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Post by MWGallaher on Nov 24, 2020 7:18:28 GMT -5
^^ Always though that the cover above was a bit of a nod to this one: Putting those two covers next to each other shows why this is my least favorite period of DC. Nothing against Aparo, but the design and coloring in the earlier cover is so much more dramatic. (And where's the chain holding up the near end of Batgirl's bunk?)
Once more, don't blame my guy Aparo for this stuff! This is from the letters page of #493, just a few issues back:  Whenever you see weird leg positions, like squatting or standing like you need to go to the men's room (like Robin here), that's a hint that Ross Andru was dictating the composition. |
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Post by MDG on Nov 24, 2020 9:32:34 GMT -5
Putting those two covers next to each other shows why this is my least favorite period of DC. Nothing against Aparo, but the design and coloring in the earlier cover is so much more dramatic. (And where's the chain holding up the near end of Batgirl's bunk?)
Once more, don't blame my guy Aparo for this stuff! This is from the letters page of #493, just a few issues back: Whenever you see weird leg positions, like squatting or standing like you need to go to the men's room (like Robin here), that's a hint that Ross Andru was dictating the composition. I never blame the artist for bad composition on a mainstream book cover, since it rarely starts or ends with them. |
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Post by tarkintino on Nov 24, 2020 10:05:02 GMT -5
Putting those two covers next to each other shows why this is my least favorite period of DC. Nothing against Aparo, but the design and coloring in the earlier cover is so much more dramatic. (And where's the chain holding up the near end of Batgirl's bunk?)
Once more, don't blame my guy Aparo for this stuff! This is from the letters page of #493, just a few issues back: Whenever you see weird leg positions, like squatting or standing like you need to go to the men's room (like Robin here), that's a hint that Ross Andru was dictating the composition. Ehh..Ross Andru... that guy. |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 24, 2020 10:26:20 GMT -5
Detective Comics #498 (January 1981)  Batgirl: "The Tightening Web!" Script: Cary Burkett Pencils: José Delbo Inks: Joe Giella Colors: Gene D'Angelo Letters: Albert DeGuzman Grade: B Maybe it's the page length limitations (this is usually a 10 pager and sometimes a 12 pager, but this month it's an 8 pager), but Burkett seems only able to provide deep characterization or solid conflicts each issue; never both. This time around, there's nothing particularly interesting being done with a Babs Gordon who is presumably watching her world crash around her as she is being tried for murder, but the story is finally advancing as Batgirl hunts down whoever is framing her.  Nope. It's not really her. She was being blackmailed to help and doesn't know who she was working for. Considering how few characters have actually earned any attention in this feature thus far, it likely comes down to the two most developed supporting cast members: Bob Barton and Richard Bender. But Barton is far too obvious of a suspect:  So I continue to suspect it's Richard Bender, the one who is pining for Babs but who may well have a dark side to him. After all, Delbo keeps drawing him with a maniacal look that belongs more on a villain than a sympathetic character:  Any other solution will be a lot cheaper. So it is great to see the plot finally moving forward a little, with Batgirl on the trail of whoever has set her up, but as the action gets heated, José Delbo's inconsistencies become even more apparent. For example, what the hell is wrong with Batgirl's arm?  That thing has got to extend to her knees. Finally, it's really starting to amuse me watching the header for each issue continually try to get Batgirl's occupation right. First, we were given this totally incorrect statement:  (she hasn't been a senator since before Burkett started writing) Then, last issue, the header returned with this closer-to-accurate statement:  Except that, well, she's the DIRECTOR of social services for a major federally funded firm. So, this issue, we're getting closer still:  Technically, that's true. But, ya know, she's a DIRECTOR there, not a member of the typing pool. Anyway, the story is progressing. If Burkett can give us deep characterization AND action, this storyline just might go in interesting places. Delbo, on the other hand...sheesh. |
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Post by profh0011 on Nov 24, 2020 12:38:01 GMT -5
Just the other day, I was trying to remember where I'd seen Jose Delbo's art, and the only thing I could think of was Batgirl. I was right! I'd commented that his work was "servicable"-- not bad, but never great, and almost never memorable. (Maybe he was DC's answer to Dick Ayers?)
