shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,816
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Post by shaxper on Jun 30, 2022 7:00:24 GMT -5
So, in 1992's DC Universe there wasn't a "true leader" between heroes..?  No, Superman was established to be the guy everyone looked up to pretty much right after Byrne left (suggested in Action Comics #623 and affirmed in Adventures of Superman #449). That's part of why his insecurity here doesn't quite jibe. If we'd gotten more of a, "I know they all look up to me, but..." I would have bought it more. Instead, we got, "I wish I was as awesome as a Green Lantern," which still leaves me scratching my head. Besides, Clark explicitly turned down the offer to become a Green Lantern before it went to Hal Jordan ( Action Comics #642, though at least part of this story is now out of continuity). |
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Post by zaku on Jun 30, 2022 8:04:16 GMT -5
So, in 1992's DC Universe there wasn't a "true leader" between heroes..?  No, Superman was established to be the guy everyone looked up to pretty much right after Byrne left (suggested in Action Comics #623 and affirmed in Adventures of Superman #449). That's part of why his insecurity here doesn't quite jibe. If we'd gotten more of a, "I know they all look up to me, but..." I would have bought it more. Instead, we got, "I wish I was as awesome as a Green Lantern," which still leaves me scratching my head. Besides, Clark explicitly turned down the offer to become a Green Lantern before it went to Hal Jordan ( Action Comics #642, though at least part of this story is now out of continuity). I see. And at this point in continuity he is the first hero of the modern age, so... yep. It doesn't make sense. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 30, 2022 10:18:29 GMT -5
Aquaman also had a new series, just before this and would get a new one, in the near future, from Peter David. Atlantis Chronicles was also in the recent past; so, they were definitely trying to raise his profile.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,816
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Post by shaxper on Jun 30, 2022 15:37:05 GMT -5
No, Superman was established to be the guy everyone looked up to pretty much right after Byrne left (suggested in Action Comics #623 and affirmed in Adventures of Superman #449). That's part of why his insecurity here doesn't quite jibe. If we'd gotten more of a, "I know they all look up to me, but..." I would have bought it more. Instead, we got, "I wish I was as awesome as a Green Lantern," which still leaves me scratching my head. Besides, Clark explicitly turned down the offer to become a Green Lantern before it went to Hal Jordan ( Action Comics #642, though at least part of this story is now out of continuity). I see. And at this point in continuity he is the first hero of the modern age, so... yep. It doesn't make sense. I'm away from my computer right now so it's hard to check, but I'm 90% sure the Man of Steel limited series established that Batman came first. |
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Post by zaku on Jun 30, 2022 16:07:15 GMT -5
I see. And at this point in continuity he is the first hero of the modern age, so... yep. It doesn't make sense. I'm away from my computer right now so it's hard to check, but I'm 90% sure the Man of Steel limited series established that Batman came first. I don't know if it counts, but History Of Dc Universe (1986) clearly says Sups was the first one. |
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Post by badwolf on Jun 30, 2022 17:31:33 GMT -5
In Man of Steel #3, Batman mentions that he read about Superman's debut in the papers eight months prior.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jun 30, 2022 19:20:32 GMT -5
Panic in the sky was before I started reading Superman, so I've never read this but if Superman needed someone for tactics, shouldn't he be going to Batman? Or Nightwing? Going to an anti-hero (at best) seems pretty ridiculous. Also, isn't bringing in Deathstroke a pretty big insult to Diana.. the Amazons are a pretty war-based culture. I guess you're just supposed to go, 'Cool! guest stars!' and not think about it too much.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,816
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Post by shaxper on Jun 30, 2022 20:52:14 GMT -5
