’t think the story suggests he let himself be beaten. He hadn’t either in a preceding fight (in Conan the barbarian #115), in which he had managed to defeat Sonja (by accident, really) after an argument. He had then taken her to a room, where her cold demeanour didn’t seem to faze him much; but at least, in that Roy Thomas-written tale, a mention of Bêlit (recently deceased) had made him realize he was not over his lost love and that had ended the meeting. You’re not wrong, but most of that is based on a series of retcons. Sonja was seen a few times before her “origin” story saw print, and in those tales she was not under any particular magical vow. She was what the original Red Sonya of Rogatino was, a strong and independent woman who wanted to live the life offered to men and denied to women in a patriarchal society. Red Sonja, in those days, did seem to be the product of long hours of training rather than a magical spell, as she said in “Red Sonja” (Savage sword of Conan #1): “ Dog! I was handling a blade when I was knee-high to your hauberk!” In her next chronological appearance (“Curse of the undead man”, SSoC #1), she makes clear that she does not welcome unwanted advances, but no mention is made of any oath. Then we see her in “Tower of blood” (CtB #43), where she and Conan argue about her life choices: “You wear armor too scanty to hide your charms… you disavow the caresses of men… and you play with swords as if they were toys made for your pleasure. That’s not a woman’s way, but a child’s”. “You’d have me marry, I suppose… raise brats instead of hell.” At the end of that particular adventure, rather than have Conan side with her against bounty hunters, she knocks him out with a rock and tells herself “I won’t have a male endanger himself out of false gallantry”. None of which actually contradicts her retrofitted origin, but it sure sounds more like “I am woman, hear me roar” than “I can’t have sex because my powers are based on a magical oath”. In any case… The "rape + oath + magical sword skills" origin was seen in Kull and the barbarians #3, and that’s been the official story since then. However, even so it was modified along the way. In Marvel Super Special #9, Sonja learns that she might be a member of a red-haired race worshipped by the red goddess who gave her her power (a goddess still unnamed at the time). That warlike red-haired race has long been at war with another one, composed of ape-like men, who worship a black version of the same deity. The goddess speaks to Sonja: “Do you not understand the call that brought you here? It was my voice… calling you home! Know this: you have always been what you are. I did not give you power; I merely removed your shackles. It was my will that kept you weak and weaponless in the land of humans… my will that kept the native skill from your hands… my will that you should see those you love die, and feel your body abused by rough men. You are my weapon, tempered with waiting, anger and denial… and at last forged with fire and pain. Go to your people! Lead them to glory! Smite your enemies!” Naturally Sonja is upset by this revelation and she smashes the red goddess’s statue, cursing her to hell. This alteration of the origin apparently didn’t take hold, for I don’t think I saw it referenced much after that, and the “power unshackled” aspect was dropped once more for the “power given” one. In Conan the barbarian #198, Sonja is raped again by a guy named Bakht. As expected, she loses her powers as per her contract with the red goddess. However, seeing a dear friend sacrifice himself for her in Conan annual #12, she snaps out of her funk and starts she-deviling again. Now personally, I would have expected her to be free of her vow by then, but that’s not how it played out. Perhaps, but in this case I think it’s just a case of Howard’s original vision of a woman who wants to be a soldier and doesn’t want to date boys coinciding with the comics code! (Valeria and Dark Agnes are both built on the same model). I readily grant you that Sonja’s look is surprising, considering what she does; but comic-books are full of women with the look of lingerie models when that of a UFC fighter would be more believable. Elektra, Black Cat, Shanna, Mockingbird… none of them were bitten by a radio-active spider, but they all kick male ass like the guys do. (Besides, Robert E. Howard describes Valeria, one of his sword-women, as “tall and large-limbed”. These ladies should be bigger than the way they’re drawn). I’d even believe her to be older than Conan! In CtB #23, she sounded a few years older than him). You’re right, she was unbelievably young-looking in that CtK issue, with barely a few grey strands in her hair and a few more lines on her face. But again, instead