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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 7:15:16 GMT -5
Near as I can tell, the earliest price guide of any sort is the Argosy Price guide, specific to a store located in the Hollywood area that sold nationwide through mail order, which appeared in 1965 (predating Overstreet by 5 years). I've never seen a copy in person, but form what I can tell from excerpts & scans of the item for auctions (it can sell for close to $2 grand now itself) it already mad ea distinction for prices of mint condition vs. lesser condition, so it seems to have been a part of the hobby of comic collecting (as opposed to reading comics) from the very earliest period. I thin k a lot of aspects of collecting hobbies, comics included here, took their cues from stamp collecting and coin collecting where condition and grading have always been of primary importance. So I would say there has never been a time where comic collecting has been free of grading and condition concerns. Not that every collector was focused on it, but it was one of the pillars on which the logistics of the hobby itself was built. -M Nice, had never seen this before. I suppose in 1965 it must have been very difficult to list every single comic book with no internet to research from. The $5 price tag seems high at first glance, but probably worth it for collector's and dealers at the time since it would have been their ONLY resource for the hobby.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 8:02:46 GMT -5
As to the $5 price for the catalog, well I am not sure if Argosy did this, but I remember seeing a lot of the ads in 70s comics for back issue catalogs and such that charged for them (usually less than $5) but it was refunded with first order or partially so, so the price was to cover the making and shipping of the catalog, but those that actually did business (and not just got the catalog with no future business resulting) did not end up paying full price (or anything) for the catalog.
So yes $5 was a lot in 1965, but there may have been more to it in the details.
-M
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 8:10:55 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with grading. Slabbing, on the other hand... I see nothing wrong with slabbing. It is for a specific type of collecting, though, but I have slabbed books. And for their age, their price, and their grade, I'd rather have them slabbed than not slabbed. Especially since I have access to the story by other means for reading.
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Post by tingramretro on Jan 24, 2016 8:43:28 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with grading. Slabbing, on the other hand... One is the logical conclusion of the other. There is nothing "logical" about permanently sealing a magazine designed to be read inside a plastic shell where you can't open it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 8:45:51 GMT -5
One is the logical conclusion of the other. There is nothing "logical" about permanently sealing a magazine designed to be read inside a plastic shell where you can't open it. But that's where you are wrong: You CAN always open it. Slabbing doesn't have to be permanent. And the owner of a slabbed book will ALWAYS have that option.
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Post by Nowhere Man on Jan 24, 2016 8:56:36 GMT -5
There is nothing logical about collecting and said collectibles being worth millions of dollars when you get right down to it. People decide that Action Comics #1 is worth millions because it has historical significance as an object. Okay, I get it, but fundamentally it's still a collection of paper that cost cents to produce. I completely understand people of moderate means stumbling over an issue of Action #1 or Detective #27 and selling them for a fortune, but I'll never be able to understand the mentality of people, even though they have vast resources, who would spend that much money for something like that. It becomes about the object itself and not the content and characters, which is problematic to me.
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Post by tingramretro on Jan 24, 2016 9:01:28 GMT -5
There is nothing "logical" about permanently sealing a magazine designed to be read inside a plastic shell where you can't open it. But that's where you are wrong: You CAN always open it. Slabbing doesn't have to be permanent. And the owner of a slabbed book will ALWAYS have that option. And opening it will instantly devalue it, so either way you look at it, you've wasted a lot of money.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 9:06:02 GMT -5
There is nothing logical about collecting and said collectibles being worth millions of dollars when you get right down to it. People decide that Action Comics #1 is worth millions because it has historical significance as an object. Okay, I get it, but fundamentally it's still a collection of paper that cost cents to produce. I completely understand people of moderate means stumbling over an issue of Action #1 or Detective #27 and selling them for a fortune, but I'll never be able to understand the mentality of people, even though they have vast resources, who would spend that much money for something like that. It becomes about the object itself and not the content and characters, which is problematic to me. You don't have to understand it, though, without judging folks. I haven't spent thousands yet on a singular slabbed book. But I have spent hundreds, and that's my decision. If you find that problematic, well, then I find THAT problematic. Don't like it, then don't do it. Then you can continue to live your life as happily as you wish knowing that's one less problematic problem you have to concern yourself with.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 9:11:06 GMT -5
But that's where you are wrong: You CAN always open it. Slabbing doesn't have to be permanent. And the owner of a slabbed book will ALWAYS have that option. And opening it will instantly devalue it, so either way you look at it, you've wasted a lot of money. And? Some people make that choice. You don't have to understand it because you don't collect that way. I just find it funny that people get their panties wadded enough over this subject that there are at least 2-3 threads on this subject here. I find it a devalue of your precious time to even form an opinion over this subject matter enough that you have to state your opinion over and over again as if you are going to convince this type of collector NOT to collect this way. Do what makes you happy and read an unslabbed book and enjoy your life.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 9:14:16 GMT -5
