|
Post by brutalis on May 5, 2021 10:39:34 GMT -5
Jumping in here for a moment about my Bat reading. Lets start with a giant coincidence my name is Bruce Wayne Hinds. NOT named after the comic character as neither of my parents knew of the alter ego for Batman as they never read any of his comics. Given my father and my uncle's middle names since my mother refused to give me my grandfather and dad's name forever marking me as a 3rd.
Growing up my 1st Batman memories are of the Adam West show, an old paperback pages turned yellow with a red cover which reprinted Bob Kane (only name spotlighted so I never knew otherwise how little he truly had to do with it all) Bat's origin and early adventures gifted to me from my grandparents from a thrift store.. That was around age 6. Then the cartoons and around age 12 comic books became a "thing" in my life. From age 12 to age 15 (roughly 1974 to 1978) I was limited in comic purchases by my mother so I would only grab the occasional Batman.
Then high school during my sophomore year 1977 I began finding Batman, Detective and Brave & Bold regularly at several Circle-K stores near my school. Now I was able to pick and choose what issues interested me most. What sucked was the inconsistency of never finding consecutive issues regularly at the stores. It was difficult hunting so many times I flipped through issues only to put them aside for being part 1 or 2 or 3 of a story.
Senior year 1980 I was getting quite a few single story issues and that summer across from my college as a freshman I found my 1st LCS. THEN I WAS IN HEAVEN. Now began my foray into collecting Battyman as I had him on my pull list. Batman the main title was kind of hit or miss for my liking but the Grant/Breyfogle team made Detective as my favorite very quickly. Aparo had me grab up B&B until its end. The coming of Moench Newton Colan will soon arrive and become MY Batman.
Watch for more comments as Shax progresses in his reviews.
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on May 1, 2022 12:58:17 GMT -5
Batman #476 (April 1992) "The Return of Scarface! Part Three: The Gig Heat!" Script: Alan Grant Pencils: Norm Breyfogle Inks: Norm Breyfogle Colors: Adrienne Roy Letters: Todd Klein Grade: B- (Note: I reviewed the previous two parts of this storyline here and here)You're forgiven if you found the cover of this issue misleading. I'd always assumed it was Bruce revealing his identity to Babs Gordon, myself. But even if you'd been following this story all along and knew that was Vicki Vale in the hospital bed, it's a total fakeout. Bruce reveals his identity to her in a daydream, but ultimately decides that telling Vicki the truth would jeaopardize both of their lives. Total cop-out. Which is not to say that this issue is without merit. There's actually a lot to enjoy about this one, most notably the fact that Scarface is still at large by the end of the story, having taken out the two largest gangs in Gotham and consolidated power for himself without Batman even suspecting his involvement. Usually, these sorts of storylines end with the bad guy getting captured, but Grant and Breyfogle decide to go out on a far more unsettling note: Of course, aspects of this are a little hard to believe. For example, why wouldn't Batman be watching Scarface and The Ventriloquist carefully after their early release from prison, and why doesn't Batman question why there was a bomb placed at the scene where the two rival gangs were set to meet? Shouldn't he be interested in the fact that someone set these two gangs up and effectively executed them? Maybe we'll finally go there next issue. Art-wise, Breyfogle seems to be going out of his way to continue drawing Gotham in the Gothic style established by Anton Furst for the Batman films, which made its way to the comic book page two months back during the Destroyer storyline. I commented then that Furst seemed to draw a lot of inspiration from Fritz Lang's 1927 cinema masterpiece, Metropolis, and Breyfogle makes that connection even more obvious here. Observe the visual parallels between the tower from which Metropolis was governed and the new(/old) GCPD headquarters, both in terms of exterior: and in the President/Commissioner's office, with the big window overlooking the city and control panels filled with switches that control the city below: And yet, while Breyfogle's buildings may have gotten more sophisticated, his art somehow comes off as more cartoony this time around, almost like it's straight out of the upcoming Batman: The Animated Series. Take, for example, the big climactic moment of the issue, which should be intense, and yet is undercut by its simplicity and lack of line-work: or