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Post by tingramretro on May 2, 2016 1:15:44 GMT -5
Booster and Beetle are no longer millionaires at this point. Both of them lost their own books in the wake of Millennium and both of them ended up broke at the end of their book's runs. Thanks for explaining this. Would have been nice for Helfer to be similarly courteous. Well, since their financial status in their own books had never really impacted on JI and since anyone who cared would in all probability have been buying their solo titles before their cancellation anyway, I guess it wasn't considered a priority. They were, after all, writing the books for the readership around at the time, many if not most) of whom would have been keeping up with events elsewhere in DC's line as they actually happened, rather than thinking of a hypothetical reader looking at one title on its own thirty years later. |
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Post by tingramretro on May 2, 2016 1:17:06 GMT -5
Our next trip outside the main JLI book looks to be Secret Origins #32-35. Ah, more books for me to buy... In tbe case of that series, it's worth it! |
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Post by shaxper on May 2, 2016 11:39:22 GMT -5
Thanks for explaining this. Would have been nice for Helfer to be similarly courteous. They were, after all, writing the books for the readership around at the time, many if not most) of whom would have been keeping up with events elsewhere in DC's line as they actually happened, rather than thinking of a hypothetical reader looking at one title on its own thirty years later. Comparing JLI's sales with those of Blue Beetle and Booster Gold, it's safe to assume a lot of folks were reading one and not the others. And the JLI had recently gone on an adventure where Ted Kord being the CEO of a major multi-national company was integral to the plot. So I'm not letting Helfer off so easily. |
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Post by tingramretro on May 2, 2016 16:48:12 GMT -5
Poor old Andy. He was just trying to entertain...
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Post by dupersuper on May 3, 2016 20:14:09 GMT -5
They were, after all, writing the books for the readership around at the time, many if not most) of whom would have been keeping up with events elsewhere in DC's line as they actually happened, rather than thinking of a hypothetical reader looking at one title on its own thirty years later. Comparing JLI's sales with those of Blue Beetle and Booster Gold, it's safe to assume a lot of folks were reading one and not the others. And the JLI had recently gone on an adventure where Ted Kord being the CEO of a major multi-national company was integral to the plot. So I'm not letting Helfer off so easily. As much as I love editors notes for specific issues (so handy when back-issue hunting), when reading a book in a shared universe, especially a team book whose members have/have had their own titles, one must be prepared to infer from context. |
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Post by shaxper on May 3, 2016 20:18:08 GMT -5
Comparing JLI's sales with those of Blue Beetle and Booster Gold, it's safe to assume a lot of folks were reading one and not the others. And the JLI had recently gone on an adventure where Ted Kord being the CEO of a major multi-national company was integral to the plot. So I'm not letting Helfer off so easily. As much as I love editors notes for specific issues (so handy when back-issue hunting), when reading a book in a shared universe, especially a team book whose members have/have had their own titles, one must be prepared to infer from context. I infer from context that Helfer usually just isn't paying attention to what's happening in the solo books. Where's Skeets? Why does Batman have time to do monitor duty, and where's Robin? Thus, when Booster and Beetle announce that they are broke, there's no reason for me to infer this is because of something that happened in other books most people weren't reading (thus the cancellations). Seems like just another example of carelessness unless we're told otherwise. |
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Post by dupersuper on May 3, 2016 20:23:25 GMT -5
Poor old Andy. He was just trying to entertain... |
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Post by shaxper on May 3, 2016 20:39:08 GMT -5
Poor old Andy. He was just trying to entertain...  |
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Post by Action Ace on May 3, 2016 20:44:41 GMT -5
As much as I love editors notes for specific issues (so handy when back-issue hunting), when reading a book in a shared universe, especially a team book whose members have/have had their own titles, one must be prepared to infer from context. I infer from context that Helfer usually just isn't paying attention to what's happening in the solo books. Where's Skeets? Why does Batman have time to do monitor duty, and where's Robin? Thus, when Booster and Beetle announce that they are broke, there's no reason for me to infer this is because of something that happened in other books most people weren't reading (thus the cancellations). Seems like just another example of carelessness unless we're told otherwise. I'd like to thank Geoff Johns and the rest of the Justice League team for ignoring what's been going on in the Superman and Batman titles in the last year. I wish Grant Morrison had been able to ignore Electric Blue Superman when that nonsense was going on. |
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Post by tingramretro on May 4, 2016 1:46:20 GMT -5
As much as I love editors notes for specific issues (so handy when back-issue hunting), when reading a book in a shared universe, especially a team book whose members have/have had their own titles, one must be prepared to infer from context. I infer from context that Helfer usually just isn't paying attention to what's happening in the solo books. Where's Skeets? Why does Batman have time to do monitor duty, and where's Robin? Thus, when Booster and Beetle announce that they are broke, there's no reason for me to infer this is because of something that happened in other books most people weren't reading (thus the cancellations). Seems like just another example of carelessness unless we're told otherwise. So you're saying it's carelessness if events in JLI don't reflect events in other books, and it's also carelessness if they do? |
