shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jan 20, 2019 8:42:16 GMT -5
Batman Family #13 (September 1977)  "The Man Who Melted Manhattan!" Script: Bob Rozakis Pencils: Don Newton; Marshall Rogers Inks: Bob Wiacek Colors: Jerry Serpe Letters: ? grade: C+ Well, beccabear67, it may have taken them an extra issue, but we finally got the three-way team-up promised with last issue's cover:  as both Man-Bat's were-jaguar story and Batgirl and Robin's talking motorcycle cliffhanger intersect incoherently, both apparently orchestrated by The Outsider, a villain we heard about way back in Batman Family #1 who somehow takes over Alfred's body at times. In fact, Rozakis loves connecting things together so much that he not only ties together all three Batman Family heroes in one story, not only resurrects a villain mentioned in passing in the first issue of this title, not only connects the villain profile feature of this issue to the A story as the moment where Robin explains the villain to Batgirl, but he even uses the Alfred and Commissioner Gordon B story from Batman Family #11 to explain how The Outsider has returned:  And it's nice to see a villain of the entire Batman Family here for once:  (yes, they finally said the name of the book within the book!) Beyond that, it's a Rozakis story. The plot is largely non-sensical and forgettable, but we do get Don Newton and Marshall Rogers sharing penciling chores (the GCD makes no distinction as to who did what, and I confess I know neither's style well enough to determine this for myself). We get a few truly gorgeous panels:  but, perhaps more distinct in this issue, we get some truly unusual panel arrangements. Check out this page below, in which two different events are depicted in parallel, running down the page, only to come together at the bottom:  Wild. And, as promised, Rozakis is back to playing with the romantic tension in the Batgirl/Robin relationship. But whereas Elliot S! Maggin could do it in a single panel, offering so much hope while making no promises, Rozakis takes panel upon panel to both excite and frustrate us repeatedly. One moment, Bagirl seems interested...  ...and, the next, she doesn't. Not interested...  Asleep...  Frankly, we're at the point where it has gotten annoying. Minor Details:- I'd previously had the impression that Hudson University was in New York City, but this issue makes it clear it's in Upstate New York:  And yet (as this issue reminds us), the new Titans' HQ is right smack in the middle of Long Island. How the heck is Robin making that commute all the time? In fact, how was he commuting to Gotham before The Titans moved their HQ? - We've probably all seen this one before. Rozakis gives us another page of fan-submitted new costume ideas for Robin, and this time a young Norm Breyfogle is included:  In the end, I applaud all the connectivity Rozakis is trying to create in this issue, and I love the Newton and Rogers art, but this is ultimately yet another forgettable Batman Family installment. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jan 20, 2019 11:14:32 GMT -5
Newton definitely did the close-up of the faces, with Robin hovering over babs' shoulders. Rogers appears to have done the sequence of Robin falling. Newton tended to be a softer penciller, much like Gene Colan, while Rogers had a sharper line, more like Simonson. Both usually inked their own work. Here's a Newton Barman....  and a Rogers...  |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jan 20, 2019 13:04:38 GMT -5
Newton definitely did the close-up of the faces, with Robin hovering over babs' shoulders. Rogers appears to have done the sequence of Robin falling. Newton tended to be a softer penciller, much like Gene Colan, while Rogers had a sharper line, more like Simonson. Both usually inked their own work. Thanks for this. Maybe Rogers did layouts and Newton fleshed it out? |
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Post by chaykinstevens on Jan 20, 2019 13:48:28 GMT -5
beccabear67 The plot is largely non-sensical and forgettable, but we do get Don Newton and Marshall Rogers sharing penciling chores (the GCD makes no distinction as to who did what, and I confess I know neither's style well enough to determine this for myself). I'd say Rogers definitely pencilled the Man-Bat solo chapter (pages 9 to 16), including the image above. On page 9, the tv screen says "WGNY news artist sketch by Bob Marshall." The remainder of the issue looks like Newton. |
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Post by beccabear67 on Jan 20, 2019 15:22:26 GMT -5
Having Bob Wiacek inking all the way through makes it a lot more visually consistent then if there were various inkers. I'd forgotten I had this issue too, but it's not one I kept even with the great art. Then I have #16-20 of which #17-20 are the keepers for me.
Did The Outsider ever appear again? Maybe outside being Alfred? Visually he looks impressive and is fairly memorable.
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Post by MDG on Jan 20, 2019 16:18:03 GMT -5
beccabear67 The plot is largely non-sensical and forgettable, but we do get Don Newton and Marshall Rogers sharing penciling chores (the GCD makes no distinction as to who did what, and I confess I know neither's style well enough to determine this for myself). I'd say Rogers definitely pencilled the Man-Bat solo chapter (pages 9 to 16), including the image above. On page 9, the tv screen says "WGNY news artist sketch by Bob Marshall." The remainder of the issue looks like Newton.
