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Post by Slam_Bradley on May 1, 2016 21:10:08 GMT -5
Actually there's a perfectly good explanation of how Grundy is characterized in this book. It will be addressed later, but it explains the how different Grundy had been characterized over the years. I don't have a problem with changes per se. But I have a feeling that any explanation that includes a Solomon Grundy that can be quickly overcome by three Clockwork Orange thugs with the new Mist's fancy weed-killer is probably not going to work for me. If Robinson didn't want to use Solomon Grundy, he should have come up with a new character. The Solomon Grundy in the early issues of Starman is just not very interesting. He wanted to use Grundy. He wanted to use Grundy so he could explain the fact that his personality and his power levels dramatically from appearance to appearance. It may not work for you, but it was interesting and worked for me.
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Post by Hoosier X on May 1, 2016 21:25:00 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with changes per se. But I have a feeling that any explanation that includes a Solomon Grundy that can be quickly overcome by three Clockwork Orange thugs with the new Mist's fancy weed-killer is probably not going to work for me. If Robinson didn't want to use Solomon Grundy, he should have come up with a new character. The Solomon Grundy in the early issues of Starman is just not very interesting. He wanted to use Grundy. He wanted to use Grundy so he could explain the fact that his personality and his power levels dramatically from appearance to appearance. It may not work for you, but it was interesting and worked for me. I'd be a lot more willing to give it a chance if Robinson had done anything I found interesting with Solomon Grundy in the Starman issues I've read so far. And to be honest, I've never really noticed Solomon Grundy's powers and personality varying all that much, aside from the usual comic book stuff.
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Post by Action Ace on May 1, 2016 22:58:34 GMT -5
Read the Star Wars Epic for the Dark Horse Rogue Squadron series... definitely made me nostalgic for the old Star Wars continuity. Nothing totally exceptional, but some fun stories that definitely have the proper 'Star Wars' feel. What are some of the better Star Wars comics Dark Horse did? I have access to a bunch, but a lot are...dire. Kind of enjoying Legacy(?) the Ostrander/Durseema stuff, though the coloring in those is heavy handed, and want to read more but have no idea which are good or not.
I pretty much confine my purchases to the Classic Era. Their first foray, Dark Empire, was satisfactory. The sequel wasn't quite as good. I liked the Bondish character, Jahan Cross, in the two Agent of the Empire mini series. My favorite Dark Horse series was the last one by Brian Wood that went 20 issues. The Rebel Heist was a four issue mini series at the end I liked as well. Then there is the original The Star Wars. It has good art, but I'd recommend for historical purposes only. The one in the forum to talk to would be Confessor, you can usually find him in the Marvel Star Wars review thread.
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Post by wildfire2099 on May 2, 2016 6:11:55 GMT -5
Read the Star Wars Epic for the Dark Horse Rogue Squadron series... definitely made me nostalgic for the old Star Wars continuity. Nothing totally exceptional, but some fun stories that definitely have the proper 'Star Wars' feel. What are some of the better Star Wars comics Dark Horse did? I have access to a bunch, but a lot are...dire. Kind of enjoying Legacy(?) the Ostrander/Durseema stuff, though the coloring in those is heavy handed, and want to read more but have no idea which are good or not.
I'd say anything by Ostrander is good... there's the Tales of the Jedi stuff, and then they go back even further to the foundation of the Jedi Order. Those mostly all mini series, and take some effort to sort out. The first Dark Horse series just titled 'Star Wars' is mostly Clone Wars era.. it stars with Kai Ai Mundi as the star, then move to QUinlan Vos and his Padawan, both of which are excellent. The series later splits into two...'Republic' (which continues along that vein' and 'Empire' which focuses on the Empire during the original trilogy. I also liked Crimson Empire alot, which was about an Imperial Guard who ends up being a good guy.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
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Post by Confessor on May 2, 2016 6:31:43 GMT -5
Read the Star Wars Epic for the Dark Horse Rogue Squadron series... definitely made me nostalgic for the old Star Wars continuity. Nothing totally exceptional, but some fun stories that definitely have the proper 'Star Wars' feel. What are some of the better Star Wars comics Dark Horse did? I have access to a bunch, but a lot are...dire. Kind of enjoying Legacy(?) the Ostrander/Durseema stuff, though the coloring in those is heavy handed, and want to read more but have no idea which are good or not.
