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Post by Phil Maurice on Nov 24, 2015 20:45:05 GMT -5
The Classic Cover Contest is disheartingly conservative I want to understand this comment and why you are disheartened. The "Hall of Fame" showcases numerous pre-Code, Underground, and Independent covers that are juvenile, shocking, and in poor taste.
There is no jury, no monolithic body that selects the winners. I'm utterly baffled by some of the past champions, as much as I am shamed by the brilliant ingenuity of some others. So what would you like to see more of, Arthur? No snark. Honest inquiry.
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Post by berkley on Nov 25, 2015 1:33:01 GMT -5
I have to admit myself to being pretty shallow and inconsistent in my votes in the Classic Cover thread: sometimes it's pure nostalgia, sometimes it's the cover think best fits the theme for that week, sometimes it's the one I think looks best, sometimes some other reason altogether, often some combination of all the above, and almost always regardless of artistic merit.
I also have to admit that I am woefully uneducated in art appreciation and thus can make no claims to being able to define artistic merit or even recognise it when I see it (or its absence when it isn't there). I try to make that clear when I comment on art by pointing out exactly what I like or dislike about the image.
What it comes down to for me - and here I'm talking more about comics art in general rather than the contest - is the effect the image has on me, and sometimes that effect can be quite powerful even though the technique may be abysmal. I think comics - and especially the American comic book, as something created on the fly, as it were, on a short deadline - are all about that effect and can often work quite well even when the most basic elements of the craft - anatomy, perspective, lighting, you name it - are, shall we say, a little wonky.
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Post by Icctrombone on Nov 25, 2015 6:25:19 GMT -5
The Classic Cover Contest is disheartingly conservative This doesn't have anything to do with Comic book Characters. It had more to do with the personalities of the forum members.
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Post by DE Sinclair on Nov 25, 2015 9:48:52 GMT -5
Just a suggestion, but maybe we should keep the thread focused on opinions about comic book characters, not opinions regarding our fellow posters.
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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Nov 25, 2015 14:51:28 GMT -5
The Classic Cover Contest is disheartingly conservative I want to understand this comment and why you are disheartened. The "Hall of Fame" showcases numerous pre-Code, Underground, and Independent covers that are juvenile, shocking, and in poor taste.
There is no jury, no monolithic body that selects the winners. I'm utterly baffled by some of the past champions, as much as I am shamed by the brilliant ingenuity of some others. So what would you like to see more of, Arthur? No snark. Honest inquiry.
You are probably right, I'm only a recent member of the boards. I'm just sharing my feelings about the recent contests, where most entres and votes seemed very conservative to me, no biggie. Soe covers seemed to have been chosen mostly for heir historical value rather than artistic of thought provoking (I know that's a big word ), which is what is slightly disheartening to me. By no means is it criticism of individual. Most of the people here I shared with display the kind of versatility I expect from comic book mindfull lovers. So to answer your question, every entry I chose, I try to somewhat provoke my fellow boarders, always with good spirit, and display les sadvertised covers of equal if not higher artistic value then what I quite often consider functional covers Maybe this will explain my POV better (probably not), but for exemple, for all its qualities, I'm mostly baffled to see the original Amazing Spider-man run considered as a high end of the medium. When I first read it in my early 30ies, I was pleasantly surprised by how craftfull it was... for a comic book for kids. And I can definitively enjoy it at that level. But the medium has before and since displayed much higher ambitions and qualities then this, quite obviously so. It's a sidepoint, but maybe one that follows the same interogations I had in that post on a "there I said it" thread, quite cheekingly might I add.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2015 15:07:22 GMT -5
Far be it for me to speak for anyone, but I suspect that Phil is perfectly capable of handling "big words".
See, this is where you and I clash, Arthur. That just came across as very condescending, imo.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2015 15:09:18 GMT -5
Lots of people have different tastes and different standards, AGS, but remember this is a Classic Comics board, so tastes are going to skew towards classic comics, and a large majority of posters are American, so it will skew towards classic American comics, which for a lot of people is the traditional fare of super-heroes and funny animals.
That's neither a good nor a bad thing, it is just what it is. Lots of members have tastes that run a broad gamut, but the central focal point of the boards are classic American comics, so it shouldn't be a surprise when those things take center stage in things like the classic cover contest, because it is the most common shared experience among our members. I am pleasantly surprised when things go outside the box at times, but the box is the common bond that created this place.
