Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
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Post by Confessor on Jul 25, 2014 7:00:55 GMT -5
ASM #20 would be my favorite Lee/Ditko Spidey story IF Annual #1 didn't exist. The Annual does such a great job of epitomizing the appeal of early Spider-Man. It explores Peter's inner conflict, gives us quick but accurate sketches of the supporting cast (Jonah, Betty, May, Flash), spotlights six of his best villains, provides plenty of action (including those drop-dead gorgeous full page panels) and is chockful of cameos by the rest of the Marvel Universe. That's not even taking into consideration all the awesome fatures and pin-ups and the hysterical "How Stan and Steve Create Spider-Man" three-pager. Add in my own childhood nostalgia (it was my introduction to Iron Man, Dr. Strange, The Wasp, The Avengers and The X-Men) and, well, it's no contest. But #20 definitely rules, too. Annual #1 is a real corker, no doubts there. Nostalgia plays a fairly big part in my choice of #20 too. I bought it as a Marvel Tales reprint circa 1983 or 84 and just read the hell out of it. I still have my original copy and it's tatty and coverless, just through being re-read so often. I have to go with the Master Planner storyline in #31-33. If I have to pick one single issue, it would be #33. Yeah, the Master Planner arc is really good. Funny thing though: the whole iconic, Spidey lifting the impossible weight off of his back scene from ASM #33 never really did it for me. I mean, yeah, it's a good sequence and Ditko's artwork is lovely in those panels, but...I don't know, I think it's overrated. The sequence in ASM #20 where Spider-Man continues to fight on, despite the battering he's getting from the Scorpion, is every bit as powerful as that iconic scene from ASM #33 IMHO. I'll go with #18.  Yeah, amazing cover illustration on #18. One of Ditko's very best covers I'd say. The GCD tells me that someone called Stan Goldberg did the colouring on that cover and I think the colouring really contributes an awful lot to the overall impact of that piece. For me it has to be #14's "The Grotesque Adventures of the Green Goblin". First off I dig the Enforcers. They are kind of losers, but lovable losers nonetheless, especially The Ox. Also the whole sequence in the cave is suitably atmospheric and drawn with aplomb by Ditko. The lurking Hulk in the depths is the topper. It is among my least favorite. I have trouble getting past the absurdities in the plot, and I just find Green Goblin in his initial appearance less compelling than pretty much every other Ditko villain. I agree Chris, the plot is definitely nuts, but the whole scenario of the film being shot just seems to so typify the often ludicrous, but breezy and fun pop aesthetic of Silver Age Marvel. Anyway that's how it strikes me. I think that ASM #14 is a hard issue to love, but an easy one to really like. I agree that the Goblin is pretty underwhelming on his first appearance, especially compared to the defining arch-enemy he would later become. I also hate -- and have always hated, since first reading that issue in the early '80s -- the mechanical flying broomstick he rides on in #14. It has always bugged me how he managed to stay on that thing. The bat glider of later issues is a much, much better idea and although in reality it would be just as ridiculous a mode of transport, at least the bat glider has wings with toe stirrups for Gobby to balance on. The broomstick just looks like it'd be utterly impossible to stay on when it's in flight. I also think that the whole movie shoot plot is pretty hokey...although I do also somewhat agree with benday-dot that it's a very Silver Age Marvel plot device. However, you can definitely chalk me up as a fan of The Enforcers. Yes, they're a bunch of losers, but I really dig them...in much the same way that I dig those other losers The Ring Master and the Circus of Crime from ASM #22. The Hulk's appearance in this issue is a nice bonus and, of course, the art is great...especially the subterranean fight scenes with Spidey, Hulk and the Goblin. |
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Post by Nowhere Man on Jul 25, 2014 7:08:46 GMT -5
The Master Planner arc is by far my favorite set of issues. It never fails to make me at least slightly misty every time Peter's lifts that machinery off of him.