of a magical explanation, I’d settle for an editorial one: Sonja has apparently made no progress in decades (she’s still a penniless wanderer) and she’s even dressed the same way as in contemporary comics in which she’s thirty years younger. It’s really a case of “let’s put Sonja in there to remind Conan of his youth” without much thought put into what Sonja should be like after all that time. But your suggestion that it's due to the red goddess's magic works too. Agreed, although I do know a few feminine athletes in their late 50s who are both beautiful and very capable. Perhaps Sonja just happens to be one of those. Oh, I don’t know. I’m not a fan of the Iron Maidens concept, but at least one of them is, like, seven feet tall and one is a near-complete misanthrope. Plus one is the daughter of a Vanaheim war chief. It’s mostly their lack of armour that I find silly. As for Valeria; she made her way by pretending to be a boy for many years; by the time she blossomed out, her skill with a blade was such that few men attempted to touch her without her leave. Some did, sure, and we know she had to leave ships or towns because of certain men’s desires; but overall, her reputation must have sufficed to entice men to look elsewhere to quench their passions. I don’t find her all that difficult to believe in, insofar that we already agree to accept a lot from these imaginary stories. Bêlit, for her part, was taboo; she was the daughter of a goddess. That and her own fierceness explain how she managed to control her sexuality in a man-dominated world. Man, I hope Disney ends up buying the rights to Conan and Sonja just so we can have these characters back. |
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 13, 2015 11:47:34 GMT -5
Savage sword of Conan #154, November 1988 Cover by Joe Jusko, taken straight from the main story.  There’s an ad in this issue for art portfolios and t-shirts. I never purchased one of these portfolios, but they always seemed interesting (and boy, do I wish I had acquired the Severins’ Kull portfolios back in the day). Jackson Guice created a Red Sonja one, and from this single picture it looks like it was a nice one. I always preferred Sonja’s original look over the admittedly sexier but far less practical iron bikini.  As for the t-shirt, it’s taken from the cover of Conan annual #1… Classic Barry Smith artwork. Lovely! Table of contentsReturn of the iron damsels, concluding last month’s adventure; To fight another day, a silent short story.
|
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 13, 2015 11:56:03 GMT -5
SSoC #154 ------------- Return of the iron damselsScript by Charles Dixon Art by Gary Kwapisz Plot by both gentlemen Last issue, Conan and rebel Shemites ruled by oppressive king Ahtmet were betrayed by a man they thought their ally, the vain and cowardly Zuagir chieftain Khalli. The sole survivor of his band, Conan had sworn bloody revenge on the turncoat. Our tale begins as the Cimmerian has tracked Khalli and his Zuagirs to their hideout, where they are carelessly frolicking and enjoying the fruits of their ill deeds. Before our hero has time to act, however, the Zuagirs are surprised by a troop of royal guardsmen led by none other than the iron maidens, that group of all-female mercenaries introduced in SSoC #111. (This is somewhat surprising, since last issue Khalli was cooperating with king Ahtmet’s men to bring down the rebels. I guess that Ahtmet just turned against this feckless ally, who is a criminal in any case).  While the ladies and their cohorts wreak bloody havoc in the ranks of the brigands, Conan makes a dash for Khalli. The bandit escapes by sacrificing a few of his own men and slamming a heavy and bolted door behind him. As the fighting ends, Conan and the iron maidens get reacquainted. They are clearly not on as friendly terms with the Cimmerian as the last time saw them. Apparently the maidens’ leader, Vanaheim-born Soraya, had been smitten by our hero at the end of their last adventure together and we learn that Conan turned out to be less than a dashing prince when it comes to dealing with the fairer sex. While Soraya was convinced to have found true love and had been bathing and making herself beautiful for him, the Cimmerian had been getting drunk and having a good time with prostitutes. And hell hath no fury like a woman scorned! (or one offered a threesome when she was expecting a wedding ring, for that matter).  After Conan is called a hound and a swine and a brainless oaf, he and the iron maidens part; each intends to be the first to grab Khalli and get the reward for his head. The miscreant, meanwhile, has been galloping as fast as he could away from the revenge-mad barbarian, killing his own horse in the process. Finding refuge in the humble home of a well-meaning old couple, Khalli murders them during the night and torches their house. (One thing is constant about people like Khalli or Boraq Sharaq: there’s very little subtlelty about their villainy!)  