It's all personal opinion, of course, but for my money, the best of Dark Horse's SW stuff includes the Dark Empire trilogy (Dark Empire I and II + Empire's End), the three Crimson Empire mini-series, the 40 issue Empire series and, perhaps best of all, Dark Times. The latter series actually began in the last few issues of Star Wars: Republic before being turned into it's own series. Set in the aftermath of Order 66 and the events of Revenge of the Sith, Dark Times comes highly recommended.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on May 2, 2016 7:58:58 GMT -5
Inspired by Reptisaurus's new review thread, I took a look at Hudlin and Romita Jr. 's Black Panther #1 that's currently available for free with the Marvel Unlimited App.
General impression : extremely good. The art looks beautiful, Wakanda is exotic and the colour work is lovely. Romita's idiosyncratic style suits the half-realistic, half-mystical nature of the Black Panther mythos.
Hudlin's story is engaging, even if it's all set-up (we don't even see T'Challa in this issue). The concept of an African country that developed advanced technology centuries before all other nations on Earth and used it to resist any and all would-be conquerors is rife with story potential, and used here to great effect.
It is somewhat surprising to see characters in this book use grossly racist slurs; that's not something very common in the generally sanitized world of Marvel. Good thing that the writer doesn't have to worry about being branded a racist for the way his characters talk, since it really gives the book a more realistic feel (and makes a few bigoted bozos in the book look very bad, much to my delight).
The only reservation I'd have is one that no new reader would share : this Wakanda is not the one I grew with. Back in the days, young T'Challa had left his isolated home country to study abroad and had come back with a ton of ideas to change it into a technological superpower, which he had done in a matter of a few years. However, some of the Wakandas had a hard time adjusting to the changes; the dichotomy between a high tech life and one closer to nature was at the core of Wakandan society. Here, we deal with a futuristic country that was always futuristic, using advanced weapon technology as early as the XIX century. The flashback scenes from the Panther's introduction in Fantastic Four are incompatible with this revisionist view of Wakandan history.
But hey, no worry... The number of times the Marvel Universe has been blown up and rebuilt these past few years, I can accept that Wakandan history just got changed along the way.
Favourite moments :
- The dialog between the 5th century invaders at the beginning of the story; all cocky and arro9gant, and then not so much; but defiant all the way. - The stupor among the American strategists when they learn that Wakanda has tons of oil... and doesn't exploit it, because it already has all the clean energy it needs. - The historical Black Panther whose costume really does look like something that could have come from Africa (because let's face it, the original Black Panther bodystocking doesn't).
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Post by Batflunkie on May 2, 2016 8:34:27 GMT -5
Inspired by Reptisaurus's new review thread, I took a look at Hudlin and Romita Jr. 's Black Panther #1 that's currently available for free with the Marvel Unlimited App. General impression : extremely good I took one look at the pulp artstyle and knew that I was going to love it regardless of how the story was. Romita may not be everyone's cup of tea these days like Kirby was in his later years, but he still has that certain dynamic feel to his artwork that draws you in and grabs you by the collar
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Post by dupersuper on May 3, 2016 22:17:49 GMT -5
I'm getting pretty close to the end of the Starman Omnibus, Volume One. I'm mostly enjoying it. I'm getting used to James Robinson's writing tics and, annoying as they may be at times, I can look past them. Well, most of them. But Starman #15. Whoa! So bad. I kind of wish I hadn't read it. It's the fourth part of a five-part story. The first two parts were really good! (Especially Ted Knight's chapter.) The third part wasn't so great. The O'Dare family members are not the awesome supporting cast that Robinson thinks they are. They're kind of boring. I think maybe he should have picked one of them (doesn't matter which one) and fleshed out that character's cop stereotype. But #15. Uh. Yeah. Solomon Grundy and the 1970s Starman are chloroformed by the new Mist's gang and taken to a penthouse and beaten up. Regular humans kidnap Solomon Grundy and the 1970s Starman and take them and beat them