shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 11:21:29 GMT -5
Batman #337 (July 1981)  Robin: "Murder on the Midway" Script: Gerry Conway Pencils: Don Newton Inks: Larry Mahlstedt Colors: Adrienne Roy Letters: John Costanza Grade: B- Marv Wolfman is out, and Gerry Conway now exercises more creative control over the Batman franchise than certainly any single Bronze Age creator had ever previously enjoyed. He is writing Detective Comics, World's Finest Comics, Batman, AND the Robin backup feature in Batman. In short, outside the pages of New Teen Titans, Conway has complete control over Dick Grayson. It's therefore gratifying to see him acknowledging the struggles that Wolfman first introduced in DC Comics Presents #26, and reaffirmed during The Lazarus Affair:  This Robin has lost his direction ever since dropping out of Hudson University. But whereas Marv Wolfman's Robin has since found his bearings as leader of The New Teen Titans:  (from NTT #7)that team is never even mentioned here, Dick instead seeking purpose by rejoining the circus:   Editor Paul Levitz is okay with Dick being directionless and having differences with Batman, but whereas the Dick Grayson leading The New Teen Titans will continue to have resentment towards Bruce Wayne for decades to come, Levitz has declared that (in the pages of the Batman titles, at least), Batman and Robin have already come to a kind of truce.  which fits the forced ending we saw to The Lazarus Affair two issues back:  Conway did put Batman and Robin together in World's Finest Comics #269 earlier this month, which I read but did not bother to review because its contents were almost entirely irrelevant to this project, but it is worth noting that there was no visible tension between the two in that story:  it is interesting that the ending to The Lazarus Affair two months back implied that Dick would be staying at Wayne Manor, whereas this story implies he will be traveling with Hill's Circus from now on. Meanwhile, New Teen Titans #8, published last month, indicates that Dick is working for Hill's circus before we even see it happen here in this issue AND has him living at Titans Tower. So...lots of crossed wires at this point. Going forward, it looks like we'll enjoy a more complex Dick Grayson who will be more interesting to read than he was in his Hudson University days, but there will continue to be a mismatch between Levitz's and Wolfman's visions of the character. I wonder how long it will be before the New Teen Titans ever get mentioned in the Batman titles. Minor Detail:While I read, but did not bother to review, DC Comics Presents #31 four months back because it did nothing to explore Robin's personality, progression as a character, nor relationship with Batman, that issue (plotted by Conway) has apparently launched a continuity that will guide at least the next few issues, with Dick first deciding to go back to the circus there, as well as being reunited with Waldo The Clown:  If memory serves, Waldo will go on to play a key role in the early issues of the Doug Moench Batman run, befriending a young Jason Todd. Anyway, I've spent all this time blabbering on without discussing the story itself. Well, it's...okay. I find Dick's status as a lost soul seeking his future in his past far more compelling than the actual plot, the ending of which is badly rushed. I don't know why we needed Deadman's living brother guest-appearing in a Deadman costume, and I don't particularly care what happens to Waldo the Clown (who has been framed for murder). Hopefully, Dick's characterization will be enough to carry us through, though Conway certainly isn't giving Dick's characterization as much oomph as Cary Burkett is giving to Babs Gordon in this book's sister title as of yet. |
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Post by zaku on Nov 25, 2020 12:28:30 GMT -5
Between all these adventures, I wonder how Dick even has the time to feel directionless  |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 12:30:03 GMT -5
Between all these adventures, I wonder how Dick even has the time to feel directionless Yeah, even Wolfman had him fly to China in the pages of Batman at the very same time that he had him battling Trigon in the other dimensional realm of Azar. |
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 25, 2020 12:58:18 GMT -5
When I read these comics, I don't recall being bothered by the fact that there were two (maybe three) different Robins, because widely varying versions of the characters and a general disregard for company continuity had been the M.O. at DC for decades. Not that I liked it; I guess I just accepted it as par for the course, shrugged my shoulders and read on.
For me, the "real" Robin must have been the one in the Titans, which as you mentioned, was a more Marvel-style book, and ergo was far better at characterization and world-building than almost all other DC titles. Adventure, as you also mentioned, was the other notable example.
BTW, @adminthe Tiny pictured must be the same Tiny from the original Deadman series in Strange Adventures, as the Hill Circus is the one that had starred Boston Brand. Curious if Conway mentioned it in a footnote, or maybe just dropped it in expecting readers to recognize Tiny and the circus name.
