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Post by tarkintino on May 5, 2019 8:50:02 GMT -5
The idea that an "empath" takes the emotional and physical wounds of others onto herself was lifted directly from the Star Trek episode "The Empath." I'm not sure if Star Trek's "The Empath" (original story by Joyce Muskat, screenplay by Arthur Singer) was the first work of fiction to treat an empath as one to take the emotional/physical pains of another, but the episode's high visibility over the years (in syndication) certainly mainstreamed it. I will look into its NTT origins, but if Star Trek was the inspiration, it would not be the first--nor las time--superhero comics would take concepts or designs from the legendary TV series. |
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Post by dbutler69 on May 5, 2019 12:36:09 GMT -5
The idea that an "empath" takes the emotional and physical wounds of others onto herself was lifted directly from the Star Trek episode "The Empath." I'm not sure if Star Trek's "The Empath" (original story by Joyce Muskat, screenplay by Arthur Singer) was the first work of fiction to treat an empath as one to take the emotional/physical pains of another, but the episode's high visibility over the years (in syndication) certainly mainstreamed it. I will look into its NTT origins, but if Star Trek was the inspiration, it would not be the first--nor las time--superhero comics would take concepts or designs from the legendary TV series. Speaking of which, the Legion Cruiser in Superboy and the Legion of Super-Heroes look suspiciously like the Enterprise.  |
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Post by beccabear67 on May 5, 2019 13:08:02 GMT -5
I never had #5 or 6 for some reason, so it's cool to catch up on those bits after all this time! I remember these comics as going way up in price as back issues and then down and now they seem to be up again. I had multiple copies of #1 in a trade at one time, one of the few times I ever did that on a comic, but they dwindled down to my one copy over time. I remember thinking Starfire was DC's answer to Marvel's Phoenix. It seems like Cyborg though is the one who became the major character generally in the wider DC world, he's even in the current Doom Patrol tv series with a Niles Caulder origin backstory. Was that in the '80s comics ever? I loved the Doom Patrol tie-in issues in the early '80s and it's what got me to be a regular buyer of the title from then on up to #50.
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Post by Icctrombone on May 5, 2019 13:35:39 GMT -5
I find that many origin stories for team books are generally the weakest of the arcs. I really liked the Doom Patrol arc as well.
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Post by codystarbuck on May 5, 2019 19:49:13 GMT -5
I'm not sure if Star Trek's "The Empath" (original story by Joyce Muskat, screenplay by Arthur Singer) was the first work of fiction to treat an empath as one to take the emotional/physical pains of another, but the episode's high visibility over the years (in syndication) certainly mainstreamed it. I will look into its NTT origins, but if Star Trek was the inspiration, it would not be the first--nor las time--superhero comics would take concepts or designs from the legendary TV series. Speaking of which, the Legion Cruiser in Superboy and the Legion of Super-Heroes look suspiciously like the Enterprise. That was deliberate, on the part of Dave Cockrum, who added that design to the team. He also did some Trek homages with the Shi'ar, in X-Men, which Byrne carried on. |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on May 6, 2019 7:49:05 GMT -5
The idea that an "empath" takes the emotional and physical wounds of others onto herself was lifted directly from the Star Trek episode "The Empath." Yep. There's a whole lot of "borrowing" at the core of this series. Just yesterday, while reading the Fantastic Four, I realized something. Early on in this thread, I argued that Cyborg was the only new team member that wasn't at least partially borrowed from/inspired by the X-Men. Only now do I realize he's not all that original a concept, either. He's essentially a technological Ben Grimm, Gar often playing the role of Johny Storm in contrast. |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on May 6, 2019 7:55:28 GMT -5
It seems like Cyborg though is the one who became the major character generally in the wider DC world, he's even in the current Doom Patrol tv series That happened pretty early on, when he was added to the roster of the animated Super Friends in 1985. Some have argued it was done because they wanted a black character. I'm not sure if that was the case (Black Vulcan had been a member previously), but many folks around my age first knew Cyborg as a member of the Super Friends. That might have been part of what inspired DC/Warner to make Cyborg a member of the cinematic Justice League too. Whatever the reason, Cyborg has certainly had a more successful life outside of the Titans than the other characters Wolfman and Perez introduced. |
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Post by codystarbuck on May 6, 2019 11:23:10 GMT -5
