|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Nov 7, 2023 22:40:59 GMT -5
Marvel's magazines were primarily black & white, like Warren's, to hold the cost down. Martin Goodman had a long history in doing men's adventure pulp magazines, the "men's sweat" magazines, with two-fisted, square jaw heroes, lots od sadistic villains, scantily clad women and at least implied sex. Most of the comic magazines were tying to compete for Warren's audience; but, every once in a while, they tried to captue that men's adventue audience. Starting in the late 60s, a new market up pulp adventure novels sprung up, with Don Pendleton's The Executioner leading the charge. It, especially, and most of the rest, were a conservative reaction to Vietnam and the hippy movement, presenting vigilante justice, particularly Mack Bolan, a Vietnam vet who gets to win his war. The Punisher was a deliberate carbon copy of Bolan and Marvel Preview #2 and Marvel Super Action #1 were attempts at showcasing that character. Marvel Preview even includes an interview with Bolan creator Pendleton, probably after some settlement to keep him from suing. Both magazines also featured Howard Chaykin's superior feature, Dominic Fortune, a sort of redrafting of his Atlas/Seaboard series, The Scorpion. Marvel tried to tap this market on more than one occasion and Savage Tales was probably their best effort at that. Later, in the 1980s, they revived Savage Tales, intending it to cater to this market, with features like Doug Murray and Michael Golden's The 5th to the 1st stories, about soldiers in Vietnam, which was a sort of pilot for what would become The Nam. They also published a couple of USS Stevens stories, from Sam Glanzman, which led to them publishing A Sailor's Story, his memoir of serving on the USS Stevens, in WW2.
As far as the art goes, I think Tony Dezuniga does a fine job. Where I think the feature falters is in Gerry Conway's cliched writing and its blatant copies of Mack Bolan, The Executioner, but he made the character devoid of any real personality (not that Bolan had much, but his supporting cast and various love interests usually made up for it).
It all pales in comparison to the Dominic Fortune stories, where Chaykin unleashes swashbuckling action and Hollywood glitz, alongside his usual urban adventure and cynicism, plus the writing of Denny O'Neil, which helps flesh out Fortune's personality and his love interest, Sabbath Raven.
Marvel Super Action came about because they had the Punisher and Dominic Fortune stories and needed a home, plus the addition of the Huntress story (Bobbi Morse, the future Mockingbird, in her earlier costumed role, as a rogue SHIELD agent). That feature was trying for a Modesty Blaise vibe, which was being featured in some newspapers and successful paperback series, and a couple attempts at movies and tv series.
|
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Nov 7, 2023 22:43:13 GMT -5
ps Marvel also later published a Destroyer magazine, based on the pulp series by Warren Murphy and Richard Sapir, which spawned the film Remo Williams, The Adventure Begins.  |
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Nov 8, 2023 0:08:01 GMT -5
I don't think I ever knew Marvel did a Destroyer magazine. Was it a movie tie-in? How was the creative team? I enjoyed the two or three I read as a kid in the '70s.
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2023 2:37:11 GMT -5
This slab is so bittersweet
It's a yellow-label slab meaning the signatures were verified by CBCS (CGC's biggest rival) and the signatures were Joe Shuster and Jerry Seigel
But they were signed on the 1st page inside the comic, not the cover, so you can't see squat unless you crack it open. Which will then void the verification.
Well at least you can see the yellow label that says so.
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,220 
Member is Online
|
Post by Confessor on Nov 8, 2023 8:45:00 GMT -5
This slab is so bittersweet It's a yellow-label slab meaning the signatures were verified by CBCS (CGC's biggest rival) and the signatures were Joe Shuster and Jerry Seigel
But they were signed on the 1st page inside the comic, not the cover, so you can't see squat unless you crack it open. Which will then void the verification. But, isn't that the inherent problem with slabbed books in a nutshell? You can't see inside them to access all the wonder that they contain. |
|
|
|
Post by tonebone on Nov 8, 2023 9:18:49 GMT -5
This slab is so bittersweet It's a yellow-label slab meaning the signatures were verified by CBCS (CGC's biggest rival) and the signatures were Joe Shuster and Jerry Seigel
But they were signed on the 1st page inside the comic, not the cover, so you can't see squat unless you crack it open. Which will then void the verification. But, isn't that the inherent problem with slabbed books in a nutshell? You can't see inside them to access all the wonder that they contain. I've wondered if slabbing books, especially really old ones, is detrimental to their preservation... has anyone done any studies to determine what the effect on newsprint paper is to seal it in an airtight container? Or new comics that are still off-gassing the printing ink fumes, sealed in a slab? |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2023 9:29:30 GMT -5
But, isn't that the inherent problem with slabbed books in a nutshell? You can't see inside them to access all the wonder that they contain.
Technically you can by just opening the slab, if access is a motivating factor. It voids the grade but that's usually not a concern to someone who'd rather have full access to it.
I know people who buy slabbed Golden Age books, simply to have assurance that the book inside is genuine and thoroughly checked for flaws, restoration etc. Then they open them to enjoy them.
The book above boasts signatures though, if they were on the cover, it would be so much better.