up. I've never read a comic book with the 1970s Starman and don't really care too much about him. But I'm not buying Robinson's Solomon Grundy at all. Later dialogue informs us that the new Mist examined medical reports of super-hero encounters involving Grundy and came up with a mixture of weedkillers and chemicals and so on that would subdue him. "Clever girl, the Mist," says her henchman. The Mist may indeed be very clever, but she can't possibly be half as clever as James Robinson thinks himself to be. Medical reports from past super-hero encounters? Was Grundy hospitalized at some point? Was he examined by doctors? Perhaps there was an autopsy when he looked dead, but he came back to life? I just can't make this work in my head. If James Robinson didn't want to use Solomon Grundy, he should have come up with a new character. If he thought he could improve the old Grundy, he was dead wrong. I suppose a lot of people don't really have a problem with these changes. But this is a pretty weak chapter anyway. Really. Any version of Solomon Grundy that can be abducted by Clockwork Orange thugs with some weedkiller is so far removed from any meaningful depiction of Solomon Grundy that I can safely ignore any future appearances of that character. I also thought the henchman comparing the movie versions of Philip Marlowe was a pretty dumb segment, but a lot of stupid people say a bunch of dumb things about Chandler's books and the various movie versions. So the henchmen is just like some dumb troll on IMDB, and it actually works in the context of the story. (Although I do have a bit of a problem believing that anybody thinks that George Montgomery was the best Marlowe. I find it much easier to believe that some crazed movie buff would kill somebody for saying it than to believe that somebody would actually say it.) I really hope that Robinson doesn't actually believe some of that gibberish about Marlowe that he put in the henchman's mouth. That just leaves one more chapter in the omnibus. I don't know how interested I am in reading 1990s Starman any further than this. Is the new Solomon Grundy a major part of future storylines? I think a subdued Solomon Grundy as a supporting character could be very interesting, but I just don't have enough faith in Robinson's writing prowess to come up with something that works for me. Green Lantern takes 12 or 13 pages to defeat Solomon Grundy in this issue. That's Golden Age pages! So that's three or four months at least! Green Lantern should have got some Clockwork Orange thugs with weedkiller to help! I'm not sure if it started in Starman, but for quite a while Solomon Grundys power level, intelligence and - to some extent - personality are subject to change every rebirth. Thus sometimes he trades punches with Superman, sometimes Green Arrow cust his throat with a bow string.
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Crimebuster
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Making comics!
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Post by Crimebuster on May 3, 2016 23:40:10 GMT -5
IIs the new Solomon Grundy a major part of future storylines? I think a subdued Solomon Grundy as a supporting character could be very interesting, but I just don't have enough faith in Robinson's writing prowess to come up with something that works for me. He's around in the background for awhile, and eventually becomes the focus for a multi-issue arc guest-starring Batman where they go inside his psyche or something. I forget the details. The pacing gets a little weird around this part; Jon Valor, the Black Pirate is also a focus of the arc, which is supposed to be 4 issues long (it says stuff like part 4 of 4 on the cover) but which I swear is actually six issues long, with the final issues just not having the arc label on them. I didn't mind the Grundy stuff in Starman (which is one of my favorite titles) but he's not really a major part of it; the 1970's Starman is a much more important character in the grand scheme of things.
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Post by Batflunkie on May 4, 2016 7:03:35 GMT -5
DC's initial run of Plastic Man in the 60's, he seems to fit in pretty well amongst the other "checkerboard kitsch" DC characters of the era
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Post by Hoosier X on May 4, 2016 9:02:23 GMT -5
That just leaves one more chapter in the omnibus. I don't know how interested I am in reading 1990s Starman any further than this. Is the new Solomon Grundy a major part of future storylines? I think a subdued Solomon Grundy as a supporting character could be very interesting, but I just don't have enough faith in Robinson's writing prowess to come up with something that works for me.