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Post by shaxper on May 4, 2016 9:44:06 GMT -5
I infer from context that Helfer usually just isn't paying attention to what's happening in the solo books. Where's Skeets? Why does Batman have time to do monitor duty, and where's Robin? Thus, when Booster and Beetle announce that they are broke, there's no reason for me to infer this is because of something that happened in other books most people weren't reading (thus the cancellations). Seems like just another example of carelessness unless we're told otherwise. So you're saying it's carelessness if events in JLI don't reflect events in other books, and it's also carelessness if they do? Not at all. Ideally, there should be inter-title continuity, and it should be clarified via editorial boxes when necessary, but, since Helfer's JL office has a tradition of not adhering to inter-title continuity, it's natural to assume that was what was occurring in this circumstance since Helfer didn't bother to provide a clarifying editorial box. I don't think the ideal is to ignore out of title continuity, and I also don't think the ideal is to adhere to it without offering guidance/explanation for those not following the other titles. Jim Shooter had the idea while at Marvel that continuity should matter and that any reader should be able to pick up any given issue of any given book and immediately understand what the heck has been going on. He wasn't a perfect editor by a longshot, but I fully support that idea. |
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Post by tingramretro on May 4, 2016 11:32:10 GMT -5
So you're saying it's carelessness if events in JLI don't reflect events in other books, and it's also carelessness if they do? Not at all. Ideally, there should be inter-title continuity, and it should be clarified via editorial boxes when necessary, but, since Helfer's JL office has a tradition of not adhering to inter-title continuity, it's natural to assume that was what was occurring in this circumstance since Helfer didn't bother to provide a clarifying editorial box. I don't think the ideal is to ignore out of title continuity, and I also don't think the ideal is to adhere to it without offering guidance/explanation for those not following the other titles. Jim Shooter had the idea while at Marvel that continuity should matter and that any reader should be able to pick up any given issue of any given book and immediately understand what the heck has been going on. He wasn't a perfect editor by a longshot, but I fully support that idea. I suppose I can see that. As I recall, it just seemed to make sense to me at the time, as I had also been buying Booster and Beetle's solo books. I think there tended to be closer continuity between the more minor DC titles than the ones with the bigger characters, at the time. So events in Booster Gold were more likely to be referenced in JLI or wherever than events in Superman. |
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Post by shaxper on May 4, 2016 11:40:54 GMT -5
Not at all. Ideally, there should be inter-title continuity, and it should be clarified via editorial boxes when necessary, but, since Helfer's JL office has a tradition of not adhering to inter-title continuity, it's natural to assume that was what was occurring in this circumstance since Helfer didn't bother to provide a clarifying editorial box. I don't think the ideal is to ignore out of title continuity, and I also don't think the ideal is to adhere to it without offering guidance/explanation for those not following the other titles. Jim Shooter had the idea while at Marvel that continuity should matter and that any reader should be able to pick up any given issue of any given book and immediately understand what the heck has been going on. He wasn't a perfect editor by a longshot, but I fully support that idea. I suppose I can see that. As I recall, it just seemed to make sense to me at the time, as I had also been buying Booster and Beetle's solo books. I think there tended to be closer continuity between the more minor DC titles than the ones with the bigger characters, at the time. So events in Booster Gold were more likely to be referenced in JLI or wherever than events in Superman. Except for Skeets. |
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Post by tingramretro on May 4, 2016 13:13:02 GMT -5
I suppose I can see that. As I recall, it just seemed to make sense to me at the time, as I had also been buying Booster and Beetle's solo books. I think there tended to be closer continuity between the more minor DC titles than the ones with the bigger characters, at the time. So events in Booster Gold were more likely to be referenced in JLI or wherever than events in Superman. Except for Skeets. Hah! Yes, he was the one glaring ommission, for me. Though I can kind of see why the JLI team wouldn't have wanted him around, he'd have upset the team dynamic, I think. |
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Post by wildfire2099 on May 4, 2016 18:34:14 GMT -5
I'm with Shax on this... that's the sort of thing that bugs me. Continuity is IMPORTANT. Yes, you can have a good story without it, but if you don't bother, yet use shared universe characters, what's the point? The Skeets thing is a good example... one panel where someone asks where he is, and Booster says, and it's all set. Or Maxwell Lord telling him to leave him at home when he gets recruit... a small thing, but SO helpful.
It's funny, I remember alot of the scenes Shax posted, but have no recollection of the Joker being involved. I definitely remember being confused about Blue and Gold's money issues... it seemed like they had them only when it was convienent.
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