|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 14, 2017 15:50:00 GMT -5
So, covering the Losers in my Kirby 4th World thread has me jonesin' to look at other war comics. I grew up reading any comic I got my hands on; but, war comics were special favorites. I devoured 60s war movies (Guns of Navarone, Where Eagles Dare, The Dirty Dozen, The Great Escape) and tv shows (Combat! Rat Patrol, Hogan's Heroes) and read books about WW2 history. It also helped that my dad was an aviation buff and had served in the Air Force, for a few years, in Strategic Air Command, with a B-36 bomber squadron. That's the plane; a jet-assisted, prop intercontinental bomber. I live on the former site of Chanute Air Force Base, in Illinois, and when I was a midshipman at the Univ. of Illinois, the base still had a B-36 on display (it was removed when the base closed). As I say, I went through college on an NROTC scholarship, so the military has always been of interest to me (though active duty gave me enough to cure the desire to spend my life in it). War comics had their own readership, beyond the general audience of other comics. There were fans who read nothing but war comics (same with westerns). Their heyday was from the 1950s to the 1960s, though DC published them into the 80s and they still make sporadic appearances, via things like The Nam, Enemy Ace: War Idyll and War in Heaven, Sgt Rock: The Lost Battalion, Vietnam Journal (and Desert Storm Journal) and a few others. The audience also included a lot of military personnel and they were big sellers at the PX. However, changing tastes and Vietnam changed most of that. My aim is to cover great stories from across comics history and companies. I will mostly concentrate on the more historical war comics, though I might also look at the more outlandish, as well as the hybrids, like Blackhawk and Airfighters. Here's an idea of some of the things I'd like to discuss....
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2017 17:35:34 GMT -5
Looking forward to your reviews. I read a ton of DC & Charlton war titles as a kid.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2017 17:41:55 GMT -5
This one area that I'm familiar with ... I'm curious what you have to say about this and I'll try to assist you when I can.
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,222
|
Post by Confessor on Jun 15, 2017 2:21:02 GMT -5
Nice wide ranging selection of example titles there, Cody -- it's especially cool to see The 'Nam and Berlin: The Seven Dwarves listed. But...but *choke* no Charley's War? For shame, for shame...I'm one of the, not inconsiderable number of comics fans, who consider Charley's War to be just about the best war comic ever created.
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 15, 2017 9:25:24 GMT -5
Nice wide ranging selection of example titles there, Cody -- it's especially cool to see The 'Nam and Berlin: The Seven Dwarves listed. But...but *choke* no Charley's War? For shame, for shame...I'm one of the, not inconsiderable number of comics fans, who consider Charley's War to be just about the best war comic ever created. Actually, I had an image posted there; but, it seems to have disappeared. Must have been the link or I overwrote it. I definitely want to look at Charley's War, as I have scans of it and some of the other British war comics.
|
|
|
Post by brutalis on Jun 15, 2017 13:55:14 GMT -5
really looking forward to your reviews and thoughts codystarbuck! Never had many war comics as a youth but followed the DC mainstays of Weird War and Unknown Soldier during the later 70's and early 80's. Now as an adult been slowly building up the war and western library as I can find and/or afford. This will be fun!
|
|
|
Post by String on Jun 15, 2017 20:44:50 GMT -5
A great focus for a review thread. My own reading of war comics has been rather limited to a scattering of various titles over the years, mostly G.I. Combat if anything. So looking forward to learning more!
