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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2023 15:50:20 GMT -5
Tape pulls on the cover drive me insane. It's the only thing that stopped me from pulling the trigger on this. I can live with a few creases, tiny bends, a slight cover mis-wrap, but not a friggin' tape pull. Vigoda Betty & Veronica was the best.
There, I wailed about the tape pull (it's by Jughead if you can't immediately spot it)
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Post by Icctrombone on Mar 21, 2023 15:33:05 GMT -5
Tape pulls on the cover drive me insane. It's the only thing that stopped me from pulling the trigger on this. I can live with a few creases, tiny bends, a slight cover mis-wrap, but not a friggin' tape pull. Vigoda Betty & Veronica was the best.
There, I wailed about the tape pull (it's by Jughead if you can't immediately spot it)
They especially hurt when I caused the tape pull.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2023 17:46:36 GMT -5
They especially hurt when I caused the tape pull.
It happens to the best of us. As finicky as I am I got tape on a $50 variant and had to replace it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2023 2:32:14 GMT -5
Panel covers are the best, especially on golden / silver age covers that were larger
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2023 4:10:32 GMT -5
Wild Dog looks like Jason Voorhees
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Post by codystarbuck on Apr 1, 2023 19:20:47 GMT -5
Wild Dog looks like Jason Voorhees
Jason Voorhees didn't need to reload.
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Post by Duragizer on Apr 1, 2023 23:26:52 GMT -5
Wild Dog looks like Jason Voorhees
Methinks he's closer to Lord Humungus.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2023 4:56:23 GMT -5
So in 1987 I'm no longer allowed to have Earth 2, Superboy (including a Legion backstory that made sense), or Supergirl, but I can have Wild Dog instead.
Crisis apologists...THINK about this one is all I'm saying!!!!
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Post by commond on Apr 2, 2023 5:19:10 GMT -5
Is Wild Dog any good? I'm a big fan of Ms. Tree, but haven't heard much talk about WD.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,202
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Post by Confessor on Apr 2, 2023 6:14:01 GMT -5
Is Wild Dog any good? I'm a big fan of Ms. Tree, but haven't heard much talk about WD. I liked it quite a bit at the time, but I didn't hang on to my issues of that mini-series for very long (got rid of them in the 90s). That leads me to believe that it likely didn't age well, as I transitioned into an adult. Wild Dog was one of those vigilante characters, likely inspired somewhat by Marvel's The Punisher. I recall the comic being very much off its time and back then I thought he was very cool with his hockey mask, football jersey and sub-machine gun. It was one of those late 80s grim and gritty comics, and was more "adult" than a lot of DC's superhero fare at the time. I've never had any desire to re-read it though.
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Post by Batflunkie on Apr 2, 2023 8:15:57 GMT -5
Is Wild Dog any good? I'm a big fan of Ms. Tree, but haven't heard much talk about WD. I liked it quite a bit at the time, but I didn't hang on to my issues of that mini-series for very long (got rid of them in the 90s). That leads me to believe that it likely didn't age well, as I transitioned into an adult. Wild Dog was one of those vigilante characters, likely inspired somewhat by Marvel's The Punisher. I recall the comic being very much off its time and back then I thought he was very cool with his hockey mask, football jersey and sub-machine gun. It was one of those late 80s grim and gritty comics, and was more "adult" than a lot of DC's superhero fare at the time. I've never had any desire to re-read it though. The was also the aptly named DC character "Vigilante" which, from what I've heard/read, actually had {Spoiler: Click to show} the main character die and have someone else pick up the mantle
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Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2023 8:36:55 GMT -5
I liked it quite a bit at the time, but I didn't hang on to my issues of that mini-series for very long (got rid of them in the 90s). That leads me to believe that it likely didn't age well, as I transitioned into an adult. Wild Dog was one of those vigilante characters, likely inspired somewhat by Marvel's The Punisher. I recall the comic being very much off its time and back then I thought he was very cool with his hockey mask, football jersey and sub-machine gun. It was one of those late 80s grim and gritty comics, and was more "adult" than a lot of DC's superhero fare at the time. I've never had any desire to re-read it though. The was also the aptly named DC character "Vigilante" which, from what I've heard/read, actually had {Spoiler: Click to show} the main character die and have someone else pick up the mantle I was just thinking about the old Adrian Chase Vigilante series...that was an interesting series back in the day. Wolfman was in top form with the Titans at that point when he started this, and an early series to adopt the Baxter format direct market format. A couple of Alan Moore guest issues as well I recall. Yes, heck of a punchline to Adrian's fate, I was completely shocked at the time.