Having imprudently mentioned to a river ferryman where he was headed, Khalli is followed by the iron maidens who eventually find an inn where some of his comrades might be found. (Here’s another of those great-looking landscapes Kwapisz is so good at… I love the way he draws vegetation).  Misanthropic Lupara would be all for grabbing the suspects and torturing Khalli’s location out of them, but fun-loving Persephone insists that there are easier ways to coax the information out of them. Given Soraya’s authorization, Persephone leads her sisters-in-arms Marika and Kira to the inn, where the three ladies charm the ruffians and get them to reveal that Khalli has ridden off to see a wizard living in the town of Thulara. The encounter ends with the lecherous fellows holding their bruised family jewels, but at least none are seriously injured and the iron maidens take their leave. Khalli has indeed reached the impressive castle of the wizard Thriggha, whose deformed visage and right hand hint at some cool (but disastrous) experience with occult forces.  The wizard is none too pleased with Khalli’s visit but tolerates the weasely bandit… although he refuses to use his dark arts to stop his pursuers, explaining that the price for doing so is always great and that there are easier ways to settle matters. Meanwhile, Conan is the victim of a bit of cleverness from the iron maidens, and he ends up in jail where the ladies hope he will soon meet a hangman’s noose. Only Soraya seems hesitant as the maidens ride off after Khalli, taunting the seemingly doomed Cimmerian.  The ladies find Thriggha’s castle, where they are tricked into entering an arena where a monster awaits them.  The beast stands ready to devour them when Conan erupts upon the scene; apparently, no jail was built that could keep him for long. Furthermore, even if he still smarts from being outwitted by the iron maidens, he really can’t let his erstwhile lover Soraya be eaten by a an overgrown mutant turtle. Blinding the creature with oil and fire, Conan sends it crashing through a wall of the arena, allowing the ladies to resume their hunt for Khalli. The very stupid bandit, upset that Thriggha won’t use his magical spheres to summon demons that would take care of his pursuers, murders the unsuspecting wizard and attempts to cast a spell himself. He manages to open the door to some nether hell, from which demonic creatures pour out to engage the Cimmerian and the iron maidens. The ensuing fight goes badly for our heroes, until Conan realizes that Khalli’s spell depends on the three magical spheres that hover over him; throwing an axe, he smashes one to pieces. This creates a vortex that sucks the demons back into hell, bringing Khalli (and almost Soraya, before Conan grabs her) back with them.  Soraya and Conan reconcile, sealing the peace with a kiss. Notes: - The royal guards are said to be serving “the king of Shem”, but there is no such thing. Shem is a region dotted with multiple city-states. We don’t know where king Ahtmet hails from, but it’s likely some eastern Shemite city. - Among the iron maidens, Kira is said to be the daughter of a deposed Turanian prince. That seems rather unlikely, since she clearly comes from Kush of points south. - Conan mentions that "a long time" has elapsed since he last saw the iron maidens, but Soraya is still sorely hurt by her last encounter with him; I doubt anyone could be that upset after, say, five years. I would then suggest that one or two years (perhaps three) must have past since SSoC #111. |
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 13, 2015 11:57:21 GMT -5
SSoC #154 ------------- …To fight another dayScript by Don Kraar Art by Terry Tidwell and Dave Simmons A short silent story in which we find the Cimmerian wounded after a great battle, an arrow through his leg. He makes short work of battlefield scavengers intent on robbing him and crawls away from enemy troops to a river where he pulls the arrow out and bandages his wound. Climbing a tree, he drops on an unsuspecting enemy officer and steals his armor, including a face-covering helmet; thus disguised, he manages to make good his escape. Not much to say; it’s a back-up space filler, little more. The silent aspect is interesting, though, as well as one scene seen from Conan’s point of view.  |
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Dec 13, 2015 15:37:40 GMT -5
In the way of petty tyrants everywhere, Ahtmet may have declared himself 'King of Shem', regardless of the truth.