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Jun 15, 2017 21:26:25 GMT -5
Reading comics since the early 1960's, War comics unfortunately is one of my meagerly represented genres. There were a few however I really enjoyed. From DC, Enemy Ace was a big favorite of mine. I also enjoyed the early years of The Unknown Soldier. Another comic from the mid-60's that is vastly unappreciated is Dell's Total War. It debuted in 1965 and drawn by the legend himself, Wally Wood. The premise was intriguing: Suddenly an unknown army appears, popping up around the earth, with slightly futuristic weapons and bent on world conquest. Wally Wood stayed on for a few issues then left to start up Tower Comics. Total War also had a name change to M.A.R.S. Patrol and lasted about 10 issues
Of the covers you have on display, the big miss seems to be Sgt Fury. There were many excellent issues to be found within it's run, more so when Gary Friedrich took over the writing. A funny thing about that:
When I was reading Marvel and DC back in 1967-1969, I kept a ranking each month for best to worst comics in my humble opinion. Then at the end of the year, I averaged each title to see what I considered best of the year. And in 1968 I was shocked to find that I thought Sgt Fury the best of them all. Actually, I shouldn't have been surprised with the great storytelling Friedrich provided as well as running subplots. That plus some spectacular art from John Severin made it stand out of the pack. The run from about #45 to #76 is first class
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 15, 2017 22:33:10 GMT -5
Reading comics since the early 1960's, War comics unfortunately is one of my meagerly represented genres. There were a few however I really enjoyed. From DC, Enemy Ace was a big favorite of mine. I also enjoyed the early years of The Unknown Soldier. Another comic from the mid-60's that is vastly unappreciated is Dell's Total War. It debuted in 1965 and drawn by the legend himself, Wally Wood. The premise was intriguing: Suddenly an unknown army appears, popping up around the earth, with slightly futuristic weapons and bent on world conquest. Wally Wood stayed on for a few issues then left to start up Tower Comics. Total War also had a name change to M.A.R.S. Patrol and lasted about 10 issues Of the covers you have on display, the big miss seems to be Sgt Fury. There were many excellent issues to be found within it's run, more so when Gary Friedrich took over the writing. A funny thing about that: When I was reading Marvel and DC back in 1967-1969, I kept a ranking each month for best to worst comics in my humble opinion. Then at the end of the year, I averaged each title to see what I considered best of the year. And in 1968 I was shocked to find that I thought Sgt Fury the best of them all. Actually, I shouldn't have been surprised with the great storytelling Friedrich provided as well as running subplots. That plus some spectacular art from John Severin made it stand out of the pack. The run from about #45 to #76 is first class I'll be hitting Sgt Fury. Most of my favorites are from the Friedrich/Ayers/Severin years. I also have some Capt. Savage and his Leatherneck Raiders and some of the lesser Marvel war comics. Don't have the earlier Atlas ones, though. I agree on Total War/Mars Patrol and was planning on hitting that in the Other Guys Thread, as I wanted to do some Gold Key and Charlton stuff, soon. It's a bit more sci-fi than "war" comic, to my tastes, though it overlaps both worlds. I'm similarly torn about Christopher Moeller's Iron Empires books and Alien Legion. Both are very much military, in a sci-fi setting. I also thought of the Marvano Forever War; but, I have already covered it in the Other Guys thread. I'm mulling over No Pasaran!, from Vittorio Giardino (published in the uS by NBM). It's set in the Spanish Civil War, with Giardino's Max Friedman, who is more of an intelligence agent, rather than a soldier. It does give a pretty good look at the war, though, which was the dress rehearsal for WW2. GI Joe is one I'm on the fence about; I only read the early issues, though I have scans of the whole run. The military accuracy is negligent, but I could say that about a lot of war comics (Sgt Fury was all kinds of wrong, at times). Maybe a few. I always had trouble with the badly rendered weapons. To me, it was always Nick Fury-lite, and I don't really want to bash the series, which is a favorite of the younger crowd. To me, if it didn't have a guy in a fuzzy beard and hair, it wasn't GI Joe (I had the red-headed one, in the early 70s). I'd like to hit some of the Franco-Belgian stuff, like Buck Danny and Tangy et Lavedure; but, the earlier Buck Danny's aren't available in English and I only have a few pdfs of Tangy, in French, which will leave a lot to interpretation. Rogue trooper is a possibility, though, again, very sci-fi. I don't mind the sci-fi aspect, as long as there is a military or very definite war theme to it. That said, I'm not averse to things that occurred in wartime; but aren't war comics, per se, like Holocaust-related stories, historical accounts (like Max Brooks' book on the Harlem Hellfighters) or similar fare. First up, given that Sam Glanzman and I both served in the Navy (45 years apart), I will start things off with a USS Stevens story or two, as well as the history of the actual vessel.
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Jun 15, 2017 22:41:56 GMT -5
I'm not all that into like war stories as a rule, especially the WWI and (more often) WWII comics, movies, etc that are usually meant by that term. The farther back in time a war story goes the more interesting I find it, so maybe I need a buffer of some kind to separate it from our world of today.
