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Post by rberman on Apr 22, 2018 20:43:32 GMT -5
I haven't read nearly as much Morrison as many of you obviously have, but the terms that come to mind for me are "inventive" and "non-linear." The former has been generally a boon, though occasionally it blows up in his face, as we'll see at certain points of the New X-Men run I'm currently reviewing in another thread. The non-linearity (cutting back and forth between scenes, sometimes across time) sometimes seems like complication for its own sake or a way to artificially hide information from the reader. But from my limited vantage point, the world of comics is better with him than it would have been without him.
As for Plastic Man vs Elongated Man: Sometimes those decisions are made high up in the food chain based on which heroes need to get exercised in order for the company to prevent their trademark from lapsing into the public domain.
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Post by mikelmidnight on Apr 23, 2018 11:39:27 GMT -5
I love some of Morrison's writing, and used to be a huge fan of his (I even love Zenith), but to my eyes his writing took a downturn when he took over JLA, and I haven't cared for him as much since (with a few exceptions like Multiversity). I disliked his obsession with the 'Bat-God' and the way it infested the JLA, and his characterization in the series never spoke to me. Doom Patrol, meanwhile, remains my favorite superhero team book ever.
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Post by berkley on Apr 24, 2018 0:21:01 GMT -5
I love some of Morrison's writing, and used to be a huge fan of his (I even love Zenith), but to my eyes his writing took a downturn when he took over JLA, and I haven't cared for him as much since (with a few exceptions like Multiversity). I disliked his obsession with the 'Bat-God' and the way it infested the JLA, and his characterization in the series never spoke to me. Doom Patrol, meanwhile, remains my favorite superhero team book ever.
Yes, I shouldn't allow the expression of my dislike for Morrison's JLA to leave the impression that I dislike his work in general. On the contrary, I rate some of his independent work up there with the very best in comics writing - e.g. The Filth, The Invisibles. Multiversity was uneven, IMO, but never less than interesting and when it was good it was really good. I'd say my favourite of Morrison's superhero work would be Seven Soldiers, but I haven't read Doom Patrol yet. I suspect it's no coincidence that both of those feature relatively obscure characters rather the popular DC icons. For me, this divide between high quality independent work and mediocre or worse with established superhero characters holds true with a lot of today's writers - I imagine largely because they're trying to give their clients (Marvel/DC) what they want: fan-service in the form of the "Bat-god" or whatever the case may be. I learned my lesson long ago and avoid most contemporary superhero comics, no matter how talented the writer might be in other areas. |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Apr 24, 2018 2:31:03 GMT -5
Honestly, I don't see much quality difference between Morrison's corporate superhero and creator owned work. WE3 is my favorite of his projects, but I never responded much to Kill Your Boyfriend, Klaus, Joe the Barbarian, and I thought the Filth was nigh-unreadable. Conversely I honestly mildly like-to-love all his long form superhero work, and I'd rate Seven Soldiers # 0 and the silent issue of New X_men up there with any Grant Morrison comic (and any American superhero comic as well.)
There are some folks who's independent work is at a much higher level than there corporate work for hire stuff (Kurt Busiek, and Gail Simone being my top two) but I think Morrison is more interesting because that isn't true.
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Post by berkley on Apr 24, 2018 19:19:37 GMT -5
I think there's been a bit of a general drop-off in quality in all his work the last few years. Or it could be just that he hasn't been coming up with concepts I find attractive - for example, I didn't read Klaus or Joe the Barbarian because their respective premises didn't grab me. I will probably try Kill Your Boyfriend one of these days, though, unless I end up hearing something about it that turns me off (as of now I know nothing at all about it beyond the title and that it came out in the 90s).
I would probably rate the Filth as his best single work so we won't see eye to eye on that one.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Apr 24, 2018 22:15:47 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't remember that much about the Filth now - It felt like a simplified and disgusting-a-fied version of the Invisibles (and I quite like the Invisibles!)
Yeah, I'm generally a huge Morrison fan but it's been a while since he's released anything I've really liked.