Keep these fine reviews coming. That you can be so perceptive on such short notice is amazing!
And Happy Thanksgiving, too!
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Post by beccabear67 on Nov 25, 2020 13:58:52 GMT -5
I was buying the Batman comic around this time but I can't remember ever seeing Detective on the racks, or did I just not notice them? I bought Batman and The Flash the most faithfully. I wonder if Detective simply had low orders for years compared to the solo title? I have no desire to go back and revisit most of this era of DC though, it's like the writers were all in a holding pattern and not too much significant seemed to happen (exception being Marv Wolfman) whereas in the '70s and then in the mid-'80s DC was more interesting, if also having some spectacular flops perhaps too.
Later I did get some of these Detectives, but just a general lack of much of distinction, even as a Dollar comic (but those last few issues of Batman Family and the Englehart-Rogers run were very high levels not to be met easily).
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Post by chaykinstevens on Nov 25, 2020 14:53:25 GMT -5
The 1979 Statement of Ownership shows us how the title was faring only two months after merging with Batman Family:  While the 1980 Statement of Ownership shows us how far sales had declined in the year since, ultimately leading to the return of the traditional Detective Comics format:  Now, seven months after the reversion, DC is only printing a little less than seven thousand more copies per issue than it was last year (roughly 85,000 copies for the year), and the total returns for the past twelve months have increased by nearly twenty thousand copies:  Is there any possible way that increase came entirely from the five months included here in which 'Tec was still an ailing Dollar Comic? If not, this title is still struggling badly, and that certainly makes the future of the Batgirl feature uncertain. It will manage to hold on for another year and a half, but will the ailing sales embolden Levitz (and later Giordano and Wein) to interfere with Burkett's vision for the title? Only time will tell. The filing dates of the Statements of Ownership are given as 1 October of each year, so the first one would have been too early to give any indication of how the dollar issues were selling, as #481 had only just been published by then. #497 would have hit the stands around the time of the filing date of the third statement, so I think the reported increase in returned copies would have been based mostly or entirely on dollar issues. |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 15:51:30 GMT -5
BTW, @adminthe Tiny pictured must be the same Tiny from the original Deadman series in Strange Adventures, as the Hill Circus is the one that had starred Boston Brand. Curious if Conway mentioned it in a footnote, or maybe just dropped it in expecting readers to recognize Tiny and the circus name. He did indeed mention it. Boston's brother, Cleveland appears in this story too (and no, that isn't a joke). Why thank you, and the very same to you! |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 25, 2020 15:55:00 GMT -5
I have no desire to go back and revisit most of this era of DC though, it's like the writers were all in a holding pattern and not too much significant seemed to happen (exception being Marv Wolfman) whereas in the '70s and then in the mid-'80s DC was more interesting, if also having some spectacular flops perhaps too. Later I did get some of these Detectives, but just a general lack of much of distinction, even as a Dollar comic (but those last few issues of Batman Family and the Englehart-Rogers run were very high levels not to be met easily). I strongly suggest checking out Cary Burkett's Batgirl, if you ever have the opportunity. Start with 'Tec #491-492, and see if it leaves you wanting more. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Nov 25, 2020 18:28:10 GMT -5
Gonna defend Jose Delbo; you are assuming he is putting those signs in there; but, Costanza would be doing the lettering, so maybe he is the one, "kissing the boss' butt." Or maybe Burkett, since these were done full script, meaning the writer dictated the panels and the action within them. The same may be a factor in Delbo's art, as he may be getting panel descriptions that he wouldn't have chosen and is trying to make them work the best he can. If the art doesn't work for you, fine; but saying things like Delbo is kissing Levitz's tuchus , to stay on the feature, is a bit much, even in jest. While I don't think Delbo was well suited to superheroes (though I think his Wonder Woman is better, within the limits of the scripts he was given), I think he did some fine work out there. I posted the Yellow Submarine stuff, already; but, here's a sample of Turok....  From Ghosts #55...  A page from one of his favorite assignments, The Monkees...  