But I will probably try to read Charley's War and the The War in the Trenches sometime because of the critical regard they're held in, and maybe a few things like Severin's run on Sgt Fury and Wally Wood on Total War just for the artwork - though I must say, to me a war comic isn't going to give any artist much scope to show the full range of their talent. How many bombed-out towns and unshaven soldiers do I need to see?
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 16, 2017 0:12:35 GMT -5
I'm not all that into like war stories as a rule, especially the WWI and (more often) WWII comics, movies, etc that are usually meant by that term. The farther back in time a war story goes the more interesting I find it, so maybe I need a buffer of some kind to separate it from our world of today. But I will probably try to read Charley's War and the The War in the Trenches sometime because of the critical regard they're held in, and maybe a few things like Severin's run on Sgt Fury and Wally Wood on Total War just for the artwork - though I must say, to me a war comic isn't going to give any artist much scope to show the full range of their talent. How many bombed-out towns and unshaven soldiers do I need to see? Well, that depends on the artist. Sam Glanzman's A Sailor's Story is filled with all kinds of stuff, from the beauty of the sea to the horror of combat, to the everyday drudgery of basic maintenance. Enemy Ace had some tremendous aerial visuals, as well as some very haunting scenes. Kubert was at his most expressive in some of that, with Tarzan a close second. EC and DC hit other time periods in their comics; Walt Simonson impressed Archie Goodwin with a Civil War-based tale, that helped get him Manhunter. One of the things I enjoyed about the DC war comics, when I saw them in the early 70s (some contemporary, some reprints or just older comics) was that the general level of the writing was a cut above a lot of the superhero stuff. Some of the mystery books had that, too. Sure, there are plenty of cliches; but, you also got something more, from time to time. I still recall an Unknown Soldier story, where a ragtag band of men, from various occupied countries, are brought together for a diversionary tactic, involving a rubber tank (like the ones used to keep the Germans believing that Normandy was just a feint). Of course casualties are high; but, it was an unusual piece with interesting character inter-dynamics and a rather poignant ending. The other thing was that, under Joe Kubert, they didn't try to glorify "war" as much as older war comics had (other than Harvey Kurtzman's stuff, at EC). He was the one who added the tag-line, "Make War No More,' which I took for my title. There was one Sgt. Rock story about a piece of ground in the Mediterranean (I think, probably North Africa) that had seen battle after battle through the centuries, illustrating the stupidity of war. The Lonely War of Capt. Willy Schultz was a unique idea of a German-American, falsely accused of murder, who ends up fleeing into the North African desert and falling into a German panzer unit, where he is faced with the dilemma of killing friends on either side. Sam Glanzman did the art on those, which was a bit starker than his DC stuff (DC had better production, which helped). To me, in fiction, war is conflict at its highest and brings out many dramatic possibilities and the best war comic stories captured that. There's plenty of junk there, as with any genre. Still, some of the stories that struck with me in great detail came from war comics. Charlton had one, that I saw in one of the Modern Comics reprints, of a group of soldiers, protecting civilians in a temple, during the Korean War. They have food airdropped, while they are surrounded, and have to try to keep everyone alive until help can come. It hit on a lot of human misery in these kind of things and reminded me quite a bit of the Rock Hudson movie, Battle Hymn.
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 16, 2017 21:48:39 GMT -5
Not comics; but, just saw a news item about the USS Fitzgerald colliding with a Philippine-flagged cargo carrier. Merchant ships were always considered a menace on the seas, by the Navy. They steer as direct a course as possible and they don't give a flying FOXTROT about their hazard to other vessel's navigation. Half the time, you can't raise anyone on their bridge, when you try to hail them, as they put the helm on autopilot and let it go. Dangerous, dangerous sailors. Not all; but way to many.
The next biggest hazard was entering or leaving port, on a weekend. Way too many drunken idiots out there ignoring channel markers, oblivious to traffic around them, trying to come up close to large vessels, with big wakes. We came into San Diego, on my first midshipman training cruise, and a couple of idiots on jet skis tried to get alongside (this was an "oiler", a refuelling ship) and were thrown off by our wake. Our Combat Information Center was going nuts trying to keep track of all of the radar contacts.