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Post by berkley on Apr 25, 2018 0:47:42 GMT -5
I could be a bit biased in its (The Filth's) favour because it was the first thing I ever read by him. I think it definitely covers some of the same ground as The Invisibles, though from a completely different angle; and of course, as a single volume work it's more concise but perhaps less wide-ranging in its investigation of that conceptual territory. I'm probably due for a re-read of it sometime in the near to intermediate future myself, so I'll see if there's any change in my views after that revisit.
I just looked up his bibliography and saw that there were a couple relatively recent things I had been interested in but forgot about while waiting for them to be collected: The Nameless, which is I see now available in a paperback collection, so I think I'll be buying or ordering that sometime soon; and something called Sinatoro, which as far as I can tell never even reached the point of seeing a single issue in print, apparently because it was bought up as a potential movie or tv project. Too bad - the artist on Sinatoro was Vanessa Del Ray, whose work looks really good to me from the online samples I've seen, and it would have been nice to see how it worked with Morrison's writing.
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bran
Full Member
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Post by bran on Apr 25, 2018 3:33:11 GMT -5
Absolutely nothing. But apparently he resonates with millennials. If so, that's fantastic. If he is a rabbit-hole for them... let him do whatever he is doing.
I went through his Batman run, it ain't Miraclemen but it's solid, above average Batman to say at least. It's huge run too, does not appear fragmented, with some nice art.
I'd say this: If I were DC/Marvel I would want him on major titles. If I were him I would run away from Superman/Batman as far as possible. All he has to do now is deliver creator/owned mini series for Image, and sooner or later he'll hit a bulls-eye (and join Vaughns, Kirkmans and Millars of the World...).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2018 13:39:29 GMT -5
Absolutely nothing. But apparently he resonates with millennials. If so, that's fantastic. If he is a rabbit-hole for them... let him do whatever he is doing. I went through his Batman run, it ain't Miraclemen but it's solid, above average Batman to say at least. It's huge run too, does not appear fragmented, with some nice art. I'd say this: If I were DC/Marvel I would want him on major titles. If I were him I would run away from Superman/Batman as far as possible. All he has to do now is deliver creator/owned mini series for Image, and sooner or later he'll hit a bulls-eye (and join Vaughns, Kirkmans and Millars of the World...). Well it's looking like Morrison's next big project is going to be taking over Green Lantern for DC as part of their creative team shuffle coming up towards the fall. -M |
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Post by sabongero on Apr 25, 2018 17:23:52 GMT -5
Absolutely nothing. But apparently he resonates with millennials. If so, that's fantastic. If he is a rabbit-hole for them... let him do whatever he is doing. I went through his Batman run, it ain't Miraclemen but it's solid, above average Batman to say at least. It's huge run too, does not appear fragmented, with some nice art. I'd say this: If I were DC/Marvel I would want him on major titles. If I were him I would run away from Superman/Batman as far as possible. All he has to do now is deliver creator/owned mini series for Image, and sooner or later he'll hit a bulls-eye (and join Vaughns, Kirkmans and Millars of the World...). Well it's looking like Morrison's next big project is going to be taking over Green Lantern for DC as part of their creative team shuffle coming up towards the fall. -M I don't know if he can add more to the Legacy of the Green Lantern myth that Geoff Johns did when he revitalized that franchise. But seeing his crazy plot and stories and zaniness he brought to Animal Man, I am looking forward to see what he brings in the table for Green Lantern. After all space cops is open to unlimited stories that can bring the fantastic and craziness. Let's just hope he doesn't make it too cerebral for comic book readers, that way it can have depth and be entertaining at the same time. |
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Post by Batflunkie on Apr 29, 2018 13:27:04 GMT -5