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Post by Rob Allen on Jul 25, 2014 13:07:08 GMT -5
... someone called Stan Goldberg did the colouring on that cover and I think the colouring really contributes an awful lot to the overall impact of that piece. Agreed, that cover is really well done. It sounds like you're not familiar with Stan Goldberg, so here's a capsule bio: Stan Goldberg started as a colorist at Timely/Atlas/Marvel in 1949, was the coloring department manager from 1951 and was the only colorist from about 1957 to 1966 or so, when they hired Marie Severin. He did the colors for all of the "Marvel Age" classics. He also drew Millie the Model and Kathy the Teenage Tornado in those years. When he was mentioned at all, his name was given as "Stan G". He spent most of the last few decades drawing for Archie Comics. He retired from Archie in 2010 and started drawing Nancy Drew and Three Stooges stories for Papercutz. He's now 82. www.stangoldberg.com |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2014 13:46:02 GMT -5
I'll go in a different direction. As much as I like Lee/Ditko Spidey, I like Lee/Ditko Doc Strange even more....so my favorite Spidey story by them is the one that featured Doc...Annual #2  plus the Wand of Watoomb, one of may favorite Marvel gazoombies.... add to it a couple of other classic Lee/Ditko stories and you get one big package of happy MRP! -M |
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
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Post by Confessor on Jul 25, 2014 15:54:05 GMT -5
Agreed, that cover is really well done. It sounds like you're not familiar with Stan Goldberg, so here's a capsule bio: Stan Goldberg started as a colorist at Timely/Atlas/Marvel in 1949, was the coloring department manager from 1951 and was the only colorist from about 1957 to 1966 or so, when they hired Marie Severin. He did the colors for all of the "Marvel Age" classics. He also drew Millie the Model and Kathy the Teenage Tornado in those years. When he was mentioned at all, his name was given as "Stan G". He spent most of the last few decades drawing for Archie Comics. He retired from Archie in 2010 and started drawing Nancy Drew and Three Stooges stories for Papercutz. He's now 82. Cheers for that Rob. Really interesting and you're right, I had no idea who he was. |
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Post by Ozymandias on Sept 6, 2014 9:22:39 GMT -5
Been away for a while, good to see you delivered. It is among my least favorite. I have trouble getting past the absurdities in the plot, and I just find Green Goblin in his initial appearance less compelling than pretty much every other Ditko villain. I agree with your first statement, as for the second, not saying he was the worst, but his debut could've been better. The final sequence, though, is a classic in its own merit. I agree with a lot of these picks but I will personally go for ASM #26 and by extension, #27 for a couple of reasons. It was the earliest and first Ditko issue I ever read and owned and it really grabbed me. The artwork was fantastic and, looking at it now having read the first Green Goblin appearance online, I think this is the first true great Goblin story (followed by #27 which ties in and is equally as strong). Unlike issue 14, these two were a good example of what the GG could be. In fact they're as good as any of my other top picks (16-18, 25 and 30). There's no good enough reason to discriminate between them. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Sept 6, 2014 11:27:18 GMT -5
I'm not a Spider-man fan but I think my favorite in that run was #8 when he knocks out Flash Thompson. It's the only issue i remember him having a happy ending.
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Post by Hoosier X on Sept 6, 2014 12:33:57 GMT -5
Just last night, I was thinking about Spidey #8, mostly about that crazy fight with the Living Brain! (And in the other story, where he leaves a heart-shaped blob of webbing as a gift for the Invisible Girl. To me, it's one of the most unintentionally HI-LARIOUS moments of the Silver Age.)
The whole dynamic between Peter and Flash in those issues is great, and the fight in the boxing ring in #8 is one of the better moments devoted to the relationship. (I also love that bit in #5 where Flash is dressed as Spidey (to scare Peter) and he is abducted by Dr. Doom! And also that incident (around #27) where Peter got into trouble for fighting and Flash went to the principal to stick up for Peter. I knew guys like that in high school.)
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Post by crazyoldhermit on Sept 6, 2014 19:03:01 GMT -5
Hard to say.
My go-to is #14, since the Green Goblin and the Hulk are two of my favorite character and I love the scene in the cave. I also love the suspense of the ending, with Peter realizing the Goblin could be anybody.
#20 is another contender, since I've always loved the Scorpion and it really packs a ton of story into 22 pages. Hard to find a fault with it.
In the end I might have to go with the two-part Green Goblin vs the Crime-Master.
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Post by coke & comics on Sept 6, 2014 23:27:11 GMT -5
Unlike issue 14, these two were a good example of what the GG could be. In fact they're as good as any of my other top picks (16-18, 25 and 30). There's no good enough reason to discriminate between them. I think a lot of the great early Green Goblin stories were great despite, not because of, Green Goblin. End of Spider-Man is one of the all-time great Spider-Man stories, but it is because he quit being Spider-Man. The villain is almost incidental. The Crimemaster saga is one of the all-time great Spider-Man stories because Crimemaster is so awesome. Green Goblin is just there. |
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Post by Ozymandias on Sept 8, 2014 13:11:04 GMT -5
The whole dynamic between Peter and Flash in those issues is great, and the fight in the boxing ring in #8 is one of the better moments devoted to the relationship. (I also love that bit in #5 where Flash is dressed as Spidey (to scare Peter) and he is abducted by Dr. Doom! And also that incident (around #27) where Peter got into trouble for fighting and Flash went to the principal to stick up for Peter. I knew guys like that in high school.) Not a fan of issue 8, really. As for the specific comparison with #5 and #27, I prefer the scenes involving Flash in those issues, to the one in #8. Although my personal favorite on the subject is from ASM #30. I think a lot of the great early Green Goblin stories were great despite, not because of, Green Goblin. End of Spider-Man is one of the all-time great Spider-Man stories, but it is because he quit being Spider-Man. The villain is almost incidental. The Crimemaster saga is one of the all-time great Spider-Man stories because Crimemaster is so awesome. Green Goblin is just there. There's some ring to it, but with Ditko in full swing, I'd say all the characters were on their "best behavior" there. The Crimemaster somehow steals the thunder, because he burned shortly and brightly, but Ditko's best issues were choral in nature. |
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Post by Phil Maurice on Sept 8, 2014 17:44:19 GMT -5
Amazing Spider-Man #3. Spider-Man laments that no one exists who is his equal, much less can best him in combat. Fighting crime is laughably easy for him; his Spider-powers make him nigh invincible.