You have a lot of ocean out there; but, you'd be amazed how close you can come to hitting another vessel. The most logical courses often cross paths.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2017 12:10:57 GMT -5
Army at War, Enemy Ace, and G.I. Combat are the one that I'm very familiar with codystarbuck.
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 17, 2017 18:51:19 GMT -5
Enemy Ace ran in Showcase, Our Army At War, and Star Spangled War. Mlle Marie was in Star Spangled War, Gunner & Sarge were in Our Fighting Forces, then were joined by Capt Storm and Johnny Cloud (who had their own titles) as the Losers. Haunted Tank was in GI Combat. Sgt Rock was in Our Army at War, which was retitled Sgt Rock, in the 70s. Unknown Soldier started out in Our Army at War, then moved over to Star Spangled War, which was renamed Unknown Soldier, in the 70s. The War That Time Forgot was in Star Spangled War. Gravedigger was in Men of War, Creature Commandos were in Weird War, Viking Commando in All out War. Balloon Buster (Matt Savage) was in Men of War.
Blackhawk appeared in his own title and Military Comics, which became Modern Comics.
Lonely War of Capt. Willy Schultz was in Fightin' Army. The Iron Corporal (also by Will Franz and Sam Glanzman) was in Army War Heroes (another Charlton war book). Those were the only major recurring war characters at Charlton, though you could count the Fightin' 5. They appeared in The Peacemaker and in their own title.
Almost everyone else appeared in their own eponymous book. Charley's War was published in Battle Pictures Weekly.
A little remembered one from 80s Marvel was Semper Fi, which I will cover. John Severin did a bit of work in that one. I actually saw an issue of that at the Navy Exchange, on base. In the 70s, Marvel briefly launched a line of war books, including Combat Kelly and the Deadly Dozen (Combat Kelly was an old Atlas character) and War is Hell (an anthology). Captain Savage began in 1968 and lasted 19 issues. Issues 2-5 feature the origin of HYDRA, as the Marines team up with a Japanese squad to take on the renegades.
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Jun 17, 2017 20:50:20 GMT -5
Our Army at ar #218 Cover by Joe Kubert, who was editing the book. The first story is "Medic", with Sgt Rock. Rock and Easy Company are part of the Allied forces in North Africa, in Tunisia. The battle is hard fought and a quiet medic does his job, running from wounded man to wounded man, patching them up, aiding as best he can. However, Bulldozer seems to have a problem with him. He feels that fighting soldiers will win this and if the medic isn't fighting, he isn't helping. Rock chews him out, but Bulldozer goes on. We see Easy in Sicily and Italy, the silent medic doing his job, with little sleep, patching the wounded, comforting the dying. In Italy, in the mountains, Easy is attacked from above by Germans, hurling "potato masher" grenades down on them. It sets off a rock slide, burying Rock and Bulldozer. The medic charges out, ignoring bullets flying at him and digs out Rock and Dozer. The medic gets them out and starts patching their wounds. A German patrol finds them and Rock yells for the medic to run. Instead, he shields the two men with his body. Wild Man and Little Sure Shot and the rest of Easy get there and wipe out the Germans, saving Rock and Dozer. The medic is dead and Dozer cradles him in his arms, dumbfounded. They bury the brave man and move on. Excellent tale from Robert Kanigher and Russ Heath. Kanigher lays it on a bit thick; but, the story demonstrates the job of a medic; to treat the wounded, unarmed, while the battle rages. A cry that every combat soldier hears in their nightmares is "Medic....medic!!" The combat medics had the toughest job of all; try to keep the wounded alive and their own casualties were high. Countless tales have come down about the heroism of medics on the battlefield, running into enemy fire to save a wounded man, dragging them to safety, while ignoring their own wounds. One such medic was Corporal Desmond Doss, of Lynchburg, VA. Doss was a Seventh Day Adventist, who believed in nonviolence. He entered military service, despite being eligible for a deferment, as a shipyard worker, and became a medic, with the 77th Infantry. He won two Bronze Stars for heroism under fire at Guam and the Philippines. He was awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor for heroism at Okinawa. His citation can be read here. He carried 75 wounded men to safety, while under enemy fire. He himself was wounded and treated his own wounds. He crawled off a litter to treat a more seriously wounded man! His actions were recently depicted in the film Hacksaw Ridge. That is a hero. The second story, "The Tortoise and the Hare Went to War," by John