this panel from the opening scene: It's not what we've come to expect from Breyfogle, and that uncharacteristic lightness seems especially wrong for a storyline this dark, featuring a villain that Breyfogle's art is trying to make us take more seriously: All in all, while I really respect the ending of this storyline, I am annoyed by the fake-out the cover creates, as well as the logic lapses allowing Batman to miss Scarface's consolidation of power, and Breyfogle's art bothers me a bit too. Glad to see Scarface back and thriving, but Grant and Breyfogle definitely could have brought a better quality of work to this triumphant return. Minor Details:1. I am normally in awe of Adrienne Roy, but what the heck happened with Renee Montoya's face? Does she really not know how to color Latin Americans?? 2. Batman rushes into a building, knowing a bomb is about to go off. There are a ton of gang members in plain sight, but Batman leaves all of them to their doom in order to find Jim Gordon and pull off a 100 to 1 gamble to save him and him only: I'm not saying it's the wrong choice, but how odd that Grant's script doesn't even take a moment to consider it? Shouldn't there be some level of guilt/regret weighing upon Bruce in the aftermath? 3. This moment raises a pretty good question in regard to the Batman mythos: How does Batman get the Batmobile through Downtown traffic on a regular basis, and where would he leave it while answering the Bat Signal? These panels would seem to suggest that the norm is for him to have The Batmobile with him/at his disposal when he answers the call.
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on May 1, 2022 20:43:34 GMT -5
Watch for more comments as Shax progresses in his reviews. Don't I wish it, my good man.
|
|
|
Post by thwhtguardian on May 2, 2022 17:30:47 GMT -5
Batman #476 (April 1992) And yet, while Breyfogle's buildings may have gotten more sophisticated, his art somehow comes off as more cartoony this time around, almost like it's straight out of the upcoming Batman: The Animated Series. Take, for example, the big climactic moment of the issue, which should be intense, and yet is undercut by its simplicity and lack of line-work: or this panel from the opening scene: Wow, I never picked up on it but I can't unsee it now. The cowl looks exactly like Bruce Timm's take on Batman, so much so that it just has to be a direct homage. I wonder why he chose to do that here?
|
|
|
Post by chadwilliam on May 2, 2022 23:26:34 GMT -5
Batman #476 (April 1992) "The Return of Scarface! Part Three: The Gig Heat!" Script: Alan Grant Pencils: Norm Breyfogle Inks: Norm Breyfogle Colors: Adrienne Roy Letters: Todd Klein Grade: B- (Note: I reviewed the previous two parts of this storyline here and here)You're forgiven if you found the cover of this issue misleading. I'd always assumed it was Bruce revealing his identity to Babs Gordon, myself. But even if you'd been following this story all along and knew that was Vicki Vale in the hospital bed, it's a total fakeout. Bruce reveals his identity to her in a daydream, but ultimately decides that telling Vicki the truth would jeaopardize both of their lives. Total cop-out. I never quite figured out who Vicki Vale was post-Crisis. When reintroduced in Batman #408, she's definitely anti-Batman. If any of her pre-Crisis history remained then she certainly underwent a radical change given that this former Batman admirer was now trying to get Bruce Wayne to lend his name to her anti-Batman crusade. "Who better than Bruce Wayne to understand -- and take a stand -- against the violence of Batman?" "That Halloween hooligan! He's a menace - he even got a young boy killed!" and so on and so on. She returns in Batman #445 and it certainly doesn't seem as if they have much of a history beyond "[Vicki and I] met about a year or so ago when she took some photographs of my home". Her opinion of Wayne has certainly dwindled since we saw her last (assuming that Collins' tale remains in continuity at this time, which it doesn't seem to). "He's gorgeous, but he's got all the substance of flash paper." and her earlier contention that having witnessed his parents' murder provided him with an understanding of the world others might lack, here she's convinced that that tragedy merely resulted in producing something of a simpleton. "I guess that's what comes from having never worked a day in your life". Detective #613 has the two on a date but things don't go anywhere and seems to disappear until Batman #455-457 rolls around and both Vale and Batman are captured by The Scarecrow. They don't exchange words, but it is notable since I think it's the first time post-Crisis that they've (Batman and