-M
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 25, 2015 15:28:28 GMT -5
I wonder if this might not be a translation problem. "Conservative" and "traditional" are related, but not the same, Arthur, and I wonder if you mean the latter rather than the former. "Conservative" can suggest "narrow-minded," while "traditional" and "classic" are more similar.
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Post by Phil Maurice on Nov 25, 2015 16:24:04 GMT -5
I'm just sharing my feelings about the recent contests, where most entres and votes seemed very conservative to me, no biggie. I think I understand what you're saying, Arthur, and I appreciate the reply. I can only speak for myself and if I'm honest, I do tend to respond more favorably to pieces I consider to have historical importance. I do make an effort to broaden my horizons elsewhere on the boards and I've learned a great deal about areas and eras of the medium thanks to the many thoughtful posters here, including you (I think I told you so recently).
I hadn't really considered that I wasn't fully appreciating the merits of, let's say "non-traditional" comics in the cover contest, mainly because it's just a bit of fun. But I see your point, and I'll bear it in mind in the future.
It never hurts to shake things up a little and, believe it or not, I have no trouble whatsoever seeing the value in having folks like you around here.
Apologies to everyone for steering this thread way off-topic. I'll go stand in the corner.
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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Nov 25, 2015 16:54:37 GMT -5
Far be it for me to speak for anyone, but I suspect that Phil is perfectly capable of handling "big words". See, this is where you and I clash, Arthur. That just came across as very condescending, imo. See, that's where we misunderstand each other as the "big word" pun was against myself... And this probably is due to english only being the htird language I learned. A lot of french irony is directed at yourself, if not all of it, that's in our culture.
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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Nov 25, 2015 16:56:05 GMT -5
Lots of people have different tastes and different standards, AGS, but remember this is a Classic Comics board, so tastes are going to skew towards classic comics, and a large majority of posters are American, so it will skew towards classic American comics, which for a lot of people is the traditional fare of super-heroes and funny animals. That's neither a good nor a bad thing, it is just what it is. Lots of members have tastes that run a broad gamut, but the central focal point of the boards are classic American comics, so it shouldn't be a surprise when those things take center stage in things like the classic cover contest, because it is the most common shared experience among our members. I am pleasantly surprised when things go outside the box at times, but the box is the common bond that created this place. -M Fully agree. That's why my post wasn't judgmental on people at all (at least not intentionaly), just a reflection of my personnal appreciation of a trend. Better discuss it then brood about it, no?
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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Nov 25, 2015 17:06:13 GMT -5
I wonder if this might not be a translation problem. "Conservative" and "traditional" are related, but not the same, Arthur, and I wonder if you mean the latter rather than the former. "Conservative" can suggest "narrow-minded," while "traditional" and "classic" are more similar. I guess it's a little bit of both in a way. For me, conservative mostly means reluctant to go outside your comfort zone. Which I understand, the world is mostly like that. I'm conservative myself when I indulge in my reflexes to dismiss most regular superhero titles from the 70ies, because I rarely find it as challenging as the works that made me passionate about the craft in the medium. Yet, sometimes I force myself into it willingly, to various results. Being on those boards is a good way to fight those reflexes as the more you expose yourself to hte "unknown", the more it becomes familiar. I have little to zero interest in Star Wars in general and find the movies painfully juvenile, yet I take great interest in Confessor's thread about the Marvel series and already noticed thanks to it a couple of issues I might want to check myself (I'm a sucker for Al Williamson, as many of us here...)
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Post by Icctrombone on Nov 25, 2015 18:55:40 GMT -5
I never thought the Shazam Captain Marvel was interesting. I was introduced to his world when DC bought him in 1974 (?) and found him to be corny and just can't believe he actually outsold Superman in the 40's.
There. I said it.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Nov 25, 2015 18:58:51 GMT -5
Have you read any of his '40s stuff? Honestly, I don't think the character ever worked since DC bought him. And it's interesting to see how Superman started copying Captain Marvel (who was, to be fair, a copy of SUperman) almost immediately.
(Although I didn't read the '90 series which some people speak very highly of.)
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Post by Pharozonk on Nov 25, 2015 19:00:32 GMT -5
I never thought the Shazam Captain Marvel was interesting. I was introduced to his world when DC bought him in 1974 (?) and found him to be corny and just can't believe he actually outsold Superman in the 40's. There. I said it. Check out the "Power of Shazam" series that Jerry Ordway worked on in the 90's. It's pretty awesome.
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