|
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 14, 2015 6:42:47 GMT -5
In the way of petty tyrants everywhere, Ahtmet may have declared himself 'King of Shem', regardless of the truth. Makes sense, just as Ming the merciless declared himself "emperor of the universe" while he wasn't even master of one continent on Mongo. |
|
|
|
Post by senatortombstone on Dec 14, 2015 7:13:56 GMT -5
Roquefort Raider, thanks so much for the lengthy response to my post and even more thanks for providing your exegesis on this wonderful series. I have only read the some of the Marvel comics and some of the Darkhorse Comics representations of Conan, so I shall gladly defer to your position, when it contradicts my own.
I just watched some of the Youtube clips of Red Nails. It looked decent enough and it is unfortunate that it never came to fruition. For years now I have longed for some sort of R-rated (by Crom, I would settle for PG-13) animated Conan feature, in the same vein of the Marvel and DC animated features. When it comes to swords and sorcery, save for LOTR, I prefer animation to live-action. Low budget special effects can ruin a movie and it is difficult to find the complete Conan package in one man, while anyone look like anything, they just need the right voice. There is so much REH material to work with. There could be movie after movie after movie. I suspect this will happen some day; hopefully soon.
RE: SSoC#154: I forgot how much humor there was in this issue - definitely gigantic on mirth.
|
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 14, 2015 7:30:53 GMT -5
I just watched some of the Youtube clips of Red Nails. It looked decent enough and it is unfortunate that it never came to fruition. For years now I have longed for some sort of R-rated (by Crom, I would settle for PG-13) animated Conan feature, in the same vein of the Marvel and DC animated features. I had no idea scenes from that movie could be seen on Youtube... Thanks so much for pointing it out! I expect that Red Nails would have been not only the best Conan film so far (which isn't saying much), but an actually good Conan movie! If I'm not mistaken, the voice actor for the main role would have been Ron Perlman (who ended up playing Conan's dad in the Momoa film). I'm always puzzled by the way Hollywood works. How is it that efforts like this, which definitely look worthwhile, languish in limbo or are abandonned while complete piles of manure get funded and produced? |
|
|
|
Post by senatortombstone on Dec 15, 2015 6:50:29 GMT -5
I just watched some of the Youtube clips of Red Nails. It looked decent enough and it is unfortunate that it never came to fruition. For years now I have longed for some sort of R-rated (by Crom, I would settle for PG-13) animated Conan feature, in the same vein of the Marvel and DC animated features. I had no idea scenes from that movie could be seen on Youtube... Thanks so much for pointing it out! I expect that Red Nails would have been not only the best Conan film so far (which isn't saying much), but an actually good Conan movie! If I'm not mistaken, the voice actor for the main role would have been Ron Perlman (who ended up playing Conan's dad in the Momoa film). I'm always puzzled by the way Hollywood works. How is it that efforts like this, which definitely look worthwhile, languish in limbo or are abandoned while complete piles of manure get funded and produced? I don't know if you are into video games, but Ron Perlman voiced Conan in the Conan game for the PlayStation 3/X-Box 360. That was a decent game, in the same vein as God of War. It was unfortunate that it never got a sequel. There have been a few Conan games over the years. There was one for the PlayStation 2, which was only released in Europe. There was the Age of Conan MMORPG, which was released a few years ago. I think Ron Perlman would be fine to voice an older Conan, but not a younger, more youthful one. I have a faint hope that one day Hollywood will offer recompense for its abysmal treatment of the Conan franchise, much the same way it did for Marvel movies, beginning with Blade. |
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 15, 2015 7:59:40 GMT -5