Here is an "interview" (more like an e-mail Q&A) with Delbo....In the interview, he says he enjoyed working with Levitz and Julie Schwartz, enjoyed Levitz and Len Wein's writing, liked the inking of Al Williamson, Dick Giordano, Joe Giela, and Al Gordon. He also said he preferred the work he did at Marvel, as he had more leeway to be creative, since he wasn't working from a script. He lists his favorite assignments as The Monkees, Yellow Submarine and The Lone Ranger. So, not superheroes, though he also drew the Phantom newspaper strip. Regardless of how you perceive his artistic merits, you cannot help but respect his commitment to teaching the next generation. He started teaching at the Kubert School, in the 90s, and continued until about 2005. When he retired to Florida, he started teaching art camps for kids. I have heard good things about his teaching from Kubert grads and Joe didn't bring just anyone in to teach. He used people he respected, as peers, like Jose, Tex Blaisdell, Hy Eismen, and Irwin Hasen. |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 26, 2020 6:47:52 GMT -5
Gonna defend Jose Delbo; you are assuming he is putting those signs in there; but, Costanza would be doing the lettering, so maybe he is the one, "kissing the boss' butt." Or maybe Burkett, since these were done full script, meaning the writer dictated the panels and the action within them. The same may be a factor in Delbo's art, as he may be getting panel descriptions that he wouldn't have chosen and is trying to make them work the best he can. If the art doesn't work for you, fine; but saying things like Delbo is kissing Levitz's tuchus , to stay on the feature, is a bit much, even in jest. While I don't think Delbo was well suited to superheroes (though I think his Wonder Woman is better, within the limits of the scripts he was given), I think he did some fine work out there. I posted the Yellow Submarine stuff, already; but, here's a sample of Turok.... From Ghosts #55... A page from one of his favorite assignments, The Monkees... Here is an "interview" (more like an e-mail Q&A) with Delbo....In the interview, he says he enjoyed working with Levitz and Julie Schwartz, enjoyed Levitz and Len Wein's writing, liked the inking of Al Williamson, Dick Giordano, Joe Giela, and Al Gordon. He also said he preferred the work he did at Marvel, as he had more leeway to be creative, since he wasn't working from a script. He lists his favorite assignments as The Monkees, Yellow Submarine and The Lone Ranger. So, not superheroes, though he also drew the Phantom newspaper strip. Regardless of how you perceive his artistic merits, you cannot help but respect his commitment to teaching the next generation. He started teaching at the Kubert School, in the 90s, and continued until about 2005. When he retired to Florida, he started teaching art camps for kids. I have heard good things about his teaching from Kubert grads and Joe didn't bring just anyone in to teach. He used people he respected, as peers, like Jose, Tex Blaisdell, Hy Eismen, and Irwin Hasen. I think it's great that you enjoy the man's output. In my case, I find it immensely frustrating being so emotionally invested in a Burkett script and having it continually disrupted by awkward and seemingly lazy artwork with awkward poses, proportions, and excessive motion lines. I don't blame Delbo for this (who is to say why the quality of his work has dipped at this point, what stresses he is working under, etc.?), but I figure I can either articulate my frustration in all caps and explanation marks or try to make light of it.     |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 26, 2020 7:06:53 GMT -5
The filing dates of the Statements of Ownership are given as 1 October of each tear, so the first one would have been too early to give any indication of how the dollar issues were selling, as #481 had only just been published by then. #497 would have hit the stands around the time of the filing date of the third statement, so I think the reported increase in returned copies would have been based mostly or entirely on dollar issues. I'd honestly never given the filing dates much attention before. Thanks much for pointing this out. I'm lost on why statements of ownership filed in October were being printed in comics that would have hit stands seven months later. |
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Post by MWGallaher on Nov 26, 2020 9:12:38 GMT -5
I'm not a big fan of Delbo's work (but c'mon, he's not the kind of artist who's going to have a lot of enthusiastic "fans", is he? More like "eh, it'll do"), but he's not well-served by Joe Giella's pedestrian inks here. According to my old pal Chris Khalaf, Giella's one of the friendliest, talkative pros you'd ever want to meet, but let's just say in my opinion, his stint as the artist on Mary Worth represented his best and most appropriate assignment in comics.