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 2, 2023 9:11:24 GMT -5
The was also the aptly named DC character "Vigilante" which, from what I've heard/read, actually had {Spoiler: Click to show} the main character die and have someone else pick up the mantle I was just thinking about the old Adrian Chase Vigilante series...that was an interesting series back in the day. Wolfman was in top form with the Titans at that point when he started this, and an early series to adopt the Baxter format direct market format. A couple of Alan Moore guest issues as well I recall. Yes, heck of a punchline to Adrian's fate, I was completely shocked at the time. Is this the only comic to ever end with the character committing suicide?
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Post by MDG on Apr 2, 2023 10:08:39 GMT -5
Is Wild Dog any good? I'm a big fan of Ms. Tree, but haven't heard much talk about WD. I liked it quite a bit at the time, but I didn't hang on to my issues of that mini-series for very long (got rid of them in the 90s). That leads me to believe that it likely didn't age well, as I transitioned into an adult. Wild Dog was one of those vigilante characters, likely inspired somewhat by Marvel's The Punisher. I recall the comic being very much off its time and back then I thought he was very cool with his hockey mask, football jersey and sub-machine gun. It was one of those late 80s grim and gritty comics, and was more "adult" than a lot of DC's superhero fare at the time. I've never had any desire to re-read it though. IIRC Collins said Wild Dog was an attempt to play out a masked vigilante in the "real world." Part of the mini was setting up four possibilities for who he was (so, he had a secret identity). I enjoyed it, but don't remember much about the follow-up in ACW.
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Post by codystarbuck on Apr 2, 2023 11:26:57 GMT -5
Wild Dog was inspired by the success of the Punisher; but, the Punisher was Marvel's attempt to cash in on the popularity of the various urban vigilante men's adventure pulp novels that filled book spinners in 1970s stores. They were put out on a regular basis, with violent stories of Vietnam veterans and rogue cops, murdering criminals because "the system doesn't work." This was the same source as Dirty Harry and Death Wish, in the wake of rampant urban crime, post-Vietnam, the Son of Sam killings, Watergate, and other hysteria and breakdowns. It was also a bit of a Right Wing reaction to Vietnam and the counter-culture, as these guys "get to win," without pansy liberals holding them back. They were filled with testosterone and gunfire, with pretty badly written sex scenes, with women who are either hookers, victims or.......actually, those were about the only roles for women, in those things. Most were pretty bad, though a handful stood out.
The one that started it all was The Executioner. It features Sgt Mack Bolan, US Army, a sniper in Vietnam, who is attached to the Phoenix Program. He receives compassionate leave to come home and bury his parents and sister, and care for his brother, who survived their father shooting the family and killing himself. It turns out that he had taken a loan from a crooked loan company, which was a mob front. The mob then hooked the sister into prostitution, to pay off the debt. When the father finds out, he shoots her, then his wife and son, and finally himself. The son survives, barely. Bolan goes to the loan office to settle the account. He says the debt is paid and shows the payments. They claim interest not in the loan note and try to intimidate him. He returns and kills the mobsters. Then, he goes after the prostitution operation and the main boss, after breaking into a National Guard armory and stealing military weaponry, including a mortar and bombs. He proceeds to blow the hell out of the mobsters mansion and kill all of his goons and him. Bolan then goes on the run, wanted for murder. He continues targeting mob operations, around the country, using stolen mob cash to finance things. In the second novel, he recruits some comrades from Vietnam and creates a "death squad." An ambush goes bad and police capture all but Bolan, who is allowed to escape by a sympathetic cop, Carl Lyons. In the next book, he gets a facelift and continues his war on crime. He acquires a tricked out van, his War Wagon, and under-the-table assistance from an FBI agent. After a few years, the government approaches him about taking things internationally, taking out terrorists. He finishes his war by targeting the major mob centers, in his Last Mile. The last batch of books all featured a title with a day of the week, as he targets a different head, leading to the top man, in the final book.