It's odd that it wasn't broken down in the credits or the GCD.
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Post by chadwilliam on Jan 20, 2019 20:53:35 GMT -5
Having Bob Wiacek inking all the way through makes it a lot more visually consistent then if there were various inkers. I'd forgotten I had this issue too, but it's not one I kept even with the great art. Then I have #16-20 of which #17-20 are the keepers for me. Did The Outsider ever appear again? Maybe outside being Alfred? Visually he looks impressive and is fairly memorable. He appeared at least once more in DC Comics Presents 83 in a tale pencilled by Mike Barr and Irv Novick.  |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jan 21, 2019 5:54:15 GMT -5
I'd say Rogers definitely pencilled the Man-Bat solo chapter (pages 9 to 16) That was my initial suspicion, only because he was attached to the Man-Bat feature previously. Thanks for this! Now that I had totally missed! |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jan 21, 2019 21:53:24 GMT -5
Batman Family #14 (October 1977)  "Old Super-Heroines Never Die-- They Just Fade Away!" Script: Bob Rozakis Pencils: Don Heck Inks: Bob Wiacek Colors: Jerry Serpe Letters: Ben Oda Grade: C+ I have to admit, I actually got into this one! It begins with Batwoman showing up at Barbara Gordon's door immediately before crumbling to dust. Sure, you figure -- but she's gonna get better. But then the script takes a truly dark turn, and we stop worrying about Batwoman all together:  Never thought Rozakis was going to try a pandemic story! So the remainder of the issue becomes a hunt to re-trace Batwoman's steps and determine what happened, beginning with revisiting a scene we saw play out at the beginning of the issue that we thought little of at the time:  This is GREAT plot structure! But, ya know, it's a Rozakis story, so the whole thing falls apart terribly by the close. They find the device that caused the virus, never bother to explain how the thugs using it got their hands on it in the first place, the scientist helping Batgirl creates a cure within seconds of being given the device, and then, if this story didn't feel cheap enough already, we get this bullsh*t:  Couldn't Rozakis at least show us the beginnings of a slow and laborious recuperation? Within a few panels, Batwoman is TOTALLY back to normal (even her hair is on point), and she's ready to buy everyone dinner. This entire experience didn't end up costing her an ounce of pain or even inconvenience. The stakes were fake all along. And there's other garbage to be found in this outing as well, from random half-clear innuendos that cut-off arbitrarily while Rozakis leaps to a totally different scene:  (I mean, I'm honestly not sure what Robin was referencing there!) to Don Heck's art, which alternates between not-bad and the super-wide Batgirl face above, as well as this image of Robin possibly in mid-swing (??):  I have no idea. The only thing a writer can produce that's worse than a bad story is a bad story that gets your hopes up. And the art ain't helping, either. Important Details:- Lori may have figured out that Dick is Robin.  And seriously, how could she not? This is worse than the Clark Kent/Superman thing. Robin is DEFINITELY a student on the Hudson U campus who arrived at the same time that Dick did, they definitely look similar, they are both from Gotham, Dick disappears inexplicably all the time, and he and Robin both routinely travel to Long Island, Gotham, and Washington DC at approximately the same time. Speaking of which, it's kind of amazing no one has yet busted Batgirl for always being where Congresswoman Gordon is, having the same distinct hair color as Congresswoman Gordon, and even using her bank account without batting an eye:  But, ya know...Rozakis. Minor Details:- Kid Flash makes a brief guest appearance. Apparently, he's totally cool with Robin calling him whenever he needs to get somewhere fast.  - Rozakis gets a little butt hurt when a fan letter calls him out on his absurd/non-sensical plot points:  Batman's Bureau of Missing Villains: "The Zodiac Master" Script: ? Pencils: ? Inks: ? Colors: ? Letters: ? Not totally clear on the purpose of this feature when it isn't discussing a villain appearing in the current issue. Is Rozakis planning on re-introducing The Zodiac Master (who previously had exactly ONE appearance) in a future issue, is he looking to see if there is fan response before working the guy into a story, or is this just arbitrary nostalgia from Rozakis' youth? "Cinemattack!" Script: Bob Rozakis Pencils: Howard Chaykin Inks: Joe Rubinstein [as Josef Rubenstein] Colors: Jerry Serpe Letters: Milt Snapinn Grade: F If losing Marshall Rogers on this feature wasn't hard enough, this is absolutely the dumbest Man-Bat story yet, in which he fights Rozakis' frankly offensive take on a horror movie fanatic:  No special powers, no real plan. Just an idiot trying to kill Man-Bat while he patiently tries to diffuse the situation. Ugh. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jan 22, 2019 0:17:33 GMT -5
This was the last issue of the series I had. At that time period, anything with Batwoman was gold. Since she had been on the shelf for so long, she made an interesting guest star; and, she was handled pretty well. She was allowed to be skilled, yet rusty, and seemed to be a fairly rounded character (relatively speaking). Her revival proved short-lived and tragic, yet memorable. That was the best way to revive an old character; give them some guest spots, let them have agency, have a reason for them having been gone, and don't overdo it, unless the audience is really demanding more. Too often they either tried to shove a character down your throat or didn't have a good reason for them to be there, other than trademark maintenance. Even the Kingdom event (the follow up to Kingdom Come)gave her some importance, when Batman sees her and is taken aback. Not much comes of it, other than alerting him that reality has gone funky; but, it solidified that she had meant something. Same with Alan Brennert's Deadman Christmas story, where he meets what is revealed to be the spirit of Supergirl, despite being erased from existence, after Crisis. It captured the essence of the character and paid tribute to her memory, without making a big deal of it (and in less than a dozen pages). Man, I wish Brennert had written more comics!