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Post by Hoosier X on Nov 26, 2020 11:38:35 GMT -5
I'm not a big fan of Delbo's work (but c'mon, he's not the kind of artist who's going to have a lot of enthusiastic "fans", is he? More like "eh, it'll do"), but he's not well-served by Joe Giella's pedestrian inks here. According to my old pal Chris Khalaf, Giella's one of the friendliest, talkative pros you'd ever want to meet, but let's just say in my opinion, his stint as the artist on Mary Worth represented his best and most appropriate assignment in comics. Mary Worth! I never read it, but I laugh every time there was something in MAD magazine making fun of it. |
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Post by shaxper on Dec 17, 2020 13:04:22 GMT -5
* Note: I should have reviewed this issue before Batman #337 and not after. Please excuse the error. That story has Dick rejoin the circus, whereas he is still residing in the Wayne Foundation building here.
Detective Comics #503 (June 1981)  "The 6 Days of the Scarecrow" Script: Gerry Conway Pencils: Don Newton Inks: Dan Adkins Colors: Adrienne Roy Letters: Ben Oda Grade: D Now that Gerry Conway enjoys near-total control of the Batman titles, it makes sense to do a Batman Family story that attempts to ensure that all that is happening with all three members of the Batman Family occurs in the same shared universe and that Babs and Dick don't wander too far from the franchise's center. Of course, it's Batman who has to save them in the end after they so foolishly blunder into one of Scarecrow's traps while trying to save him. He's the center of this family; he's the alpha...and don't you readers at home forget it! And while Conway makes efforts to acknowledge and respect the worlds of Dick and Babs as well, he doesn't exactly get it right:  1. Just last issue, we learned that Babs was overtaxed and that her office had subsequently held up a transit safety report that was causing Humanities Research and Development to lose credibility, but now she has the time to go to Washington in search of more funding AND the Federal Government decides HRD should get it? 2. Check out that bottom panel. Conway doesn't want us to forget that Robin knows who Babs is while she has no idea who he is ever since the knowledge was taken from her. Whereas she once "wore the pants" in this team-up, Robin is now the intimidating figure she follows and abides by. It's really upsetting. Plus, Conway really likes to have Babs feel fear in this story:  completely oblivious to this major development that came out of last issue:  All that rich character progression Burkett has been developing in his backstories completely missed/ignored here so that Batman can look like the big tough guy compared to these rank amateurs. Oh, and forget any opportunity to revisit the complex relationship between Dick and Babs in this story. Now that Babs doesn't know Dick's identity anymore, there is no relationship to speak of:  As for the story itself, it's pretty ridiculous. While Conway takes great pains to explain, for example, where bad guys in Gotham get their chemical vials from (hey, addressing that is pretty clever!), we've got Scarecrow inexplicably building mile-long underground HQs filled with wall-to-wall state of the art computers and technicians, as well as robot doubles and robot flying Owls, with no explanation as to how he could have possibly pulled any of this off, especially without Batman knowing. Oh, and the town where all this takes place changes names partway through the issue from Hudsonville to Hortonville. Ever since the publication of Batman Family #1 six years earlier, Bronze Age fans had waited for a three-way team-up among Batman, Robin, and Batgirl. They finally got it here, and it utterly stinks. Batman had no logical reason for calling in Batgirl and Robin to help (Scarecrow gave him am injection that makes people too afraid of him, so he can't safely go out?), and they are utterly useless in their roles, both as characters and as effective crimefighters. Bad story and bad use of the Batman Family. All it succeeds in doing is proving how awesome Batman is when compared with these other clowns, which really doesn't align with what Cary Burkett is writing in the solo Batgirl stories at all.
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Post by codystarbuck on Dec 18, 2020 0:56:36 GMT -5
Gerry Conway never struck me as writing particularly strong female characters. I think that's part of the problem. He also had a tendency to ignore what previous writers had done and plow on ahead, like on Defenders, where he took over the book, pretty much ignored everything Gerber had done, then was gone in a couple of issues (and out the door, at Marvel). I kind of see that here. There is also the problem you get with many writers that Robin and batgirl are always second fiddle to batman and he rarely needs them when they join him on a case. They just can't see past sidekick and reach colleague. That was one of the things I hated about Knightfall. With bane creating so much havoc, by releasing the inmates from Arkham, why the hell wouldn't Bats call in Nightwing and a few others, just to help contain things? It made no logical sense, even within the context of the story. Barbara is out of the picture; but, there were enough other Bat and Bat-allied characters to use. It was just a case of plot convenience, which is the first sign of lazy writing.
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