Reed and Sam Burlockoff, tells the tale of a pair of brothers, one a tanker, the other a fighter pilot. Little brother Fighter Pilot pulls Big Brothers tank out of the fire, when it is attacked, first by knocking out a German tank, then by driving off panzer grenadiers when they are attacking the American tank. big Brother is able to return the favor when Little Brother's plane is hit, allowing him to make a landing, on the tank! This was more than a bit cliched and silly and is the lesser story of the book. It was typical of filler stories in comics, in any era. The last story, "Frightened Boys...or Fighting Men," is by Sam Glanzman and is the first of his USS Stevens stories. The USS Stevens (DD 479) is steaming in the Pacific, in 1942, when it comes under fire. This is a new crew and it will be their first big test. We see Cmdr. TA Kelly, the skipper, look aft at the fantail section of the destroyer, where the new men are manning the 20mm anti-aircraft guns. This is their baptism of fire. The 20s are pouring it on, backed up by 40mm guns and 5 in guns. The men acquit themselves well; but, on the horizon, a low flying plane is approaching. It is a kamikaze and it makes its attack, slamming into the ship. The men react and fight to dislodge the wrecked plane and dump it over the side, before the burning fuel can set off its bombs. They succeed and save their ship from damage. The captain is pleased with the performance of his men and secures from General Quarters. Glanzman sets the tone for his personal USS Stevens stories here. This is fictionalized, though based on his experiences. Kamikaze attacks didn't emerge until later in the war, when Japan was in more desperate straights. However, the Stevens did face kamikaze attacks later, in the Philippines and Guam. Unlike previous stories, Glanzman is depicting the real deal. This isn't a fanciful tale from the imagination; it is a reality that he illustrates with harrowing precision. he shows us how the men of the Stevens fought the enemy, with their guns, depth charges and torpedoes. We see them at General Quarters, during a battle. These would be the most accurate stories within the war books, as Glanzman was there; Kanigher wasn't. The USS Stevens (DD 479) was laid down at the Charleston Naval Shipyards, in December 30, 1941 and christened on June 24, 1942. This story is set in August of 1942; but, the ship wasn't commissioned until 1943. It was part of the plane guard for Winston Churchill's flight to Washington, to meet with Pres. Roosevelt. It then took part in convoy duty, before transiting the Panama Canal to the Pacific. It took part in warm up raids at Tarawa and Marcus islands, before getting its real baptism by fire at Kwajalein. The Stevens originally carried a float plane, which was launched via a catapult, then recovered with a crane. The idea was to scout ahead for the destroyer and also launch torpedo attacks. It proved problematic and Glanzman's A Sailor's Story depicts a Japanese attack, due to their misidentifying the ship as a cruiser, which would have had a catapult for a spotter plane. The plane proved problematic and was removed, with more firepower added. The ship later took part on operations in the Philippines and survived a typhoon that snak 3 other ships, with few survivors. Sam Glanzman served onboard the Stevens and was discharged from the Navy in 1946. He had started in comics in 1939, for Centaur, working on Amazing Man and then did work for Harvey. After the war, he didn't return to comics. Instead, he worked as a manual laborer, until marrying in the 1950s. he then went to work at Republic Aviation. He returned to comics, working for Eastman's Heroic Comics, while also ghosting for his brother Lou, on children's books. In 1958, he began working for Charlton. Glanzman produced a ton of work for them, including a ton of war comics, especially The Lonely War of Capt. Willy Schultz (in Fightin' Army) and The Iron Corporal (in Army War Heroes), as well as some amazing work on Hercules. Joe Kubert brought him to DC and is also the one who greenlit this first USS Stevens story. Glanzman would go on to do many stories for DC, including a long run on the Haunted Tank, as well as more USS Stevens stories. He contributed to Marvel's Savage Tales and Semper Fi, as well as an issue of The Nam, before the publication of A Sailor's Story. A second volume followed and he reteamed with Will Franz to create The Eagle, for Caliber. These days, Sam is 92 and one of the last links to the Golden Age of comics and one of the decreasing number of Silver Age artists. His brother Davis Charles (DC) Glanzman also worked in comics. Brother Louis worked in children's book illustration. Both A Sailor's Story and his USS Stevens stories have been reprinted by Dover Books.
|
|