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Post by rberman on May 5, 2019 13:46:06 GMT -5
I don't know that you can assign his influence as Greek mythology; certainly there are parallels. However, you can find the same archetypes in most myth cycles. Izaya is definitely a Jewish figure, far more than a Greek. Apart from being the ruler of the New Gods, he is more of an Old Testament figure, an Abraham and a Moses, with elements drawn from many Old testament figures, prophets and heroes. Orion is definitely not the Greek image, under the helmet. In many ways, Kirby rejects that Greek or Teutonic ideal, as Orion is scarred and bestial, in true appearance. Granted, that is due to birth on Apokolips, rather than new Genesis. In Greek myth, he is closer to Hephaestus. Lightray you can point to and say Greek, though you could also say Egyptian or Norse. There are many lightbringers, fleet of foot. Metron is another who I would ascribe more Jewish traits to, as a sort of rabbinical scholar, in search of ultimate knowledge. Really, he is more the idea of pure science, without the human aspect. Don't forget, as much as Kirby was interested in myth, he was also a lifelong lover of science fiction. You can find as many parallels to sci-fi classics, like AE Van Vogt and EE Smith. Celestials were not cruising around Marvel, yet. There were cosmic beings; but, the actual Celestials don't appear until Kirby's return, in the Eternals. The 4th World is an evolution of what Kirby had been doing in Thor and Fantastic Four and Eternals would be an evolution, or a redrafting of the 4th World. I classified Izaya as Zeus based on his status as "old white guy with a beard leading a pantheon of gods." I'm aware of the Abraham parallel coming; I'll have to wait and see how Moses fits into it, since I am coming at these issues for the first time ever. Orion is already a Greek hunter, though Kirby will go a different direction and pun the name into "O'Ryan" to fit with the redhaired scrapper stereotype. Orion is more feral than noble, perhaps Herakles in his worst moments. I can understand the rabbinical angle on Metron as well as the Oppenheimer connection. μέτρων is a Greek word which means "measures," and Metron does seem to put himself in charge of keeping things in their proper place, as he sees it. Obviously the Eternals would be much more explicitly Greek than these characters here. |
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Post by rberman on May 5, 2019 15:24:04 GMT -5
Mister Miracle #1 “Murder Missile Trap!” (April 1971) The Story: Wandering orphanage alumnus Scott Free happens upon an escape artist, Mister Miracle, who is practicing a fire trick. Some Intergang mobsters try to shake Miracle down, and Scott intervenes. The Inter-Gang division chief Steel Hand (whose steel hand is surprisingly functional) hears of this effrontery and vows payback.  Miracle takes Scott into his home and discusses his gadget guy Oberon, his dead son Ted, and his ideas for new escape tricks. Scott demonstrates his own ability to escape imprisonment, shattering metal chains without moving a muscle.  While rehearsing his next trick in the woods, Mister Miracle is assassinated by an Intergang sniper. Oberon reveals that this was the culmination of a long feud between Miracle and Steel Hand.  Scott Free dons the Mister Miracle costume and confronts Steel Hand in his Metropolis apartment. Scott is captured and chained to a rocket which is shot into the air and then detonated.  But no! Scott Free has survived this deathtrap! He again confronts Steel Hand at home, this time subduing him until the cops arrive.  My Two Cents: For now, this is simply a lighthearted adventure tale with no hint of a connection to the New Gods mythos. But it won’t stay that way for long. This issue also contains a one page essay by Marv Wolfman reporting that Jack Kirby had told him about the Hairies and the “Mountain of Judgment” story four years prior, when Kirby was still working at Marvel.
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Post by codystarbuck on May 5, 2019 19:46:57 GMT -5
I once had a rather poorly researched superhero trivia book that claimed Steranko created Mister Miracle. Boy did they get that one wrong! Steranko inspired the idea, with his escape artist past; but, the character was Kirby's. That was the worst of many errors in that book, which I soon tossed in the trash.