To be honest, Morrison has always struck me as a bit of an Alan Moore wannabe, and I find a lot of his stuff unreadable. Zenith is particularly overrated. About the only thing he's done that I remain genuinely impressed by is Animal Man. I'm the exact opposite. I've tried to read a lot of Moore's stuff it doesn't flow very well from panel to panel and is just mostly so overloaded with text, it's almost like a blipvert from Max Headroom. The only things that I can say with 100% certainly that I've liked from Moore is Skizz, D.R. & Quinch, 1963, Tom Strong and bits and pieces of Tomorrow Stories. Miracleman also had it's moments With Morrison, even if I don't like something that he's done like Invisibles, I can at the very least appreciate what he was trying to accomplish. Really can't say the same about Moore, his prose kind of reeks of "you're either along for the ride or you're not and if you're not, you can sod off". I do think Moore is an interesting person though, regardless of his huge ego about himself |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on May 1, 2018 4:53:51 GMT -5
To be honest, Morrison has always struck me as a bit of an Alan Moore wannabe, and I find a lot of his stuff unreadable. Zenith is particularly overrated. About the only thing he's done that I remain genuinely impressed by is Animal Man. I'm the exact opposite. I've tried to read a lot of Moore's stuff it doesn't flow very well from panel to panel and is just mostly so overloaded with text, it's almost like a blipvert from Max Headroom. The only things that I can say with 100% certainly that I've liked from Moore is Skizz, D.R. & Quinch, 1963, Tom Strong and bits and pieces of Tomorrow Stories. Miracleman also had it's moments With Morrison, even if I don't like something that he's done like Invisibles, I can at the very least appreciate what he was trying to accomplish. Really can't say the same about Moore, his prose kind of reeks of "you're either along for the ride or you're not and if you're not, you can sod off". I do think Moore is an interesting person though, regardless of his huge ego about himself I like Alan Moore, but I like Morrison's stuff better. He always seems to be having fun with whatever he's writing, and Moore is - barring the early ABC books - a little too attached to his grumpity curmudgeon persona. |
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Post by sabongero on May 3, 2018 14:37:51 GMT -5
I'm the exact opposite. I've tried to read a lot of Moore's stuff it doesn't flow very well from panel to panel and is just mostly so overloaded with text, it's almost like a blipvert from Max Headroom. The only things that I can say with 100% certainly that I've liked from Moore is Skizz, D.R. & Quinch, 1963, Tom Strong and bits and pieces of Tomorrow Stories. Miracleman also had it's moments With Morrison, even if I don't like something that he's done like Invisibles, I can at the very least appreciate what he was trying to accomplish. Really can't say the same about Moore, his prose kind of reeks of "you're either along for the ride or you're not and if you're not, you can sod off". I do think Moore is an interesting person though, regardless of his huge ego about himself I like Alan Moore, but I like Morrison's stuff better. He always seems to be having fun with whatever he's writing, and Moore is - barring the early ABC books - a little too attached to his grumpity curmudgeon persona. can you share your insight into what makes Morrison's stuff better than Alan Moore's? This really piqued my curiosity. Thanks. |
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Post by Batflunkie on May 5, 2018 21:03:11 GMT -5
You do have to hand it to Morrison though for not suing the shit out of WB for lifting so many of his concepts from The Invisibles for The Matrix. The guy was just happy to see his work out there and good for him
Moore on the other hand absolutely detests anyone's adaptations of work
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2018 22:26:10 GMT -5
You do have to hand it to Morrison though for not suing the shit out of WB for lifting so many of his concepts from The Invisibles for The Matrix. The guy was just happy to see his work out there and good for him Moore on the other hand absolutely detests anyone's adaptations of work Well that would just expose Morrison to lawsuits for all the esoteric ideas he stole form the books he was reading. The core mythology of the Invisibles is taken straightfrom Rosicrucian treatises, blended with Terrence McKenna's ideas, sprinkle in a little Moorock Eternal Champion and add a couple other books that Morrison mentioned inthe letters pages and if you read them all you've already read everything in the Invisibles ecept some of the characters that act as tour guides. It's essentially Dan Brown's Da Vinci Code and a guided tour of Templar mythology except Morrison's Invisibles gives you a guided tour of Rosicrucian esoteric mythology, and that would revela him to be the intellectual poser that he is. And I say that with the Invisibles being one of my favorite Vertigo series. -M |
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