Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Mar 13, 2017 19:06:30 GMT -5
I think that, first up, if we are talking about the Sixties, you have to accept that most pop or rock music that is described as "psychedelic" isn't really very psychedelic at all. As a rule of thumb, true psychedelic music should either be music designed to replicate the experience of bring under the influence of psychedelic drugs or music that is designed to be listened to while on those drugs to enhance the experience. There are, of course, plenty of examples of properly psychedelic sounding music that don't, strictly speaking, fall into those two categories, but that's my working definition.
As for unconventional song structure (unconventional for pop music, anyway), yes, some psychedelic records attempt to emulate the effects of LSD with odd arrangements and Syd Barrett's songs for Pink Floyd are good examples of this. The thing with psychedelic music though is that, often, you just know it when you hear it.
But nevertheless, an awful lot of so-called psychedelic music from the Sixties doesn't really sound particularly "far out". A good example of this is the majority of the San Francisco, Haight-Ashbury music scene. Although it's regarded as being the epicentre of the American psychedelic movement, in fact, the majority of bands from that scene were little more than blues bands that played extended jams. There was relatively little music made in SF between, say, 1966 and 1969 that is truley psychedelic. Most of the genuine psychedelia that came from the West Coast of the U.S. was actually made by Los Angeles bands like the Byrds, Love, the Beach Boys, the Seeds, Frank Zappa, Strawberry Alarm Clock, Spirit, and the Doors etc.
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Mar 13, 2017 19:15:29 GMT -5
1966 Psychedelia
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Mar 13, 2017 19:27:11 GMT -5
And a damn fine cover of the same song by fellow L.A. psych masters, The West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band... EDIT: Actually, the WCPAEB's second album, The West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band, Part One, which featured the above Zappa cover, is also 50 years old this month. |
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Mar 13, 2017 21:47:05 GMT -5
I'll tell you Confessor, never in a million years would I imagine someone doing a cover of Zappa's Help I'm A Rock. But The WCPAED succeeded in adding something to it  |
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Post by berkley on Mar 13, 2017 23:01:59 GMT -5
Yes there's a whole neo-psychedelic scene in England (and probably in the US as well?), that I think Confessor has talked about before. I haven't explored it extenseively but I particularly like a band called the Wicked Whispers (whose music is frustratingly hard to find). Here's the song that initially got me into them a few years back:
I've loved that Green Tambourine song from way back when it used to be on the radio when I was a kid but no, I don't think of it as psychedelic.
And yes, bands like the Grateful Dead don't sound psychedelic to me either: they sound exactly like one of those blues bands that played extended jams that Confessor mentioned.
Where I might differ with you is that I'm not sure I'd count even the Doors or Zappa as psychedelic, though they might fit Confessor's definition. I see Zappa more as an experimentalist bringing avant-garde ideas from the classical or non-pop world into rock music. Similarly, I don't think of VU tracks like Black Angel's Death Song as psychedelic, though John Cale was certainly bringing in some experimental ideas to it.
I can't recall at the moment what particular kind of drugs Morrison was into, but his lyrics seem more influenced by 19th-century symbolists or related poets like Rimbaud, and so on, rather than trying to reproduce psychedelic trips, though the two ideas aren't mutually exclusive. Musically, they do have some of the things I associate with the psychedelic sound, but not everything.
But as with most things, I suppose there isn't really any strict, well-defined line between the psychedelic and non-psychedelic. There's a grey area of songs that have some of the attributes but not others, and everyone's reaction will be different.
Since we're on the topic, here's a follow-up question: what were some of the first psychedelic songs? Did the Beatles, as they often did, get there first with Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds? Or was it some obscure band no one but die-hard fans remembers?