I had no idea scenes from that movie could be seen on Youtube... Thanks so much for pointing it out! I expect that Red Nails would have been not only the best Conan film so far (which isn't saying much), but an actually good Conan movie! If I'm not mistaken, the voice actor for the main role would have been Ron Perlman (who ended up playing Conan's dad in the Momoa film). I'm always puzzled by the way Hollywood works. How is it that efforts like this, which definitely look worthwhile, languish in limbo or are abandoned while complete piles of manure get funded and produced? I don't know if you are into video games, but Ron Perlman voiced Conan in the Conan game for the PlayStation 3/X-Box 360. That was a decent game, in the same vein as God of War. It was unfortunate that it never got a sequel. There have been a few Conan games over the years. There was one for the PlayStation 2, which was only released in Europe. There was the Age of Conan MMORPG, which was released a few years ago. I think Ron Perlman would be fine to voice an older Conan, but not a younger, more youthful one. I have a faint hope that one day Hollywood will offer recompense for its abysmal treatment of the Conan franchise, much the same way it did for Marvel movies, beginning with Blade. That would be great. The character and his world are definitely the stuff epics are made of, but the material must be handled properly to avoir it being campy or seen as yet another generic swords 'n' sandals CGI fest. Much as I hate the way he handled Conan's character, I must give this to John Millius: he did have a clear vision of what his Conan movie should be like and made it work. (It's just unfortunate that Conan the barely-functional emotional cripple had little to do with Robert Howard's). What I would really like is for some studio to try to produce one good Conan movie... and not the first instalment in a Conan franchise, beginning with the obligatory "origin" story. Rober Howard never wrote a Conan origin story. Heck, his first two Conan tales were about Conan the king! I would definitely prefer a movie in which Conan is already a grown man, with some history behind him, one that takes advantage of the richness of the Hyborian age. (The latest film actually did a fairly good work in that regard, showing Conan as a pirate and giving him long-time friends. Too bad it degenerated into another ordinary "boy avenges his daddy" kind of thing). As far as cinematography goes, a Conan movie done in the vein of Vikings would be pretty neat. I'm sure Howard would have liked that series. And hey, perhaps a Conan series adapting Howard's short stories would work better than a feature film? |
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 16, 2015 11:03:29 GMT -5
Savage sword of Conan #155, December 1988 Cover by Dorian. The lady on the right looks like she walked off a Flemish painting, which makes me wish more artists had used classical styles once in a while on SSoC covers. (The cover the Howard the duck magazine #5 was a collage; it would have been great to see more of that artistic exploration. Can you imagine a Rubens-inspired Conan cover?)  The issue contains only one story, “Behind the walls of night”, and several pin-ups of generally low interest. Behind the walls of nightScript by Don Kraar Art by Ernie Chan A honest-to-Crom vampire story, Behind the walls of night is hard to place in the chronology. The events occur in Corinthia, where Conan is penniless and ready to take on pretty much any job. The artwork by Ernie Chan is good, with a few very good panels. I am always impressed by Ernie’s technical mastery: looking at his brush strokes you get the impression that he’s working very fast, but with each and every line doing just what he wants. A bit like French cartoonist Boulet, who dispenses entirely from the pencil stage of his drawings. Chan is also capable of filling a panel with ink without ever losing the sense of depth and without having diagonals that make characters disappear into background element. That is actually a pretty darn hard thing to achieve. Look at this brawl: that’s a lot of tiny lines, but the image remains crystal clear.  The plot revolves around a doomed mission in what we’ll quickly discover is a vampire-infested village. Conan and a few no-good wastrels are hired by a nobleman to go into a certain village, wherein they should find a certain bejewelled hammer and spike that symbolize the nobleman’s right to rule the region. The man is suspiciously quiet about the circumstances that led to the trinkets to be abandoned, but his story goes roughly like this: two generations ago, a plague struck a certain village where his ancestors lived. The population fled, leaving the village’s doors locked, but in their hurry they left the hammer and spike behind. Now, decades later, the heir to the former leader of the place sees his position challenged, and he has decided he needed the two objects to reaffirm his right to rule. The village is a strange-looking one: it is entirely covered by a series of roofs, including the streets, making it look like one giant building. (Kind of like Xuchotl in Red Nails, but made of wood instead of jade).  