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Post by mikelmidnight on May 6, 2019 12:15:52 GMT -5
I once had a rather poorly researched superhero trivia book that claimed Steranko created Mister Miracle. Boy did they get that one wrong! Steranko inspired the idea, with his escape artist past; but, the character was Kirby's. That was the worst of many errors in that book, which I soon tossed in the trash.
And yet aside from one poster, Steranko has never drawn Mister Miracle (although he apparently scripted the JLU episode. One of my fantasy graphic novels would be a Steranko story set in the 1940s starring Len Brown, the original.
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Post by profh0011 on May 6, 2019 14:27:11 GMT -5
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Post by profh0011 on May 6, 2019 14:28:30 GMT -5
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Post by profh0011 on May 6, 2019 14:30:31 GMT -5
"Oberon"  |
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Post by rberman on May 6, 2019 19:54:58 GMT -5
Jimmy Olsen #136 “Begin The Saga of the D.N.Aliens Now!” (March 1971) The Story: The Golden Guardian battles the Kryptonite Giant to a standstill. The Giant grabs Jimmy Olsen and freaks out to realize they look identical. (How does the giant know what his own face looks like?) Suddenly, an explosion coming from the Giant’s hair incapacitates him. It was the work of a tiny soldier with a gas grenade, both part of The Project’s clone work.  More tiny soldiers appear and put the Giant in suspended animation by spraying liquid nitrogen all over him. This covers him “in an icy coat as strong as steel.” Yeah, that’s not what liquid nitrogen does at all, but Kirby is going for something like his Captain America cryosleep story. And even if you were going to spray a giant with liquid nitrogen, you wouldn’t do it with tiny soldiers using a thimble-sized canister of nitrogen.  The fight concluded, the rest of this issue is a big ol’ exposition dump. First, the Newsboy Dad Legion explains that when the original Guardian, Jim Harper, was killed in the line of duty in the 1940s, someone had the foresight to (somehow) preserve a tissue sample, which has been used in modern day to grow a clone to continue his fight against evil. A clone which is strong enough to survive a slugfest with a giant which knocked out Superman, apparently.  Then Superman explains how the clones of himself, Jimmy, and the Newsboy Dads go from petri dishes to creches to school before being released as young adults to slave away in the service of a military collective for the rest of their days. Everybody is totally cool with this arrangement, including the clones, who never dream of forging their own destiny. Kirby livens the exposition with a photo collage explaining to young readers about the importance of DNA.  Some of the clone embryos are subjected to chimerization experiments creating semi-human “aliens” like Dubbilex. Again, everybody thinks this is an excellent step forward for the human race.  Back at the Evil Factory, Mokkari and Simyan take a tongue-lashing from Darkseid via video screen. They should have gotten better control over the giant before teleporting him to The Project. Their next project is a clutch of eggs containing some mutated beasts which are beginning to hatch…  My Two Cents: Eight pages of action, fourteen pages of exposition. A risky approach for the sake of world-building, and I wonder whether Kirby’s commitment to the long game ultimately alienated readers who were not accustomed to that form of storytelling in their Superman funny books. Jimmy Olsen in particular had heretofore been aimed at a younger audience who enjoyed his silly monthly transformations. At least initially, Kirby brought in a broader, and probably older, readership. With the giant green Jimmy-clone, Kirby simultaneously homages past "Jimmy transformed" stories while giving readers a covert version of the "Superman vs the Hulk" story he knows they want. Superman and Jimmy awkwardly trade compliments after the defeat of the giant. Jimmy declares that in saving him, Superman has “closed the generation gap,” as if the two were many years in age apart and estranged, despite the many previous times Superman has saved Jimmy. Superman praises Jimmy’s “intestinal fortitude.” Thanks… I think?  Mokkari and and Simyan have considerately built a scale model showing the habitat, Wild Area, Zoomway, and Project. Their diagram is difficult to reconcile with what we actually saw in issues #133-135 of Jimmy Olsen. The Wild Area should be on the east side of (and include) the Habitat, and the Zoomway is partly underground and partly underwater, and more labyrinthine than depicted.  Simyan looks much less apelike than in his original appearance; instead of sideburns and a simian brow, he has the face-surrounding wreath of hair that characterizes many New Gods.  Superman has always known about the Project and has allowed them to clone himself. Is this where the idea of Superman clones being Bizarros will come from? It’s pretty surprising that in 1971 Kirby was writing stories in which Superman trusted the U.S. Army not to misuse Super-clones.  Also, the basic story here is that genetic manipulation has created two new breeds from humans: step-ups (elevated souls like the Hairies) and aliens (malformed creatures). This is like stories of the Celestials, which also had elevated souls (Inhumans) and malformed ones (Deviants). We’ll be seeing a similar dynamic between New Genesis (good, conventionally attractive white people) and Apokolips (an evil cavalcade of freaks in various colors). 
