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Post by String on Jul 7, 2019 12:36:00 GMT -5
I recently acquired a batch of various Flash issues which included a two-part serial from #266-267 by Bates and Norvick. Heat Wave is the main villain of this arc and at one point, he manages to not only subdue Flash but also unmask him!!.......only to discover he has no idea at whom he is looking at.
I think this highlights a flaw in the whole 'must protect secret identity' trope. Obviously, a big selling point on covers (and in stories as well) is the dangerous notion of our masked hero being unmasked and exposed for all the public to see. However, how dangerous is it really?
In this example, Mick sees Barry's face but has no idea who he is. Where would he even start to find out who this person is? I think this only works if the identity is publicly known to some degree to start with. Batman may be the be most vulnerable to this as Bruce Wayne is a noted public figure in Gotham City. Superman, maybe, though I haven't read enough of his Silver or Bronze Age stories to see how much anyone has noticed facial similarities between Clark and Superman.
If someone were to take off Robin's domino mask, what are the chances they recognize him as Dick Grayson?
Jay Garrick supposedly always vibrated his face so as not to be seen but would anyone know him if they did? (I don't know any police lab techs in my city, just saying).
What about Hal? Would you know a test pilot?
I think this potential flaw was best highlighted in Amazing Spider-Man #12 when Peter was unmasked by Doc Ock and no one believed it.
Thoughts? Or other instances where heroes were unmasked to the confusion of the villain(s)?
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Post by Prince Hal on Jul 7, 2019 13:36:56 GMT -5
Nowadays, a villain could employ facial recognition software, but with several exceptions (Bruce Wayne, Clark Kent, Oliver Queen), yeah, the DC heroes anyway would have been relatively unfamiliar.
However, Dick Grayson and Roy Harper, by dint of being wards of Wayne and Queen, would have at least been considered logical choices for Robin and Speedy if their mentors were ever unmasked.
Still, one picture sent to newspapers and TV of a hero unmasked by a villain would have been enough to identify them.
Same at Marvel, where most heroes operated in NYC; one picture of them with their faces revealed and printed or broadcast on TV would have smoked them out.
And, yes, IIRC, there was an older story in which Batman was unmasked, but none of the crooks recognized him.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2019 13:47:28 GMT -5
Not quite the same (perhaps) but in the live-action Hulk series, how many people saw the Hulk change back to David Banner? No-one recognised him.
Which, of course, did make sense. The only people who would have recognised David Banner were those reading his journals/science work. The average person, and he did cross various states, wouldn't have known him just like I wouldn't know a person whose photo might only have appeared in the British Medical Journal.
That said, one episode ("Interview With The Hulk") featured a journalist who, upon seeing "John Doe", immediately recognised him as Banner.
But in the majority of episodes where scientists featured, people knew the name Dr. Banner, but not the face.
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Post by berkley on Jul 8, 2019 2:58:44 GMT -5
When I see this thread title, all I can think of is, "Who who, who who?"
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Post by Phil Maurice on Jul 8, 2019 7:03:32 GMT -5
Or other instances where heroes were unmasked to the confusion of the villain(s)? In the Justice League Unlimited episode "The Great Brain Robbery," Luthor switches bodies with the Flash (Wally West). Realizing he holds the key to Flash's secret identity, he sprints to a mirror and unmasks only to see the face of a complete stranger, totally unknown to him and of no value at all, much like your first example. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 8, 2019 7:51:16 GMT -5
In the information age ( now) , social media will make it harder to recycle that plot. Today, Every time someone gets caught on camera doing something dumb, they get identified. Case in point, the woman who took an ice cream out of the fridge in the supermarket and licked it before putting it back. Someone will know you and give up your name.
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Post by Phil Maurice on Jul 8, 2019 9:38:14 GMT -5
Case in point, the woman who took an ice cream out of the fridge in the supermarket and licked it before putting it back. Ugh. The dreaded "Sputti Frutti."  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 12:05:58 GMT -5
I'm just surprised no-one made the link between Prince Adam and He-Man in Filmation's Masters of the Universe. Isn't there a branch of Specsavers on Eternia?