The nobleman gives a plan to his mercenaries, a plan indicating which building should house the hammer and spike. According to him, the plague is now long gone and it should be safe to get into the village; but still, just to avoid getting lost, it would be good for the men to make sure they leave the place before nightfall… you know, just because it would be hard to see in there after dark. Conan is naturally extremely wary of the nobleman’s feeble explanations and he fully suspects he will encounter trouble in the walled village… but he still goes in, because he needs the money. The village’s door is locked from the outside but the men break through the lock and make their way indoors. There they encounter an odd sight: cows, a whole herd of cattle being kept in this “abandoned” village. The plan leads them to the door of a manor covered in mitraic symbols. (This is the same symbol, looking both like a cross and a rising sun, that the adventurer-priest Vitellus had been using in previous issues).  Entering the manor, the mercenaries find the hammer and spike, left untouched for scores of years despite not being protected at all. That’s when half of the rogues turn on the others (including Conan), grabbing the loot and locking them in the manor. A locked door isn’t going to stop an angry Cimmerian for long, and after busting loose Conan and his remaining comrades run to the village’s main door where they hope to catch their traitorous former allies. The lack of footsteps in the snow outside reveals that the turncoats havent made it outside yet. And no wonder: following an inept leader, the dishonest brigands got a little lost in the maze-like streets of the village. Much to their chagrin, they encounter its inhabitants: you’ll have guessed, naturally, that these are all vampires.  Hearing the anguished screams of the captured brigands, Conan and his friends carefully make their way back into the village. They do not intend to rescue their former allies, but want the hammer and spike back. Carefully using the village’s roof beams as their passageway, Conan’s group find the captured thieves attached to a makeshift altar where the vampires prepare to make a meal out of them.  That’s where we learn the place’s origin, from the mouth of the vampires’ leader. It turns out there was no plague, two generations ago… what hit the village was a vampiric outbreak. The vampires’ current leader used to be lord of the place, but when he and a few soldiers bravely tried to contain the vampires they were betrayed by his own brother, who fled with part of their retinue and locked the village’s doors. (The nobleman who hired Conan is clearly the grandson of that treachorous brother). A bit of dirt falling from the beam on which Conan is standing alerts the vampires to his presence, and the chase for the last mercenaries is on. All of Conan’s friends are eventually killed, but the Cimmerian bargains for his life with a deal that might tempt the wronged former lord: is vengeance worth more to him than a northman’s blood?  And it is, for next we see Conan outside of the village, bringing his boss back, having convinced him that his presence was necessary. The nobleman is captured by the vampires (now free to get out of the village), and as the greedy man is slaughtered, Conan is warned by the vampire lord not to pass that way again… but I think that’s a warning Conan didn’t need! Notes: - Good character development in this tale: there’s a sympathetic old guy whose wizard-like appearance turns out to be misleading, a cowardly horse thief, a rather okay vampire lord (as far as vampire lords go), and Conan gets to show he’s basically a good guy beneath his rough exterior. - I like the sign of Mitra used in these comics. It is close enough to a cross for wetsern audiences to understand what it is, and the rising sun is true to the mitraic faith. - What are the odds that the noblemen's symbol of power would be a hammer and a spike, the very tools generally used to kill a vampire??? Still, they will not be used in this story to kill any vampire. They were a red herring!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 20, 2015 12:34:07 GMT -5
Savage sword of Conan #156, January 1989  Cover by Joe Jusko. Conan’s head would be used as the corner logo of issue #156. This issue contains one story and a portfolio by Dave Simmons. Rogue’s honorScript by Chuck Dixon Art by Mike Docherty and Ricardo Villagran Docherty and Villagran work so well together that they were part of my list of the best penciller-inker teams for last year's twelve days of Christmas thread. I believe this would be the first chronological appearance of their team, which would handle the art on the final months of the Conan the barbarian color comic. Villagran has that great Argentinian touch that adds a certain je ne sais quoi to comic-book art; an earthiness, a rawness that gives it extra realism. It demands