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Post by codystarbuck on May 6, 2019 23:03:42 GMT -5
The Inhumans were a result of Kree experiments; not the Celestials. That was the Eternals (and the Deviants).
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Post by rberman on May 7, 2019 7:42:55 GMT -5
There sure were a lot of alien astronauts running around!
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Post by codystarbuck on May 7, 2019 10:49:10 GMT -5
Kirby wasn't above recycling a good hook.
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Post by rberman on May 7, 2019 11:06:05 GMT -5
I should say not!  |
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Post by codystarbuck on May 7, 2019 11:12:43 GMT -5
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Post by rberman on May 7, 2019 12:20:39 GMT -5
The Forever People #2 “In Search of a Dream!” (May 1971) The Story: In a crypt under a cemetery, Darkseid rouses Mantis, a powerful Apokolips citizen, from his sleeping pod. He protests that he’s not quite done charging up, so Darkseid allows him to sleep sore more.  The Forever People cause a traffic snarl in downtown Metropolis, then teleport to a slum area and befriend a crippled boy Donnie and his heat-packing Uncle Willie. Beautiful Dreamer hypnotizes Willie so that she and her friends appear to be wearing normal Earth clothes.  Serifan sends Donnie on a psychedelic trip, courtesy of a “cosmic cartridge” carried in Serifan's hat. The name "Serifan" seems derived from the Hebrew "Seraphim," an order of divine servants mentioned briefly in the Bible.  Groooooooovy. When Mantis awakens from his subterranean pod and attacks the city, all five Forever People touch the Mother Box and transform into Infinity Man. He has a tough time defeating Mantis, whose can emit beams of electricity, ice, heat, or even anti-matter. But eventually Infinity Man prevails, and at dawn, Mantis is forced to flee back to his pod like some kind of vampire escaping sunrise. In fact, the cover even refers to him as “an evil power vampire.” No wonder his pod is in a crypt in the graveyard.  Meanwhile, Darkseid talks with Desaad about his quest for a human who can reveal the Anti-Life Equation to him. Nothing is said about the content or purpose of the Equation, though. The Forever people talk among themselves; they know of Darkseid’s quest for Anti-Life.  My Two Cents: It’s a pretty clear Dracula homage filling space. The Darkseid material is more interesting, and he comes across as plenty imposing this time around: no cape, bossing the powerful Mantis around. Mantis is a dumb name, though. His goal is simply world conquest, which seems petty to Darkseid, who is using Mantis to instill fear in the populace. This will enable the Anti-Life equation to manifest. Makes sense; that’s how fascism rose to power in 1930s Europe, riding waves of national anxiety.  There appears to be some confusion in this panel as to whether Big Bear is wearing gloves. His hand has fingernails visible but is colored orange. Also, Mark Moonrider’s hair is, as they say, “business in front, party in back.”  The background for the cover is a photo of a street in NYC. This issue also contains a one page editorial in which Mark Evanier explains the need to collect all four Kirby titles to get the whole story. “No one said comic books were easy to understand,” he half-apologizes.
