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Post by tarkintino on May 12, 2019 9:24:20 GMT -5
I’d day Superman returns is actually Superman III if continuity ignores the Richard Pryor film and Superman IV. But yeah, it’s apparently meant to be the Christopher Reeve Superman we see on screen, despite a few cosmetic changes. When in the mood to consider Superman Returns at all, I can convince myself to think of it as Superman III, since the original Superman III was garbage outside of the brief "dark" Superman scenes and the equally brief Lana Lang portion of the film. But in the end, I can disregard SIII, IV and Returns, and would not miss them if I never watched them again. |
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Post by badwolf on May 12, 2019 11:03:19 GMT -5
All I know is that it’s the single most boring movie I ever tried to watch. Boring and depressing. Brandon Routh as...Super-Stalker!
Loved Kevin Spacey, the rest was rubbish.
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Post by Duragizer on May 12, 2019 17:20:41 GMT -5
As one of the few Supes fans who dislikes the Reeve films (ALL of them), I'm not at all pleased that the first Superman film made after a 19-year hiatus returned to that tapped-out well. And it's a @#$%ing retread of the first film on top of it.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2019 18:10:29 GMT -5
As one of the few Supes fans who dislikes the Reeve films (ALL of them), I'm not at all pleased that the first Superman film made after a 19-year hiatus returned to that tapped-out well. And it's a @#$%ing retread of the first film on top of it. I like the Reeve films for the most part, but it's always interesting to explore another view. What did you dislike about the Reeve films? I'd be particularly interested in views on the first movie. |
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Post by Duragizer on May 12, 2019 19:20:24 GMT -5
As one of the few Supes fans who dislikes the Reeve films (ALL of them), I'm not at all pleased that the first Superman film made after a 19-year hiatus returned to that tapped-out well. And it's a @#$%ing retread of the first film on top of it. I like the Reeve films for the most part, but it's always interesting to explore another view. What did you dislike about the Reeve films? I'd be particularly interested in views on the first movie. I should list the things I do like about the Reeve films first. - Reeve's performance as Superman (I'm not wild about Klutz Kent, though).
- The "Clark vs. Evil Superman" fight in Superman III.
- Annette O'Toole's Lana.
- Terence Stamp's Zod.
- The Smallville scenes in Superman: The Movie.
- The diner scenes in Superman II.
Everything else about the series either infuriates me (Hackman's Luthor; Superman's random one-off powers; the campiness) or leaves me cold (Kidder's Lois; Brando's Jor-El; the Christ allusions). |
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Post by rberman on May 13, 2019 13:35:12 GMT -5
A Roman numeral obviously is a flag planted for the benefit of those who loved the previous installment. "If you liked Fast and Furious #8, here's #9..." But after twenty years, calling it Superman V would have been counterproductive with the young audience that didn't grow up with Donner/Reeve. Furthermore, Singer was ignoring the previous III and IV and wouldn't have wanted to legitimize them by using V for this one.
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Post by brutalis on May 13, 2019 13:58:54 GMT -5
Brandon Routhe is the George Lazenby/Timothy Dalton of Superman films. Could Have Would Have been a wonderful Superman given a better movie/story. Returns is dark, un-heroic and sloooooow as all get out with only a few good moments to be found but not much else to recommend it.
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Post by badwolf on May 13, 2019 18:14:10 GMT -5
I always thought Routh was too young; he looked more like Superboy than Superman. Same with the actress who played Lois. Even though they might have been the same age as the actors who played the original roles, people look younger now.
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Post by chadwilliam on May 13, 2019 18:41:19 GMT -5
I can remember very little about the film other than being bored senseless by it, but I do recall Routh quoting Reeves when he assures some passengers aboard a plane he just rescued that "statistically speaking, it's still the safest way to travel". Of all the lines from the first film that could be recycled here as Superman's new catchphrase, why this one? "Up, up, and away", "This looks like a job for Superman", and "Statistically speaking, it's still the safest way to travel"? It might be considered a trivial concern, but it sort of suggests that the new filmmakers simply decided that rather than take the best elements of the Reeves films and build upon that, they could just grab anything from the first film at random, and simply by being recognized as "Hey, that belch sounded like it came from Christopher Reeves" their new product was now connected to what came before. At the same time however, their film felt disconnected from the Reeves films in a number of ways. Why is Clark Kent copying his bumbling, awkward fellow routine from the Reeves films one moment, and then uncharacteristically for the Reeves version, chugging back a beer as if it's the most natural thing in the world in the next? Why does Spacey seem frequently on the verge of channelling Hackman only to abruptly do something else in the next moment? Actually, come to think of it, did Superman ever get a rematch against Luthor after he stabbed him with that kryptonite? I seem to remember being disappointed that after Luthor kills Superman, Superman gets better only to pick up the island Luthor's on, drop it off at prison or something, and then flies away. Did they even exchange words in this film? Seems really odd that we'd get more time spent on FX than we do on actual Good Guy vs. Bad Guy stuff.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2019 19:57:00 GMT -5
From Wikipedia
At the 2006 Spike TV Awards, Routh won the award of "Best Superhero" as Superman in Superman Returns, beating out among others, Hugh Jackman as Wolverine.