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,220
Member is Online
|
Post by Confessor on Nov 8, 2023 10:57:07 GMT -5
I've wondered if slabbing books, especially really old ones, is detrimental to their preservation... has anyone done any studies to determine what the effect on newsprint paper is to seal it in an airtight container? Or new comics that are still off-gassing the printing ink fumes, sealed in a slab? That's a very good point. It'd be interesting to hear what a professional museum book and paper archivist's thoughts were on slabbed comics. But, isn't that the inherent problem with slabbed books in a nutshell? You can't see inside them to access all the wonder that they contain. Technically you can by just opening the slab, if access is a motivating factor. It voids the grade but that's usually not a concern to someone who'd rather have full access to it. Sure, technically you could do that. But honestly, what would the point be in either paying to have it slabbed in the first place or paying a premium for a slabbed copy? If you want to read the thing, then surely it's best to buy it unslabbed? The practice of slabbing comics is completely counter to the hobby of reading those same comic books and clearly not what the slabbing process is intended for. I know people who buy slabbed Golden Age books, simply to have assurance that the book inside is genuine and thoroughly checked for flaws, restoration etc. Then they open them to enjoy them. I can see the rationale behind doing that, especially with more valuable GA comics, but I find it hard to believe that this is a very common practice. Surely the vast majority of people who pay to have their comics slabbed or buy slabbed comics intend to leave them in the plastic shell? I mean, that's kind of the accepted practice with slabbed comics. Thing is, I get that if you have a particularly rare and sought after comic -- and I'm talking things like Action Comics #1, Detective Comics #27, Marvel Comics #1, Fantastic Four #1 or similar -- realistically the sheer value of the item would mean that you need to make sure that it is properly protected and properly valued. But other than that, I'm not not sure what the point of having books slabbed is really? Unless you're a seller and want to charge more money for them. To me, as a reader of comic books, slabbed comics are kinda like a tasty burger that you can never eat or a nice guitar you can never strum. I guess I'm just not a natural born slabber.  |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2023 11:08:21 GMT -5
I can see the rationale behind doing that, especially with more valuable GA comics, but I find it hard to believe that this is a very common practice. Surely the vast majority of people who pay to have their comics slabbed intend to leave them in the plastic shell? I mean, that's kind of the accepted practice with slabbed comics.
Many slabbed books also end up on the market to be sold. Ebay is awash with them. There are many occassions when there is not much price differential between slabbed and raw, especially for books graded less than FN or 6.0. I have also purchased NM CGCs which were being sold for the same price or less than a raw copy, it might not be the norm but it happens especially when someone wants a quick sale. Over at Mile High they regularly buy slabbed books and pay less than the slabbing fee, essentially getting the book for free.
So it's not uncommon for buyers to seek out a slabbed copy simply to crack them open after, it has the advantage of being scrutinised to make sure its original integrity is intact. No nasty surprises inside like a staple pop, filled crossword, clipped coupon, colour-touch etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by impulse on Nov 8, 2023 11:17:20 GMT -5
What does it cost to slab a book, anyway? And how long does it take?
|
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Nov 8, 2023 11:57:27 GMT -5
I don't think I ever knew Marvel did a Destroyer magazine. Was it a movie tie-in? How was the creative team? I enjoyed the two or three I read as a kid in the '70s. It came out in 1989, 4 years after the film. If it was meant to be a tie-in, it took a long time to get there. I don't think it was intended as a film tie-in; but, was part of Marvel trying to find compatible properties with the Punisher to aim at that men's adventure market and flood the stands. There were 9 magazine issues, all in black & white, with painted covers. The covers were great, with people like Joe Jusko, Earl Norem and Dorian Vallejo. The interiors were done by several artists, with Lee Weeks doing more issues than anyone else. Mike Manly did a story, Tom Morgan, Don Perlin, Carmine Infantino, and Rik Levins. Will murray was the writer and he kept the tone consistent with the novels and had experience writing pulp adventures (Doc Savage and the Destroyer series, where he was the exclusive author, from books 74 to 107). In 1991, Marvel reprinted some of the magazine stories as a color, 4-issue mini-series. Here are some samples.....    ___________  and typical ads, from the rear cover of the magazine.....   Murray's stories were good; but, with the rotating artists, it lacked a consistency.. The Lee Weeks issues are the best; but, the others were good and they could handle something that needed more realistic art than superheroes. It was a good attempt; but, they really needed a regular artist to do something with it,; someone in synch with Murray. Weeks would have been great, if he drew every issue, as he adds a sort of Gulacy cinematic touch to it. Marvel's production people could have done a better job with the black & white and needed to take lessons from Dark Horse. Some of the backgrounds look a little flat and they could have used greytones better. |
|
|
|
Post by MDG on Nov 8, 2023 12:33:03 GMT -5
I've wondered if slabbing books, especially really old ones, is detrimental to their preservation... has anyone done any studies to determine what the effect on newsprint paper is to seal it in an airtight container? Or new comics that are still off-gassing the printing ink fumes, sealed in a slab? That's a very good point. It'd be interesting to hear what a professional museum book and paper archivist's thoughts were on slabbed comics. A big difference is that museums and archives are all about preserving materials but still making them accessible, so I don't think there are things comparable with "permanent" slabbing.
On the other hand, you better be wearing gloves when you're readin' those funnybooks!
|
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Nov 8, 2023 15:26:05 GMT -5
That's a very good point. It'd be interesting to hear what a professional museum book and paper archivist's thoughts were on slabbed comics. A big difference is that museums and archives are all about preserving materials but still making them accessible, so I don't think there are things comparable with "permanent" slabbing.
On the other hand, you better be wearing gloves when you're readin' those funnybooks!
Preferably big, heavy gauntlets....... ......and a cape! |
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 8, 2023 16:03:10 GMT -5
That's a very good point. It'd be interesting to hear what a professional museum book and paper archivist's thoughts were on slabbed comics. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2023 21:11:18 GMT -5
The MCU may have propelled him to the forefront, but Thanos has nothin' on these guys IMO:  |
|