I was just re-reading a comic Delbo illustrated... the 3rd of 3 parts of the 1979 Western / Gold Key BUCK ROGERS movie adaptation. Due to the common practice of such comics being done before a movie was finished (including both the designs and the writing), the comic had MANY drastic, noticable differences from the film. There were 2 very different edits of the film between theatres and TV, though I suspect there was a 3rd, earlier edit that nobody ever got to see, which made more sense than the other 2. Ironically, the comic-- though awkward and looking so different-- in several spots made FAR more sense than either version of the movie.
You can also tell what a rush job the comic was, as it was done as 3 issues-- EACH with a different artist!
1 - Frank Bolle 2 - Alden McWilliams 3 - Jose Delbo
McWilliams did by far the best chapter, Delbo coming in 2nd. (I generally love Bolle's work, but his part of the thing was disappointing in the extreme. Oh well!)
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Post by shaxper on Nov 24, 2020 13:11:09 GMT -5
Just the other day, I was trying to remember where I'd seen Jose Delbo's art, and the only thing I could think of was Batgirl. I was right! I'd commented that his work was "servicable"-- not bad, but never great, and almost never memorable. (Maybe he was DC's answer to Dick Ayers?) I'd always assumed by the name that José Delbo was part of the wave of Latin American pencilers who had gotten their start in the U.S. by working for Warren Publishing, but apparently he got his American start at Dell. In hindsight, I doubt he was good enough for Warren. Delbo went on to pencil Rainbow Bright, Transformers, and NFL Super Pro... |
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 24, 2020 13:27:44 GMT -5
Just the other day, I was trying to remember where I'd seen Jose Delbo's art, and the only thing I could think of was Batgirl. I was right! I'd commented that his work was "servicable"-- not bad, but never great, and almost never memorable. (Maybe he was DC's answer to Dick Ayers?) I'd always assumed by the name that José Delbo was part of the wave of Latin American pencilers who had gotten their start in the U.S. by working for Warren Publishing, but apparently he got his American start at Dell. In hindsight, I doubt he was good enough for Warren. Delbo went on to pencil Rainbow Bright, Transformers, and NFL Super Pro...If he'd only done US 1, it would have been the Mt. Rushmore of Marvel titles. |
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Post by MDG on Nov 24, 2020 13:51:19 GMT -5
I'd always assumed by the name that José Delbo was part of the wave of Latin American pencilers who had gotten their start in the U.S. by working for Warren Publishing, but apparently he got his American start at Dell. In hindsight, I doubt he was good enough for Warren. Delbo went on to pencil Rainbow Bright, Transformers, and NFL Super Pro...If he'd only done US 1, it would have been the Mt. Rushmore of Marvel titles. Delbo also did some work at Tower, which I didn't know 'til I picked up a page that may be from Tower and may be by him--it was in my "sell" pile for a long time, but I pulled it back in and need to try tracking it down again.
But any time I saw a Delbo credit at DC in the 70s--yeeeesh!
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Post by codystarbuck on Nov 24, 2020 23:18:54 GMT -5
Just the other day, I was trying to remember where I'd seen Jose Delbo's art, and the only thing I could think of was Batgirl. I was right! I'd commented that his work was "servicable"-- not bad, but never great, and almost never memorable. (Maybe he was DC's answer to Dick Ayers?) I was just re-reading a comic Delbo illustrated... the 3rd of 3 parts of the 1979 Western / Gold Key BUCK ROGERS movie adaptation. Due to the common practice of such comics being done before a movie was finished (including both the designs and the writing), the comic had MANY drastic, noticable differences from the film. There were 2 very different edits of the film between theatres and TV, though I suspect there was a 3rd, earlier edit that nobody ever got to see, which made more sense than the other 2. Ironically, the comic-- though awkward and looking so different-- in several spots made FAR more sense than either version of the movie. You can also tell what a rush job the comic was, as it was done as 3 issues-- EACH with a different artist! 1 - Frank Bolle 2 - Alden McWilliams 3 - Jose Delbo McWilliams did by far the best chapter, Delbo coming in 2nd. (I generally love Bolle's work, but his part of the thing was disappointing in the extreme. Oh well!)