a great mastery of the brush, and it leads to neat images like this one:  I can’t really say why it looks so good, but to me it is absolutely beautiful in its cleanness and efficiency. Light and shadows are brilliantly used, but is a quiet way that doesn't distract from the story. The only fault I would point out is that after Kwapisz’s heavily detailed panels from many of the previous issues, Docherty’s layouts look a bit sparse. They’re however quite dynamic. The script by Dixon includes one of the man’s strengths : making ordinary people look dangerous. The bandits in this story are much scarier than twenty foot tall dinosaurs; they sound as if they could do Conan actual harm. The plot itself is simple: Conan is wronged by partners-in-crime, Conan gets even. It starts with a nightly raid on a Zamoran nobleman’s manor by Conan and a band of thieves. Their leader Kairus doesn’t much care for the Cimmerian and it is clear that relations are strained to the breaking point even during the operation. Finding the nobleman’s daughter, the thieves have another reason to fight among themselves: some want to rape her while Conan insists on just getting the loot and escaping. Guards erupt at that moment, and the girl is kept as a hostage as the thieves make good their escape. Discord flares up again soon thereafter, as Conan wants the girl to be ransomed to her father and the others want her to be used as their sex toy, sold as a slave, or both. Fighting erupts, and because this is a Dixon story Conan is beaten up by the others. (Hey, sure he’s Conan… but he’s facing four vicious guys. It’s only realistic that he’d lose). Kaidu spits in Conan's face and has him thrown down a well, the top of which is sealed by planks and rocks.  But don’t worry… Conan is not the kind of guy to stay trapped for long even if it means accomplishing feats defying belief!  Bad news: who would wait for our hero right outside the well, if not the soldiers sent by the nobleman to rescue his daughter?  Having just lost a fight against superior numbers, Conan isn’t about to repeat this indignity. He charges the “milk-fed puppies” who want to put him in chains and manages to unhorse one of them, stealing his mount. He rides south toward the town where Kairus and the others are likely to sell the girl. (Conan claims he’s only after revenge, but we suspect he also has the girl’s fate in mind). In a lakeside town called Hofir, the Cimmerian finds one of his erstwhile comrades, Ral, who decided to have a party while the others rode on towards Shadizar. Ral claims that the girl was kept untouched to raise a better price. Conan throws him off a high balcony and resumes the chase. Reaching Shadizar, the capital of Zamora, Conan is spotted by Kairus who sends his right-hand man Tomko to murder him. The captured girl shows character by taunting the brigands, afraid of just one man. Tomko fails in his murder attempt and is left tied up by the Cimmerian who learns where Kairus is hiding. Conan’s rescue attempt is foiled by the arrival of Trajarius, the leader of the soldiers who were chasing the thieves. The man is now alone, and although well-intentioned he completely misjudges the situation. While Trajarius wastes time interfering with Conan, Kairus escapes with the girl and another comrade.  Trajarius and Conan eventually agree to work together to rescue the girl. The Cimmerian guesses that the thieves will make for the town of Khadran, where they can hope to get the best price for the girl. Catching up to their prey in an oasis, the two men find them already prisoners of Zuagir desert raiders.  Taking advantage of the element of surprise, Trajarius and Conan pepper the Zuagirs with arrows and finish them with blades. The girl helps by deftly handling a spear, too! In the end, Conan decides not to lift a finger against Kairus, whom the Zuagirs had already staked to the ground. He will just let the vultures take care of the thug.  Notes: - Mention is made of a spider god, which is appropriate in Zamora. It is called “Arachna” here, while it was named Omm in CtB #13 and Zath in SSoC #207-210 and in the "Conan and the spider god" miniseries. The god Bel is also named, which is appropriate too. Bel is a Shemitish deity also worshipped by Zamorans; he’s the patron god of thieves. - When does the story occur? Meh. Whenever Conan was in Zamora, I suppose. He sounds a little too world-weary to still be the enthusiastic 17-year old he was when he first entered the land, but we know he came back a fw times to that country.
|
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Dec 20, 2015 15:39:19 GMT -5
Is it explained why the vampires have not previously found the hammer and spike, given they have had two generations in which to search the village?
|
|