I'm away from my computer right now so it's hard to check, but I'm 90% sure the Man of Steel limited series established that Batman came first. I don't know if it counts, but History Of Dc Universe (1986) clearly says Sups was the first one. Answering this one is actually really tricky. On the one hand, Action Comics #597 verifies this. It seems to have been the intent all along that Superman came first. However, when the Post-Crisis reboot started in late '86/early '87, Superman's timeline had him only being in costume for the past two years, whereas Batman's far more convoluted timeline has him either in Year 10 or year 14 in 1987 (it's complicated, but I get into it here). Essentially, everyone meant for Superman to come first, but in the spirit of the great trainwreck the Post-Crisis turned out to be, no one was listening to anyone. I also could have sworn Ma Kent makes some comment about "that costumed freak in Gotham" before Clark suits up for the first time, but I cannot find it again. Maybe that happened in some other Superman origin story somewhere (likely movies or TV). |
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,816
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Post by shaxper on Jun 30, 2022 20:54:28 GMT -5
I guess you're just supposed to go, 'Cool! guest stars!' and not think about it too much. Pretty much.  |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 30, 2022 21:34:00 GMT -5
I don't know if it counts, but History Of Dc Universe (1986) clearly says Sups was the first one. Answering this one is actually really tricky. On the one hand, Action Comics #597 verifies this. It seems to have been the intent all along that Superman came first. However, when the Post-Crisis reboot started in late '86/early '87, Superman's timeline had him only being in costume for the past two years, whereas Batman's far more convoluted timeline has him either in Year 10 or year 14 in 1987 (it's complicated, but I get into it here). Essentially, everyone meant for Superman to come first, but in the spirit of the great trainwreck the Post-Crisis turned out to be, no one was listening to anyone. I also could have sworn Ma Kent makes some comment about "that costumed freak in Gotham" before Clark suits up for the first time, but I cannot find it again. Maybe that happened in some other Superman origin story somewhere (likely movies or TV). That was a line in the first episode of Lois and Clark, as I recall. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 30, 2022 21:35:08 GMT -5
I guess you're just supposed to go, 'Cool! guest stars!' and not think about it too much. Pretty much. Did Marlo Thomas know that Wonder Woman stole her hairstyle?  |
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Post by chadwilliam on Jun 30, 2022 21:50:29 GMT -5
I don't know if it counts, but History Of Dc Universe (1986) clearly says Sups was the first one. Answering this one is actually really tricky. On the one hand, Action Comics #597 verifies this. It seems to have been the intent all along that Superman came first. However, when the Post-Crisis reboot started in late '86/early '87, Superman's timeline had him only being in costume for the past two years, whereas Batman's far more convoluted timeline has him either in Year 10 or year 14 in 1987 (it's complicated, but I get into it here). Essentially, everyone meant for Superman to come first, but in the spirit of the great trainwreck the Post-Crisis turned out to be, no one was listening to anyone. I also could have sworn Ma Kent makes some comment about "that costumed freak in Gotham" before Clark suits up for the first time, but I cannot find it again. Maybe that happened in some other Superman origin story somewhere (likely movies or TV).I'm pretty certain that she says this in the Superman cartoon of the 1990s which would make sense what with it debuting about four years after Batman: The Animated Series. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 1, 2022 4:25:47 GMT -5
No, Superman was established to be the guy everyone looked up to pretty much right after Byrne left (suggested in Action Comics #623 and affirmed in Adventures of Superman #449). That's part of why his insecurity here doesn't quite jibe. If we'd gotten more of a, "I know they all look up to me, but..." I would have bought it more. Instead, we got, "I wish I was as awesome as a Green Lantern," which still leaves me scratching my head. Besides, Clark explicitly turned down the offer to become a Green Lantern before it went to Hal Jordan ( Action Comics #642, though at least part of this story is now out of continuity). I see. And at this point in continuity he is the first hero of the modern age, so... yep. It doesn't make sense. You could be a leader without being the first. His power set and moral character placed him in that spot. |
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Post by zaku on Jul 1, 2022 5:12:24 GMT -5
I see. And at this point in continuity he is the first hero of the modern age, so... yep. It doesn't make sense. You could be a leader without being the first. His power set and moral character placed him in that spot. My point is that he wasn't so inexperienced  |
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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 1, 2022 5:58:23 GMT -5
More proof that after COIE DC didn’t have one person guiding the new universe.
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