The artists were working with little or no reference material, which can most especially be seen in the Draconian space ships, which look like something Werner Von Braun designed, in the 50s.  It doesn't look like they had any reference material for Pamela Hensley, at all, as the model isn't even close. The likenesses for Henry Silva, Gil Gerard and Tim O'Connor are generic, but close enough to match the basic appearance; but, Ardala is way off, including costuming. The city, as well. Buck's ship is wrong, looking nothing like a space shuttle. It looks like they may have had a few publicity photo of the heroes and Silva, as Kane, the starfighters (which were actually left over from Battlestar Galactica, as an alternate design for the Vipers) and not much else, except Twiki and Dr Theopolis. I believe they were working from the original script, which was done as a tv movie, but released theatrically because the Battlestar Galactica pilot had done well in theaters. They re-edited the footage for tv and added some stuff to set up the tv series and, I think, used some alternate shots, too. Of course, the DVD set came with the theatrical cut and didn't include the tv broadcast so I can check it out. The novelization follows the plot of the comic, which is also how I recall the tv edit featured things, with Buck sentenced to exile in the ruins of Chicago and it being revealed that Counselor Apol, of the Computer Council, had been programmed by Kane and was acting under that programming. I would tend to agree on your assessment of the three chapters. McWillimas does really breathe some life into things and has more dynamic layouts, for the battle between the Earth starfighters (with Buck at the controls) and the pirate Marauders (secretly the Draconians). Also, the scenes of Buck and Ardala have some nice facials and body language. Delbo did a lot of tv and movie stuff for Dell and Western/Gold Key; plus, he did a lot of the Gold Key horror stuff. However, he was a long running artist on Turok and I always liked his work there. He was also the artist on the Gold Key Yellow Submarine adaptation.  |
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 7:12:45 GMT -5
Detective Comics #499 (February 1981)  Batgirl: "Chains of Guilt!" Script: Cary Burkett Pencils: José Delbo Inks: Joe Giella Colors: Gene D'Angelo Letters: John Costanza Grade: B+ The 8 page conclusion to this building storyline finally showcases all that Burkett is capable of. Batgirl begins the issue in chains, her alter ego being tried for murder, and yet she remains a true hero in her thoughts and demeanor:  Batgirl spends two pages struggling in the face of complications to free her laser torch from her utility belt and get to the surface. She feels the pressure, but never loses her cool. If this were Batman, we wouldn't even blink at his perfection in the face of danger, but having watched Batgirl build herself back up from terrified ex-hero to what she is here, it's thrilling. We fully understand how easy it would be for her to descend into panic and do not take her newly rediscovered inner strength for granted. Burkett has created a character who, while more flawed than Batman, is also now more compelling than Batman as a consequence. I'd argued in my previous review that Burkett was offering us deep characterization or big action each issue, but never both. Here we've got the two working together beautifully. Additionally, the plot offers us a mystery that continues to grow more elaborate:  a ticking clock, and a heroic dilemma for Babs:  The pay-off is the only real disappointment. First off, Batgirl manages to take down the thugs, free Doreen, AND make it to court on time. Second, the villain is neither the obvious Bob Barton nor Richard Bender, the perfect solution that we'd never suspect. In fact, neither of them even get a mention in this issue. Instead, it's a guy we met for all of three panels last issue. He had been there just to deliver backstory, given no characterization nor motives of his own, and now he's the solution to the big mystery for reasons we couldn't possibly have suspected prior to this moment  By the way, it has always bothered me that no one even suspects Batgirl and Barbara Gordon are the same person. Both have blazing red hair (not very common in the U.S.), are approximately the same age, and have the same body build. It was weird that both moved back to Gotham from Washington D.C. at the same time, and it's really weird to see Batgirl in court, fighting Barbara Gordon's battle when she is suspiciously absent, only to have Babs show up immediately after Batgirl leaves. At the end, even Jim Gordon wonders how long it will take her boyfriend to piece this together, but what about the hundreds of potential jurors all witnessing this display as well? While still nowhere near as engaging as Burkett's first storyline for Batgirl, this was a mostly well-done conclusion that further extends the sense of just how "back in business" Batgirl is after her near-death and near-retirement in 'Tec #491 and #492. It's not solid A level storytelling, but it's getting closer. Incidentally, while it's clear that no one is particularly concerned with the quality of work Delbo is churning out here:  , it never hurts to kiss the boss's butt a little, just to be safe:  |