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Mar 13, 2017 23:11:35 GMT -5
Believe me, I know from experience, when you are under the influence of psychedelia paraphernalia, most music sounds psychedelic. I remember an evening with friends after trying out a Timothy Leary recipe, listening to a Hawkwind album (this would be about 1972 or 1973 I guess). I thought it was the greatest album I've ever heard. A week later I listened again and thought it was terrible. Trying to remember what we used to listen to alot on those special nights. There was a great album which was a teamup of Carlos Santana and John McLaughlin. Still stands the test of time and their version of A Love Supreme by John Coltrane is a favorite  |
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Mar 14, 2017 8:59:12 GMT -5
I've loved that Green Tambourine song from way back when it used to be on the radio when I was a kid but no, I don't think of it as psychedelic. Ah, you see...I do think of it as psychedelic. In fact, I would cite it as a prime example of Psychedelic Pop. Part of this is due to its trippy use of reverb, electric sitar, and "ethnic-sounding" drums, part of it is because it still strives to be a very Top 40 friendly record (in spite of its weirdness), and part of it comes down to knowing the rest of the Lemon Pipers' output from this era, as I do, and some of it was much closer to acid rock than this song. And yes, bands like the Grateful Dead don't sound psychedelic to me either: they sound exactly like one of those blues bands that played extended jams that Confessor mentioned. Live in concert, I mostly agree with you -- the Dead were more like a blues or folk rock band, given to drifting off into long, drawn out improvisational guitar solos. That said, the live version of "Dark Star" on 1969's Live/Dead album is one of the most truly mind expanding pieces of music you'll ever hear. Put it on at nighttime, turn all the lights off and let the Dead take you on an interstellar voyage.  On the Dead's studio records though -- particularly on the albums Anthem of the Sun and Aoxomoxoa -- the band could be pretty psychedelic at times. Just check out songs like "That's It For The Other One", "Rosemary" or the gorgeous "Mountains of the Moon"... Where I might differ with you is that I'm not sure I'd count even the Doors or Zappa as psychedelic, though they might fit Confessor's definition. I see Zappa more as an experimentalist bringing avant-garde ideas from the classical or non-pop world into rock music. That might be true of the majority of Zappa's output, but the first three Mothers of Invention albums definitely contain psychedelic songs -- heavily satirical psychedelic songs, admittedly -- but psychedelic songs nonetheless. Similarly, I don't think of VU tracks like Black Angel's Death Song as psychedelic, though John Cale was certainly bringing in some experimental ideas to it. The Velvet Underground were diametrically opposed to anything even remotely associated with Hippiedom, but nonetheless, songs like "Venus in Furs", "Lady Godiva's Operation" and "All Tomorrow's Parties" are 100% psychedelic rock songs, whether the band like to admit it or not. Likewise, the Doors may have considered themselves apart from the rest of the L.A. psych scene, but songs like "End of the Night", "Horse Latitudes" and "The Unknown Soldier" tell a very different story. But as with most things, I suppose there isn't really any strict, well-defined line between the psychedelic and non-psychedelic. There's a grey area of songs that have some of the attributes but not others, and everyone's reaction will be different. Absolutely. Hence my comment about "knowing it when you hear it". Since we're on the topic, here's a follow-up question: what were some of the first psychedelic songs? Did the Beatles, as they often did, get there first with Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds? Or was it some obscure band no one but die-hard fans remembers? As with any "who was the first" question, there are varying answers but, generally speaking, the most widely accepted "first" psychedelic rock or pop song was "Eight Miles High" by The Byrds. That song was first recorded in December 1965 (although the version released was cut a month later in January 1966). There were antecedents, of course, but prior to "Eight Miles High", records with droney vocals, trippy lyrics, crazy, wigged-out guitar solos and pulsating, hypnotic bass lines simply didn't exist. By contrast, the Beatles didn't commit what I consider to be a proper psychedelic song to tape until April 6th 1966, when they recorded the first takes of "Tomorrow Never Knows". |
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Mar 14, 2017 9:00:28 GMT -5
Believe me, I know from experience, when you are under the influence of psychedelia paraphernalia, most music sounds psychedelic. Lol...I concur! Trying to remember what we used to listen to alot on those special nights. There was a great album which was a teamup of Carlos Santana and John McLaughlin. Still stands the test of time and their version of A Love Supreme by John Coltrane is a favorite I love this album too. |
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Mar 14, 2017 10:52:12 GMT -5
Just remember as I get ready to post the next installment of Music Of 1967-LSD was legal in the USA until March 1968. Songs about using LSD or any other drug got banned unless they were subtle. And where would country music be if they didn't sing about drinking?