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Post by Hoosier X on Jan 22, 2019 1:00:12 GMT -5
Batman's Bureau of Missing Villains: "The Zodiac Master" Script: ? Pencils: ? Inks: ? Colors: ? Letters: ? Not totally clear on the purpose of this feature when it isn't discussing a villain appearing in the current issue. Is Rozakis planning on re-introducing The Zodiac Master (who previously had exactly ONE appearance) in a future issue, is he looking to see if there is fan response before working the guy into a story, or is this just arbitrary nostalgia from Rozakis' youth? Nobody loves obscure one-shot Batman villains more than me, but The Zodiac Master is particularly stupid without ANY of the charm of the Polka-Dot Man or Double X or Two-Tone or the Mirror Man or the Terrible Trio. I have no idea what they were thinking, wasting a page on this guy when they could have devoted a page to Dr. No-Face or Johnny Witts! |
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Post by Chris on Jan 22, 2019 1:53:03 GMT -5
Batman Family #14 (October 1977)  I loved this comic when I was a kid. I had never heard of Batwoman, but I liked the costume and concept, and Kid Flash was in it too. Rozakis gets a little butt hurt when a fan letter calls him out on his absurd/non-sensical plot points: I thought it was kinda funny. But no one ever said my sense of humor was anywhere near normal. Batman's Bureau of Missing Villains: "The Zodiac Master" I thought he was all right. The costume looked stupid, but the zodiac stuff was neat to my 7 year old self. I loved this feature. I got all the bullet points of the story in one page, and it still managed to keep a bit of dramatic tension in the telling. |
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Post by zaku on Jan 22, 2019 4:24:11 GMT -5
- Lori may have figured out that Dick is Robin. And seriously, how could she not? This is worse than the Clark Kent/Superman thing. Robin is DEFINITELY a student on the Hudson U campus who arrived at the same time that Dick did, they definitely look similar, they are both from Gotham, Dick disappears inexplicably all the time, and he and Robin both routinely travel to Long Island, Gotham, and Washington DC at approximately the same time. What I liked in the tv show Titans is how everyone who knows Dick immediately recognizes him when he is in the Robin costume because, well, in the real life in one of the worst disguise ever.   |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jan 22, 2019 6:56:36 GMT -5
This was the last issue of the series I had. At that time period, anything with Batwoman was gold. Since she had been on the shelf for so long, she made an interesting guest star; and, she was handled pretty well. She was allowed to be skilled, yet rusty, and seemed to be a fairly rounded character (relatively speaking). Her revival proved short-lived and tragic, yet memorable. That was the best way to revive an old character; give them some guest spots, let them have agency, have a reason for them having been gone, and don't overdo it, unless the audience is really demanding more. Oh, I totally agree. I really don't mind Rozakis' desire to keep pulling characters and continuity from the past, and I was genuinely excited by the return of Kathy Kane in Batman Family #10, but I don't feel she was used well in this first return appearance. A better writer could have used this experience to better round out her character as she copes with a long rehabilitation process and the fear that any given burglary could unexpectedly result in her demise. Ah well. I love Rozakis' adoration of the Atom-Age. I hate Rozakis' need to write like it's still the Atom-Age. |
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Post by Rob Allen on Jan 22, 2019 14:59:30 GMT -5
I'd say Rogers definitely pencilled the Man-Bat solo chapter (pages 9 to 16), including the image above. On page 9, the tv screen says "WGNY news artist sketch by Bob Marshall." The remainder of the issue looks like Newton. It's odd that it wasn't broken down in the credits or the GCD.
I've sent that info to the GCD. Thanks! |
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