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 7:41:32 GMT -5
Side Note: Detective Comics #500 (March 1981)The big Anniversary issue pushes the Batgirl feature out entirely (surprising, as it offers SIX back-up stories featuring classic Detective Comics former residents from Martian Manhunter, Elongated Man, and Slam Bradley to Hawkman and Mysto the Magician Detective), but it does make one meaningful contribution to Batgirl's back-story. This is the first time we ever get a glimpse of Batgirl's mother (via the wonder of time travel):  Interesting, by the way, that this big tribute to Detective Comics' past seems to go out of its way NOT to acknowledge any characters or features that came out of the Batman Family Era. And, in Robin news, lead story writer Alan Brennert (not Gerry Conway??) writes Dick Grayson with his traditional, goody-goody characterization, entirely unaware of either what is happening in the pages of New Teen Titans nor in this book's very own sister title.
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 8:34:45 GMT -5
Detective Comics #501 (April 1981)  Batgirl: "The Five-Fold Revenge of Dr. Voodoo" Script: Cary Burkett Pencils: José Delbo Inks: Joe Giella Colors: Gene D'Angelo Letters: John Costanza Grade: B- Oh good. It's the return of absurd cliche villain Dr. Voodoo, and only five issues after his previous appearance. Fortunately, Burkett uses the character a little better this time:  Well, no. Not in that scene, where we learn he has been following Batgirl for weeks now, totally unnoticed while in full costume. Rather, it's this bit here -- the idea that he needs to completely emotionally break Batgirl in order to get his revenge upon her:  This is what Burkett does best: put Batgirl in a situation that should understandably break her and then have her triumph. We start to see the breaking already, in response to Batgirl's ally, Jeff, getting seriously injured in an explosion Batgirl is led to believe was intended for her:   Voodoo next manipulates Babs' boyfriend, Jim, as a means of further breaking her. It's interesting; it's promising, but Delbo's art (and Babs' enormous face and bulgy eyes) continue to get in the way.  Of course, he's still kissing the boss's butt in an effort to stay on the feature:  And yet, for whatever reason, the letter column indicates that, even though the feature is getting positive responses, it is being sidelined for issues #503 and #504. Batgirl will be appearing in the main story for #503, but no reason is offered for her feature's absence in #504, where it will be replaced with a Commissioner Gordon story. |
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 10:07:44 GMT -5
I should probably apologize for the rapid pace at which I am blazing through these reviews this morning. These days, I'm a stay-at-home dad, taking off from work (unpaid) to help my kids emotionally survive remote learning. Most days, it takes me an entire morning and early afternoon to complete one review with divided attention while also staying on top of three high-anxiety children. Today, for the first time in ages, I only have one kid with me, and there is no school. He is happily residing in the world of Minecraft Java Edition while I review my heart out. I may not get another chance like this anytime soon, so I'm sorry if it makes this thread a little harder to stay abreast of today. Detective Comics #502 (May 1981)  Batgirl: "To Live A Nightmare!" Script: Cary Burkett Pencils: José Delbo Inks: Joe Giella Colors: Gene D'Angelo Letters: John Costanza Grade: A- Just when you think Dr. Voodoo has broken Batgirl to the furthest extent possible, Burkett takes it somewhere I truly didn't expect him to go:   That's right. He's forcing Babs to repeat the traumatic moment that nearly killed her and then nearly caused her to quit at the very beginning of this run in 'Tec #491. Every time I think we've been given the all-clear that Babs has finally and completely healed from that incident, Burkett serves up a new way to require Babs to take her recovery to the next level. Maybe that's real-life: trauma doesn't go away with one cathartic healing moment. Anyway, how Batgirl approaches this is powerful and damn