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Mar 14, 2017 11:32:44 GMT -5
Just remember as I get ready to post the next installment of Music Of 1967-LSD was legal in the USA until March 1968. Whereas, here in the UK, LSD was made illegal in mid-1966. EDIT: Your date of March 1968 for a U.S. ban sounded late to me (I always thought it was banned in 1966 in America too). A quick Google seems to show that, as is common in the U.S., different states banned it at different times. Nevada banned it in May 1966 and California banned it in October 1966 (which is probably what I was thinking of). October 24th, 1968 is the date I found for possession of LSD being federally banned throughout the U.S. |
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Mar 14, 2017 15:00:00 GMT -5
50 Years Ago Today- March Week 3 1967
And now, finally, after a 6 month hiatus to recharge their batteries, we have a new Beatles single release and after a few weeks on the charts, it has captured the #1 spot. And the real cool thing about Beatles singles are that both sides of the 45 are excellent and both sides are chartbusters. First up-The new #1 song in the USA
As I previously mentioned, The Beatles filmed a music video to accompany their singles. They are no longer touring and no longer travelling to other countries and appearing on TV variety shows. Instead, all their time and efforts will be focused on recording music and other artistic endeavors. This move is pretty unheard of since a music band makes most of their money from live appearances. Speaks volumes to the Beatles decision that their art comes first
The flip side of the single is below. And unfortunately, I cannot find the full length video of their original music clip on the internet. It can be found on various DVD compilations . There are plenty of Youtube clips of early versions of this song that are captured on the Beatles Anthology
CD. And tons of cover bands. But you'll have to settle for this here
This week at #7 for 2 weeks in a row are Mitch Ryder and his Detroit Wheels.They already had some big dance hits such as Jenny Take A Ride, Little Latin Lupe Lu and the classic Devil With A Blue Dress On. This would be their final Top 20 song. Changing tastes in music and throat problems broke up the band.On rhythm guitar for the group is a fellow named Joe Kubert (not the artist).
Herman's Hermits new song was at #12 and climbing. As popular as The Monkees were at this time was how popular lead vocalist Peter Noone and Herman's Hermits were right before. In the states, preceding this song, they had 11 Top 20 songs including 2 at #1-Mrs. Brown You've Got A Lovely Daughter and I'm Henry The VIII. Comparing US and England music charts, they seemed to be even more successful on this side of the Atlantic. They appeared in 3 movies as well. Somewhat like the Monkees, many of their recordings employed session musicians instead of Hermits. And also like the Monkees, especially Peter Noone, he desperately wanted the acceptance of the rock and roll critics and elite stars. He did not get it
Donovan began as England's answer to Bob Dylan. In 1966 he evolved his style and became a superstar in the USA. Sunshine Superman reached #1, Mellow Yellow got to #2 both in 1966. Epistle To Dippy was his next release, peaking this week at # 19. As an audience member would answer Dick Clark's question of what they thought about the song-" I give it an 8. You can dance to it"
Finally for this week, here is a song I'd normally reserve for my occasional Music To Cringe With posts. I am pleased to say this record never touched the Top #100 charts in the USA. But for some reason it was huge in England in March 1967. So huge that on that month it won the Eurovision Award for Best Song and was #1 in England as well as #2 in Australia. As terrible as the song is, the dancers are even worse. Here is Sandie Shaw. Oompah..Oompah..Oompah
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 14, 2017 15:36:08 GMT -5
On this day in 1998 Rick Rubin took out this ad in Billboard magazine. I couldn't agree more.  |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 14, 2017 16:20:45 GMT -5
Not that awards are the be all end all...but
On this day in 1973 Kris Kristofferson won the Grammy for Best Country Song...for one of the great songs of the 70s. Help Me Make it Through the Night.
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Post by berkley on Mar 14, 2017 18:29:00 GMT -5
It'll probably come as no surprise that I'm a Herman's Hermits fan. I love most of their hits - Mrs Brown You've Got a Lovely Daughter, No Milk Today, There's a Kind of a Hush, etc
I was just looking up the wiki article for Puppet on a String to check something and was amused to read this quote: from none other than ... Ms. Sandie Shaw herself!
I wonder if Alistair Maclean was influenced by its popularity when he titled one of his thrillers "Puppet on a Chain" - maybe the phrase was in the air at the time? Of course it was a stock phrase long before the song and remains one now long after the song's been more or less forgotten, so there wasn't necessarily any connection.
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Post by Mormel on Mar 14, 2017 18:57:28 GMT -5
50 Years Ago Today- March Week 3 1967 And now, finally, after a 6 month hiatus to recharge their batteries, we have a new Beatles single release and after a few weeks on the charts, it has captured the #1 spot. And the real cool thing about Beatles singles are that both sides of the 45 are excellent and both sides are chartbusters. First up-The new #1 song in the USA As I previously mentioned, The Beatles filmed a music video to accompany their singles. They are no longer touring and no longer travelling to other countries and appearing on TV variety shows. Instead, all their time and efforts will be focused on recording music and other artistic endeavors. This move is pretty unheard of since a music band makes most of their money from live appearances. Speaks volumes to the Beatles decision that their art comes first It quite confused me when I saw the Penny Lane video for the first time, as I had been unaware that there had been music videos at all in the 60s. Where were they typically played before the days of MTV? I'm aware of some of them, like Bowie's 'Space Oddity', but were they more of a novelty by artists who were exploring the visual medium a little bit? |
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