One is the logical conclusion of the other. There is nothing "logical" about permanently sealing a magazine designed to be read inside a plastic shell where you can't open it. There's also no logic in saving a periodical to be read again later, it was intended to be read and disposed of, yet you hang on to periodicals after you read them don't you, despite that not being their intended use? Periodicals are disposable products so if you use them as intended why aren't you throwing them way after you read them or recycling the paper? There is no logic in sealing documents that are meant to be read either, but libraries and museums do it all the time. Same with clothes meant to be worn or vessels meant to be drunk out of or eaten off of or weapons intended to be used to kill someone or whatever-at some point things transition from their intended use to become artifacts of a time/era/culture and are preserved as such. No one hands out something like the actual Declaration of Independence to read or a Guttenberg bible, people use scans/photographs/reproductions of them to read even though the document//book itself was created with the intention of it being read. Now comics are certainly not in that class of item, but some are making the transition from their original function to a new one. Not every comic should be slabbed for certain, and I think there might be better preservation methods than slabbing for certain, but I don't get upset when someone wants to use something different from the way I prefer to use it. I have no interest in slabbed books myself, and prefer inexpensive reading copies of material or collections of reproductions myself, but hey to each their own. I don't see someone else slabbing a book or buying a slabbed book as personally pissing in my Cheerios. Collecting something inevitably leads to people wanting to preserve it. The next step after collecting is conservation, not usage. Once people started collecting comics (and that predates most but not all of us here's first introduction to comics) the logical progression is conservation for commercial purposes. Not everyone engages with comics as a collector, but not everyone engages with them as reading material either. Nature of the beast once something becomes collected. -M
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 9:39:46 GMT -5
There is nothing logical about collecting and said collectibles being worth millions of dollars when you get right down to it. People decide that Action Comics #1 is worth millions because it has historical significance as an object. Okay, I get it, but fundamentally it's still a collection of paper that cost cents to produce. I completely understand people of moderate means stumbling over an issue of Action #1 or Detective #27 and selling them for a fortune, but I'll never be able to understand the mentality of people, even though they have vast resources, who would spend that much money for something like that. It becomes about the object itself and not the content and characters, which is problematic to me. Well, Action Comics #1 is worth a fortune because of it's rarity, supply & demand as well as the historical significance. I do agree with you though, the absurdity of anyone paying over a million dollars for a comic book makes little sense. It is sad when you think about it, I mean how many lives could have been saved with 1 million dollars versus some rich fan cow adding a single comic book to his collection??
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 9:49:15 GMT -5
This again?
There is nothing wrong with someone having a book slabbed. You can agree or disagree. It is their personal preference. You may not agree but then so what? If it's a book from the Golden Age and there aren't many copies in that condition than yeah I would totally have it slabbed. I can always read it in another form.
I don't understand it when people get all upset and must make ANOTHER thread dealing with stabbing.
It's that's person's choice and I don't see how it's any of your concern what they do with the book.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 9:58:18 GMT -5
There is nothing "logical" about permanently sealing a magazine designed to be read inside a plastic shell where you can't open it. Incorrect. If you, for example, got a slabbed book, you can open it and remove the book. The grade becomes nullified but that's of no consequence to anti-slabbing dissidents, you still have the comic and can read it all you like.
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Post by Trevor on Jan 24, 2016 10:03:13 GMT -5
This again? There is nothing wrong with someone having a book slabbed. You can agree or disagree. It is their personal preference. You may not agree but then so what? If it's a book from the Golden Age and there aren't many copies in that condition than yeah I would totally have it slabbed. I can always read it in another form. I don't understand it when people get all upset and must make ANOTHER thread dealing with stabbing. It's that's person's choice and I don't see how it's any of your concern what they do with the book. Hey now! I didn't create a thread about slabbing! I don't even say that word. Ni!
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Post by Nowhere Man on Jan 24, 2016 10:05:25 GMT -5
There is nothing logical about collecting and said collectibles being worth millions of dollars when you get right down to it. People decide that Action Comics #1 is worth millions because it has historical significance as an object. Okay, I get it, but fundamentally it's still a collection of paper that cost cents to produce. I completely understand people of moderate means stumbling over an issue of Action #1 or Detective #27 and selling them for a fortune, but I'll never be able to understand the mentality of people, even though they have vast resources, who would spend that much money for something like that. It becomes about the object itself and not the content and characters, which is problematic to me. You don't have to understand it, though, without judging folks. I haven't spent thousands yet on a singular slabbed book. But I have spent hundreds, and that's my decision. If you find that problematic, well, then I find THAT problematic. Don't like it, then don't do it. Then you can continue to live your life as happily as you wish knowing that's one less problematic problem you have to concern yourself with. Shouldn't you only find it problematic if I get really obnoxious and start picketing comic shops in a protest of slabbed books? I have no problem with people who read a slabbed book, or buy one to read and one to slab. The only real problem I have is with pure speculators; the kind that never read any of the comics and simply slab them and store them away as investments. And I mean those that literally never read ANYTHING and have zero interest in comics as an artform. Obviously, they have every right to do this. It's perfectly legal. It's just the anti-content/art aspect of it that I find personally distasteful.
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