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Post by berkley on May 8, 2019 2:14:46 GMT -5
I don't know that you can assign his influence as Greek mythology; certainly there are parallels. However, you can find the same archetypes in most myth cycles. Izaya is definitely a Jewish figure, far more than a Greek. Apart from being the ruler of the New Gods, he is more of an Old Testament figure, an Abraham and a Moses, with elements drawn from many Old testament figures, prophets and heroes. Orion is definitely not the Greek image, under the helmet. In many ways, Kirby rejects that Greek or Teutonic ideal, as Orion is scarred and bestial, in true appearance. Granted, that is due to birth on Apokolips, rather than new Genesis. In Greek myth, he is closer to Hephaestus. Lightray you can point to and say Greek, though you could also say Egyptian or Norse. There are many lightbringers, fleet of foot. Metron is another who I would ascribe more Jewish traits to, as a sort of rabbinical scholar, in search of ultimate knowledge. Really, he is more the idea of pure science, without the human aspect. Don't forget, as much as Kirby was interested in myth, he was also a lifelong lover of science fiction. You can find as many parallels to sci-fi classics, like AE Van Vogt and EE Smith. Celestials were not cruising around Marvel, yet. There were cosmic beings; but, the actual Celestials don't appear until Kirby's return, in the Eternals. The 4th World is an evolution of what Kirby had been doing in Thor and Fantastic Four and Eternals would be an evolution, or a redrafting of the 4th World. I classified Izaya as Zeus based on his status as "old white guy with a beard leading a pantheon of gods." I'm aware of the Abraham parallel coming; I'll have to wait and see how Moses fits into it, since I am coming at these issues for the first time ever. Orion is already a Greek hunter, though Kirby will go a different direction and pun the name into "O'Ryan" to fit with the redhaired scrapper stereotype. Orion is more feral than noble, perhaps Herakles in his worst moments. I can understand the rabbinical angle on Metron as well as the Oppenheimer connection. μέτρων is a Greek word which means "measures," and Metron does seem to put himself in charge of keeping things in their proper place, as he sees it. Obviously the Eternals would be much more explicitly Greek than these characters here. We all have our own take on this stuff. I'd agree that in general the New Gods was much more inspired by Judaeo-Christian mythology and its Good vs Evil world-view, while the Eternals feels more in tune with Greek myth, or at least a certain version of it.
But it isn't as straightforward or cut and dried as that sounds. Orion, for example, is more like a character from Greek myth - the darker versions of Heracles, as already mentioned, but an even more apt comparison would I think be Achilles: the son who was prophesied to surpass and overthrow Father Zeus - except that Zeus successfully evaded the prophecy by having Thetis marry the mortal Peleus instead of begetting a child with her himself. Achilles shares many of Orion's characteristics - pre-eminent warrior, barely held in check rage, even the wild/civilised man duality as he was brought up in the forest trained by the half-man, half-beast Cheiron.
And it is a duality: it's a big mistake to see Orion as more bestial than noble: the nobility is as real and as important as the other side of the coin. Even more importantly, Orion has made the free decision to overcome his darker, Apokoliptan side, to fight for New Genesis. Far from revelling in his savagery, a la Wolverine or whoever, he strives NOT to give in to this side of his nature - a point lost on too many later writers.
Personally, I wouldn't agree at all that the Eternals was a re-drafting of the New Gods. I see it as dealing with an entirely different set of ideas and concerns. For one thing, it is not at all a good vs evil scenario, appearances to the contrary: the Deviants aren't analogues of the Apokoliptans, the Celestials aren't updated and multiplied versions of the world-devouring Galactus. Of course, this, in my view, is one of the main reasons why later writers have failed to do the concept justice - they can't get their heads around this idea, since it doesn't fit their superhero-based view of what comics (comics that look like this, that is) are all about.
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