Enter Doctor Octopus, who hands Spider-Man his first crushing, humiliating defeat, a smack-down so severe it utterly destroys his confidence. In a great bit of character work, teen-aged Peter Parker realizes, "Oh my gosh. This is harder than I thought. I totally quit," echoing every kid who ever tried out for a sport, picked up a musical instrument, or auditioned for a school play.
A motivational speech given at Peter's high school by the Human Torch (presumably as part of his court-mandated community service) inspires Peter to up his game, learn from his defeat, apply his academic acumen, and never surrender. He faces his fears and triumphs over Doc Ock, handing him a much more embarrassing loss (webbed up, waiting for the police to free him).
It's, well, Amazing. The Spider-Man we meet on page one is not the same young man we encounter on the last page. He has emerged from the crucible stronger, smarter, a hero.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
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Post by Confessor on Sept 16, 2014 6:00:37 GMT -5
Amazing Spider-Man #3. Spider-Man laments that no one exists who is his equal, much less can best him in combat. Fighting crime is laughably easy for him; his Spider-powers make him nigh invincible.
Enter Doctor Octopus, who hands Spider-Man his first crushing, humiliating defeat, a smack-down so severe it utterly destroys his confidence. In a great bit of character work, teen-aged Peter Parker realizes, "Oh my gosh. This is harder than I thought. I totally quit," echoing every kid who ever tried out for a sport, picked up a musical instrument, or auditioned for a school play.
A motivational speech given at Peter's high school by the Human Torch (presumably as part of his court-mandated community service) inspires Peter to up his game, learn from his defeat, apply his academic acumen, and never surrender. He faces his fears and triumphs over Doc Ock, handing him a much more embarrassing loss (webbed up, waiting for the police to free him).
It's, well, Amazing. The Spider-Man we meet on page one is not the same young man we encounter on the last page. He has emerged from the crucible stronger, smarter, a hero.
Well said! A fantastic analysis of what makes that particular issue so great, Phil. Makes me want to go re-read it right now.  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2014 20:41:18 GMT -5
I'm new to this group (just joined yesterday) and I'm a Spider-Man fan. My favorite adventure of Spider-Man is has to be the Master Planner Saga - of which he exhibited great courage to conquer the impossible to lift tremendous weight - that takes all his Spider-Strength to do. This issue has special meaning to me because we all have to face great challenges in our life and one of them is to overcome anything and this issue showcase that. I have that Comic Book and I treasured it always because show character inside of Peter Parker. He was constantly thinking about challenges, Aunt May, Uncle Ben, and the ordeal that he was in and at the end of this adventure - he succeeded with great determination and that's makes it a classic Spider-Man tale.  And, finally he broke free from the tremendous "weights"  |
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Post by ghastly55 on Sept 28, 2014 10:29:04 GMT -5
My favorite Lee/Ditko issue has to be #8, where Puny Parker loses the glasses and knocks out Flash Thompson.
I first read it in the 25-cent Marvel Tales reprint bimonthly -- it was about the fourth Spider-Man story I'd ever read.
It was issue 40 (which of course Ditko had nothing to do with) that was my intro to the character, bought off the newsstand in June 1966. But I loved that issue so much that I went back looking for every Marvel Comics Group corner box I could find, and one of them was Marvel Tales #4, which contained Spidey's second gig with The Vulture. And as I read that story, I realized two things -- one, that this was a very different artist, and one I recognized from the old weird monster stories from a few years earlier; and secondly, that I had actually read this particular story years earlier, when waiting for a haircut with my father at an East Baltimore barber shop.
Next thing I knew, Marvel Tales #5 was out. And something about the inking on that (original Spider-Man 8) cover just absolutely captivated me.
There were many titles I dropped later in the fall of 1966, but I tried never to miss an issue of Marvel Tales, so I could catch up on what I missed. That, and the black-and-white Lancer paperbacks, were an invaluable crash course in what was then a very shallow Marvel Universe backstory.
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