Personally, I think that Superman Returns is far better than Superman III and IV and I wanted to remind all of you that Routh was 24 when he did Superman and Christopher Reeve was 26 when he did Superman the Movie. The age factor has no bearing on any o the two actors at all. I felt that I was very surprised to see that Spike named him Best Superhero beating Hugh Jackson and others. I just find it hard to believe and just I was reminded by a friend that just told me.
I think Superman Returns had its moments and its has that Comic Book feel and I do find Kevin Spacey was better than Gene Hackman as Lex Luthor and that Island Scene that Superman lifted and being surrounded by Kryptonite and facing death and finally survived and all that was by far the best scene in that movie. It was suspenseful and dramatic by the bucketful.
I actually enjoyed that movie and most of all I just feel a bit angry at the multitudes of fans that bash Brandon Routh as Superman and he actually showed some Christopher Reeve's characteristics and style to some degree and all that. I rather watch Returns over the last two films of Reeve did.
I'm not a fan of Henry Cavill as Superman and sorry don't care for the Man of Steel and now Routh is now playing the part of the Atom in Legends of Tomorrow that I don't watch at all and that's alone is a discredit to him and his talents as an actor. I find him in Superman Returns a rather unique perspective and had that enormous problems of replacing Christopher Reeve and that alone is totally unfair to him and the fans that criticized him. I find that totally unjustified and wrong that alone derailed his career in the worst way possible.
I just feel this way personally and I do enjoy Superman Returns and I loved that Bullet Scene seeing the bullets bouncing off his eye and that really a farout scene in that movie.
That's all I have to say about it and in Routh's defense.
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Post by badwolf on May 13, 2019 21:44:26 GMT -5
If the only competition that year was the first Wolverine movie then...I guess I'd come down on the side of Superman Returns too.
I know the actors were around the same age but Reeve looks quite a bit older than that to me. Mid-30s maybe. Kate Bosworth also looked much younger than Margot Kidder.
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Post by tarkintino on May 15, 2019 21:29:59 GMT -5
Brandon Routhe is the George Lazenby/Timothy Dalton of Superman films. Could Have Would Have been a wonderful Superman given a better movie/story. Returns is dark, un-heroic and sloooooow as all get out with only a few good moments to be found but not much else to recommend it. Actually, that comparison is not applicable, since Lazenby's On Her Majesty's Secret Service is routinely considered one of the greatest of all Bond movies, while Dalton's second (and last) film-- License to Kill--is considered one of the best Bond movies since the pre-Moore period. |
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Post by brutalis on May 16, 2019 7:47:01 GMT -5
Brandon Routhe is the George Lazenby/Timothy Dalton of Superman films. Could Have Would Have been a wonderful Superman given a better movie/story. Returns is dark, un-heroic and sloooooow as all get out with only a few good moments to be found but not much else to recommend it. Actually, that comparison is not applicable, since Lazenby's On Her Majesty's Secret Service is routinely considered one of the greatest of all Bond movies, while Dalton's second (and last) film-- License to Kill--is considered one of the best Bond movies since the pre-Moore period. True enough. But both Lazenby and Dalton were given no real chance to continue and build a following as at the time their films were considerably less than what the Companies had hoped for. Both Lazenby and Dalton as Bond were never really given time as Bond for people to appreciate them more. Routhe falls into a similar mode in that many really liked his performance and would have liked to seen more from him in the role, while others have said they don't care him as Superman. |
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Post by Randle-El on May 16, 2019 10:22:46 GMT -5
To me, Superman Returns and Man of Steel represented two extremes, the middle of which could be a pretty good Superman movie. There were definitely elements of each that I liked.
SR:
Portraying Superman as a protector rather than a fighter (most of his super-feats involve saving people rather than fighting bad guys)
Connecting to the Donner films through the John Williams themes, skipping the origin story, the visual look of the Fortress of Solitude, etc
John Ottman contributed a pretty good score beyond the re-use of the JW themes
MoS:
The idea of Superman as an inspirational symbol of hope
With his square jaw, cleft chin, and physique, Henry Cavill definitely looked the part of Superman
Turning up the action in comparison to SR
But there were also things that both films got pretty wrong too, IMO.
SR:
Going beyond homage to an almost paint-by-numbers remake of the first Donner film
Routh makes a pretty good Clark Kent, but not a great Superman
Both Routh and Bosworth look too young to portray characters that are at least five years older than their Donner counterparts
Superman's action scenes mostly consisting of him lifting really big things.
The suit
MoS:
Presenting the idea of Superman as a symbol of hope... and then spending the rest of the film making him an object of suspicion and fear
Turning up the action... but also trying to make Superman a warrior
Two words (borrowed from Mark Waid, someone who knows a thing or two about Superman): disaster porn
The suit
Perhaps the scene I found most laughable in MoS is near the end, after the battle is over, Metropolis lying in total ruins, the young female employee of the Daily Planet named Jenny says "He saved us!" Yes, because it's all about you and not the thousands dead or wounded around you.
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