The publishing line was bought by Gold Eagle, which merged with Harlequin. They produced monthly releases of a new Mack Bolan, The Executioner, where he fights international terrorism, with government sanction. He is aided by Able Team, the former members of his Death Squad, plus Carl Lyons, and Phoenix Force, a quintet of international soldiers who are sent on clandestine missions to take out terrorist cells.
Yeah, I read this stuff when I was a teenager. Its roots are in the pulp heroes of the 30s, especially violent characters like The Spider and Operator 5. The difference is the Vietnam hooks and reactions. In the 70s, it was street and organized crime who were the enemy. By the 80s, it was global terrorism (funded by the Soviet Union and its satellites). It wasn't entirely Right Wing, as Able Team had a series of adventures where they fought El Salvadoran death squads, which were in the news, of the time. The US backed the government of El Salvador and trained the death squads at the School of the Americas, which led to protests from an order of Nuns, whose sisters were killed by the squads.
The other really popular series was The Destroyer. He was Remo Williams, a cop who appears to be murdered, but it was faked. he is given a new face and is trained in Sinanju, the martial art from which all other combat arts evolved, by its Korean Master Chiun. He is then sent out to destroy evil men and organizations, with Chiun's help (when he feels like it). He also runs up against Chiun's corrupt nephew, Niuhc, who is also a master of Sinanju and he and Remo face off in a final death match. It inspired the movie, with Fred Ward, though the movie played it a bit more for laughs, though the series always had a dark satirical tone to it. I read a couple of those.
The rest were things like The Death Merchant, The Penetrator, The Liquidator, The Mercenary, The SOBs (Soldiers of Barabbas), the Black Eagles. They even re-issued old Spider pulp novels, with contemporary covers to make him look like one of the modern vigilantes.
The only other majorly interesting and original character was Casca, the Eternal Mercenary. He was the creation of Barry Sadler, the ex-Green Beret and composer of The Ballad of the Green Berets. Casca is a Roman soldier, who stabs Jesus on the cross, with his javelin. He is cursed to live an endless life, until Jesus returns, a life filled with conflict. Casca is essentially immortal and has drifted from war to war. There was a secret group who know about him and oppose him and other intrigues, which set it apart. Much of its concepts informed the Highlander tv series, except he didn't fight other immortals and cut off their heads.
A lot of the style of the books were borrowed from both the pulps and hard boiled detective and crime fiction, which is right up Max Allen Collins' alley. I never cared for any fo the comic versions and Wild Dog and Vigilante least of all. Vigilante started well, in the New Teen Titans annual; but, I didn't care for the series, when it started, though the art was a large part of that. Wild Dog just never did anything for me.
Thankfully, I outgrew that stuff, by college. It helped that the plots are pretty much the same and you grow tired of them, after a while. I moved on to better reading, though I did, for several years, hand on to the first few Executioners and the Last Mile finale. I never did get around to reading Casca and they are long out of print and go for pricey amounts these days. I did acquire a pdf of the first one, but haven't read it yet.
The Punisher was such a carbon copy of the Executioner I suspect Marvel got in a bit of hot water. However, Marvel Preview #2, which features the Origin of the Punisher (which is pretty much the Executioner's origin, except an ambush, in a park and not a loan shark-related domestic killing), has an interview with Don Pendleton, the creator of Mack Bolan. They must have worked out some kind of deal, or else the publisher was too afraid of counter-suits, with all of the copying going on in these various books. The Punisher eventually acquires a war wagon and keeps a journal, like Bolan, is an ex-sniper and veteran of Vietnam (and AWOL), etc, etc. Mack Bolan just didn't face off against Captain America. Later, Innovation had a Mack Bolan series, but it was interrupted by their bankruptcy. IDW did a 5 issue mini, in 2008.
The Executioner series was optioned several times for movies, with Burt Reynolds potentially involved in one and Mel Gibson in another (or at least his name thrown around). Nothing ever came of them.
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