admirable:  and MAN does she endure:   ...truly proving just how strong she has become since her descent all those issues back:  I love this. I utterly love this. If only Delbo's art could keep up. Perhaps the most striking aspect of this story though is that the true proverbial straw that breaks the camel's back isn't even a part of Dr. Voodoo's machinations. It's a very real byproduct of all Babs has endured as of late -- being detained and tried for murder and still trying to live a dual life as Batgirl:  The storm of anxiety and self-doubt is so real and so relatable. Really, it's a convenience having some arch villain impose so much of this upon her. In truth, this is the story of a woman recovering from trauma and trying to maintain a personal and professional life in the process, while those aspects of her life refuse to stop throwing her added complications. Having some of that explicitly leak onto the page is a beautiful move. How frustrating that we have to wait three more months to see where Burkett takes this feature next! We get a statement of ownership in this issue, now giving us three data points from which to chart this title's progression. The 1979 Statement of Ownership shows us how the title was faring only two months after merging with Batman Family:  While the 1980 Statement of Ownership shows us how far sales had declined in the year since, ultimately leading to the return of the traditional Detective Comics format:  Now, seven months after the reversion, DC is only printing a little less than seven thousand more copies per issue than it was last year (roughly 85,000 copies for the year), and the total returns for the past twelve months have increased by nearly twenty thousand copies:  Is there any possible way that increase came entirely from the five months included here in which 'Tec was still an ailing Dollar Comic? If not, this title is still struggling badly, and that certainly makes the future of the Batgirl feature uncertain. It will manage to hold on for another year and a half, but will the ailing sales embolden Levitz (and later Giordano and Wein) to interfere with Burkett's vision for the title? Only time will tell. |
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Post by MDG on Nov 25, 2020 10:45:44 GMT -5
We get a statement of ownership in this issue, now giving us three data points from which to chart this title's progression. The 1979 Statement of Ownership shows us how the title was faring only two months after merging with Batman Family: While the 1980 Statement of Ownership shows us how far sales had declined in the year since, ultimately leading to the return of the traditional Detective Comics format: Now, seven months after the reversion, DC is only printing a little less than seven thousand more copies per issue than it was last year (roughly 85,000 copies for the year), and the total returns for the past twelve months have increased by nearly twenty thousand copies: Is there any possible way that increase came entirely from the five months included here in which 'Tec was still an ailing Dollar Comic? If not, this title is still struggling badly, and that certainly makes the future of the Batgirl feature uncertain. It will manage to hold on for another year and a half, but will the ailing sales embolden Levitz (and later Giordano and Wein) to interfere with Burkett's vision for the title? Only time will tell. The numbers are rough, but one way to look at these circulation numbers is: if DC could have gotten just two new readers from every public elementary and high school in the US, they could've doubled or even tripled their circulation.
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 10:59:25 GMT -5
The numbers are rough, but one way to look at these circulation numbers is: if DC could have gotten just two new readers from every public elementary and high school in the US, they could've doubled or even tripled their circulation. nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=84 I'm not old enough to remember the early 1980s, but everything I think I know about comics in the '70s and early '80s points to Marvel being the zeitgeist while DC struggled to remain relevant. No matter how you packaged a DC comic, if it was being written like a DC comic, it wasn't selling. The two exceptions I'm aware of -- New Teen Titans and Legion of Super-Heroes -- were written more in the Marvel style, with lots of character evolution and heavy continuity. In short, I suspect that if schools back then had been more open to comic books and weren't viewing them as gateways to illiteracy, the kids probably would have been picking up Amazing Spider-Man at the book fair instead of Detective Comics. |
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