It seems like Cyborg though is the one who became the major character generally in the wider DC world, he's even in the current Doom Patrol tv series That happened pretty early on, when he was added to the roster of the animated Super Friends in 1985. Some have argued it was done because they wanted a black character. I'm not sure if that was the case (Black Vulcan had been a member previously), but many folks around my age first knew Cyborg as a member of the Super Friends. That might have been part of what inspired DC/Warner to make Cyborg a member of the cinematic Justice League too. Whatever the reason, Cyborg has certainly had a more successful life outside of the Titans than the other characters Wolfman and Perez introduced. Has more to do with the fight between Tony Isabella and DC. Isabella has financial rights when it comes to Black Lightning, which is part of why he was never used on any of the animated series, as Isabella and DC had been at odds for a while, before his 90s return, which ended up with things in an even worse state. There was a deliberate attempt to diversify and few characters to choose; so, Cyborg gets the nod. With Galactic Guardians, I think it was also driven by wanting another younger character, like Firestorm, to try to recapture the younger crowd. Also, Janna-Barbera owned the Black Vulcan character, so DC couldn't exploit the character for the toy lines, without their consent and giving them a cut, vs Cyborg, who they owned (though I don't recall a Cyborg toy, in that era). Things got smoothed out a bit (DC & Isabella), recently, leading to the BL tv series. |
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on May 6, 2019 11:25:51 GMT -5
Also, Janna-Barbera owned the Black Vulcan character, so DC couldn't exploit the character for the toy lines, without their consent and giving them a cut, vs Cyborg, who they owned (though I don't recall a Cyborg toy, in that era). There was a Cyborg figure, but it was extremely rare. Justice League Unlimited had a Black Vulcan figure, so I guess that issue got worked out as well. But yeah, if Black Vulcan and Black Lightning were off the table, I think that only left Vic Stone and John Stewart, and the Super Friends already had a Green Lantern. |
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Post by codystarbuck on May 6, 2019 11:30:14 GMT -5
Also, Janna-Barbera owned the Black Vulcan character, so DC couldn't exploit the character for the toy lines, without their consent and giving them a cut, vs Cyborg, who they owned (though I don't recall a Cyborg toy, in that era). There was a Cyborg figure, but it was extremely rare. Justice League Unlimited had a Black Vulcan figure, so I guess that issue got worked out as well. But yeah, if Black Vulcan and Black Lightning were off the table, I think that only left Vic Stone and John Stewart, and the Super Friends already had a Green Lantern. By JLU, Hanna-Barbera was owned by Warner, which owns DC, which makes it all in house. Give it another 5 or 10 years, when the Justice Department rolls over and shows their belly to the final merger between Warner and Disney and just wait for all the crossovers and merchandise. |
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Post by profh0011 on May 6, 2019 14:18:16 GMT -5
It seems like Cyborg though is the one who became the major character generally in the wider DC world, he's even in the current Doom Patrol tv series with a Niles Caulder origin backstory. Was that in the '80s comics ever? As far as I know, we can thank the final season of Hanna-Barbera's "SUPER FRIENDS" for that-- when it was renamed "THE SUPER POWERS TEAM: GALACTIC GUARDIANS". Gerry Anderson's Firestorm had joined in the previous season (which was a major step up in quality from previous years), and Cyborg then joined in the final season (the first one, possibly, to ever mention the name "Justice League") The quality of the writing and the art in general took another major jump up that year, and I recall thinking, the last time I re-watched those.... "This was NO time to cancel this show!"
What continues to crack me up about those episodes, is that I think Frank Welker made a MUCH-scarier voice of Darkseid than Michael Ironside did later on. And this was the guy who was the voice of "Fred" on "SCOOBY-DOO"! |
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Post by profh0011 on May 6, 2019 14:25:00 GMT -5
"ultra rare", it says here...  |
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Post by beccabear67 on May 6, 2019 14:35:33 GMT -5
Interesting about Tony Isabella's Black Lightning. Gerry Anderson's Fire Storm was a Thunderbirds type team with animation done in Japan. No connection to the Super Friends or Gerry Conway written flame-headed DC character. The Cyborg figure looks pretty good actually, I remember some figures being really clunky like the Battlestar Galactica ones (except for Muffet) and Buck Rogers (except for Twiki). I never watched Super Friends much past the Wendy and Marvin era though.  |
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Post by rberman on May 6, 2019 15:54:13 GMT -5
As far as I know, we can thank the final season of Hanna-Barbera's "SUPER FRIENDS" for that-- when it was renamed "THE SUPER POWERS TEAM: GALACTIC GUARDIANS". Gerry Anderson's Firestorm had joined in the previous season (which was a major step up in quality from previous years), and Cyborg then joined in the final season (the first one, possibly, to ever mention the name "Justice League") The quality of the writing and the art in general took another major jump up that year, and I recall thinking, the last time I re-watched those.... "This was NO time to cancel this show!" The opening sequence of the 1973 Super-Friends begins, "In the great hall of the Justice League..." and there were many references to "Justice League" in both opening sequences and in-story dialogue thereafter. However, "... of America" was omitted so as not to alienate foreign viewers. |
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Post by MDG on May 6, 2019 16:41:24 GMT -5
Speaking of which, the Legion Cruiser in Superboy and the Legion of Super-Heroes look suspiciously like the Enterprise. |
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