Green Lantern takes 12 or 13 pages to defeat Solomon Grundy in this issue. That's Golden Age pages! So that's three or four months at least! Green Lantern should have got some Clockwork Orange thugs with weedkiller to help! I'm not sure if it started in Starman, but for quite a while Solomon Grundys power level, intelligence and - to some extent - personality are subject to change every rebirth. Thus sometimes he trades punches with Superman, sometimes Green Arrow cust his throat with a bow string. The Solomon Grundy I'm familiar with goes toe-to-toe with Superman or Green Lantern or equally powerful foes every time. He's sometimes a little more bestial or stupid than at other times, but it's not especially noteworthy in comic book terms. One stupid story where he gets strangled by a bowstring is just one stupid story that should be ignored. And besides, I think that incident took place many years after Robinson revived Grundy. It sounds like a solution in search of a problem to me. Roy Thomas was never anywhere near this obsessive about character inconsistencies.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on May 4, 2016 9:34:17 GMT -5
The first Solomon Grundy I read was going up against Batman. In Shadow of the Bat #39, I believe. I really like the character in that instance, but I have never really read much more about it. He was also in the Batman BatB cartoon for a couple of episodes. Didn't like him so much in that. Just seemed like some random dumb and slow zombie.
Edit: I need to finish out my Starman reading at some time too. I ended with the third Omnibus and had forgotten he was in it until I read more posts above. I had forgotten he was in Starman. But I don't remember disliking it. In fact, other than perhaps small things, I really don't remember disliking any major part of Starman up to what I had read.
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Post by Hoosier X on May 4, 2016 12:01:31 GMT -5
The first Solomon Grundy story I ever read was from the 1940s! The story where he fought the Justice Society (All-Star #33) was reprinted in the 1970s in Giant Super-Team Family #4. Solomon Grundy is pretty scary! And that appearance in All-Star Comics is one of the main reasons I've loved the JSA all these years while being mostly indifferent to the JLA. (Althout I've warmed to the JLA over the years.) A few months after I read Super-Team Family #4, I bought my very first issue of Superman ever! Just because it had Solomon Grundy in it! Fans of Super-Dickery will love this. Superman can't beat Solomon Grundy. So he dresses up like Grundy, makes friends with him, tells him he's taking him to place where he will be happy, flies him to the moon and abandons him there! What a jerk! I don't have a knee-jerk dislike of every change to favored characters. I sometimes grumble about whether a change was really necessary (it usually isn't) but I've accepted that comics are like that now. And I judge the new character on his or her own merits. I might prefer the Penguin as a dapper, Shakespeare-quoting, trick-umbrella toting gangster, but I've accepted that he's now a shady, physically deformed nightclub owner and he's actually an interesting character in his present form (although his mini-series was awful). And there's something wonderfully demented about the Joker (my favorite DC character!) running around without a face. I could probably rationalize the changes to Grundy if I was the least bit interested in Robinson's version. But he really mangled a great character and, so far in what I've read, hasn't really done anything interesting with him. I thought the New 52 Solomon Grundy was way over-the-top and unnecessary, but it wasn't nearly as bad as Robinson's version. Still, I liked the first Starman Omnibus enough to continue if my library system ever gets any more omnibuses. But I'm not finding that Robinson's Starman even begins to live up to its hype.
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Post by sabongero on May 4, 2016 12:56:24 GMT -5
I'm reading up on some of Mark Gruenwald's work in the Captain America in the 1980's. I liked this storyline that spanned for the better part of two years. Plus some slam bang action against the Serpent Society which was okay. The best part I liked was the Steve Rogers interaction with Diamondback. I liked her as a girlfriend to Cap back in the days.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on May 4, 2016 13:28:53 GMT -5
@hoosier -- Wow Superman really was a dick. I kind of got the impression from the little I remember of the portray of Grundy, at least in that SotB issue, he was kinda of like Bizzaro, or someone big lug, like ole Lennie from Of Mice and Men. And it's the version I like. So yeah, Batman may have punched and fought for his life, but Superman falsely befriending him and tricking him. What a dick! lol
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