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Post by rberman on Jul 8, 2019 12:16:48 GMT -5
I was surprised when the second Raimi Spider-Man film featured an unmasked, unconscious Spidey in a subway car full of civilians. I don’t recall him being worried later.
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Post by Farrar on Jul 8, 2019 12:40:36 GMT -5
When I see this thread title, all I can think of is, "Who who, who who?"LOL, when I saw your comment, all I could think of was this   I am quite the Who fan, though. Saw them a few times, always great shows! Apologies for the digression  Now back to our regularly scheduled topic. |
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Post by chadwilliam on Jul 8, 2019 12:45:12 GMT -5
If someone were to take off Robin's domino mask, what are the chances they recognize him as Dick Grayson? Jay Garrick supposedly always vibrated his face so as not to be seen but would anyone know him if they did? (I don't know any police lab techs in my city, just saying). I think this potential flaw was best highlighted in Amazing Spider-Man #12 when Peter was unmasked by Doc Ock and no one believed it. In Detective Comics 374 ( "Hunt for a Robin Killer") Robin is badly beaten and Batman takes him to the hospital. After a doctor has to remove his mask to tend to him, Batman remarks "It was worth your discovering Robin's secret identity to save his life, Doctor..." the Doctor responds with "But I haven't the slightest idea who Robin is! After all, in a city of eight million people, I can't know everybody by sight..." A few years prior to that, in Batman 173 ( "Secret Identities for Sale!") a photographer named Pearson has developed an X-Ray camera which takes effect when the image is held before a mirror. Pearson shows a picture of Batman and Robin to villain Mr. Incognito and while they see the faces of Bruce Wayne and Dick Grayson reflected in the mirror clearly, as the photographer notes "Of course, I don't know the names of these two yet -- but that shouldn't be hard to track down now!" At the end of the story, Batman figures that Incognito saw their faces for only a fleeting moment before he and Robin broke into the room, but as for Pearson, "You know Dick, there's a reasonable chance that our unmasked faces may be indelibly-stamped in Pearson's mind! But there's a better chance he doesn't know which of the many millions of faces in Gotham City they belong to!" Robin notes that with Pearson spending the next ten years in prison, "we'll just have to hope our paths don't cross [when he gets out]". Spider-Man 262 (" Trade Secret") has a photographer stumble upon Peter Parker while he's changing into Spider-Man. He snaps a shot, later loses the negative, and while he has no doubt that he'll recognize Spider-Man's true face should be ever see it again, he realises that in a city the size of New York, such an eventuality is practically impossible. As for The Golden Age Flash vibrating his head all the time - I wonder how many people bought the whole "I have to do this to protect my secret identity" and how many figured he was suffering from alcohol withdrawal or something like that. "I'm shaking to hide my face!" "Why don't you just wear a mask then?" "uhhhh……" |
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Post by Prince Hal on Jul 8, 2019 13:08:50 GMT -5
And just to take all this a step further, just how much does a domino mask like those worn by Robin, the Green Lanterns of Earths One and Two, Green Arrow, Speedy, and dozens more, hide one's identity?
The domino is just a variation on Clark Kent and Diana Prince's glasses, and we know how effective they appear to anyone but a comics reader.
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Post by MDG on Jul 8, 2019 13:26:21 GMT -5
And just to take all this a step further, just how much does a domino mask like those worn by Robin, the Green Lanterns of Earths One and Two, Green Arrow, Speedy, and dozens more, hide one's identity? I've had people show up at my Halloween party with full over-the-head rubber masks and still recognized them almost immediately.
What I want to know is how Batman's mask makes his eyeballs disappear?
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Post by Prince Hal on Jul 8, 2019 13:31:12 GMT -5
And just to take all this a step further, just how much does a domino mask like those worn by Robin, the Green Lanterns of Earths One and Two, Green Arrow, Speedy, and dozens more, hide one's identity? I've had people show up at my Halloween party with full over-the-head rubber masks and still recognized them almost immediately.
What I want to know is how Batman's mask makes his eyeballs disappear?
Buys it from the same guy who makes the Phantom's.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 13:35:33 GMT -5
An editor (possibly a UK Batman publication) equated Bats' eye slits with a two-way mirror. He sees out, we don't see in.
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Now back to our regularly scheduled topic.