Vicki) been depicted together. Somewhat interestingly, though it's Batman who consoles her, Tim Drake is the one who rescues her. Also, she doesn't cross paths with Bruce Wayne here. Batman #460-461 has Bruce and Vicki casually dating but, once again, her path doesn't really cross with Batman. Once again, she gets into trouble, but actually gets herself out of it with help from Catwoman and Sarah Essen. Her only interaction with Batman is a "did I miss something" moment when Batman arrives after the nick of time. I imagine that there are a few more appearances, but Vicki doesn't seem to have much of a relationship with Bruce Wayne or Batman prior to this storyline leading me to wonder not just where Bruce Wayne's feelings are coming from but what sort of impact revealing himself to be Batman would have on Vale. I mean, sure, you don't have to know Batman personally to recognize immediately that if he's Bruce Wayne then Bruce Wayne can't be the vapid playboy his reputation suggests he is, but it also seems like Grant is playing this up like "What if Clark Kent told Lois Lane he was Superman" moment when in fact, this Clark Kent doesn't have much of a relationship with Lois Lane and this Lois Lane is pretty much strangers with Superman. If Bruce Wayne were to tell Vicki he were The Green Arrow, for example would that have any less of an impact on her?
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on May 3, 2022 6:55:53 GMT -5
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on May 3, 2022 14:38:41 GMT -5
I never quite figured out who Vicki Vale was post-Crisis. When reintroduced in Batman #408, she's definitely anti-Batman. If any of her pre-Crisis history remained then she certainly underwent a radical change given that this former Batman admirer was now trying to get Bruce Wayne to lend his name to her anti-Batman crusade. "Who better than Bruce Wayne to understand -- and take a stand -- against the violence of Batman?" "That Halloween hooligan! He's a menace - he even got a young boy killed!" and so on and so on. She returns in Batman #445 and it certainly doesn't seem as if they have much of a history beyond "[Vicki and I] met about a year or so ago when she took some photographs of my home". Her opinion of Wayne has certainly dwindled since we saw her last (assuming that Collins' tale remains in continuity at this time, which it doesn't seem to). "He's gorgeous, but he's got all the substance of flash paper." and her earlier contention that having witnessed his parents' murder provided him with an understanding of the world others might lack, here she's convinced that that tragedy merely resulted in producing something of a simpleton. "I guess that's what comes from having never worked a day in your life". Detective #613 has the two on a date but things don't go anywhere and seems to disappear until Batman #455-457 rolls around and both Vale and Batman are captured by The Scarecrow. They don't exchange words, but it is notable since I think it's the first time post-Crisis that they've (Batman and Vicki) been depicted together. Somewhat interestingly, though it's Batman who consoles her, Tim Drake is the one who rescues her. Also, she doesn't cross paths with Bruce Wayne here. Batman #460-461 has Bruce and Vicki casually dating but, once again, her path doesn't really cross with Batman. Once again, she gets into trouble, but actually gets herself out of it with help from Catwoman and Sarah Essen. Her only interaction with Batman is a "did I miss something" moment when Batman arrives after the nick of time. I imagine that there are a few more appearances, but Vicki doesn't seem to have much of a relationship with Bruce Wayne or Batman prior to this storyline leading me to wonder not just where Bruce Wayne's feelings are coming from but what sort of impact revealing himself to be Batman would have on Vale. I mean, sure, you don't have to know Batman personally to recognize immediately that if he's Bruce Wayne then Bruce Wayne can't be the vapid playboy his reputation suggests he is, but it also seems like Grant is playing this up like "What if Clark Kent told Lois Lane he was Superman" moment when in fact, this Clark Kent doesn't have much of a relationship with Lois Lane and this Lois Lane is pretty much strangers with Superman. If Bruce Wayne were to tell Vicki he were The Green Arrow, for example would that have any less of an impact on her? Okay, I'm home from work and got a chance to trek through the old reviews. What I've come up with really shouldn't have been a surprise -- just as different writers have totally ignored competing depictions of Batman and his world, so too have they written entirely different Vicki Vales. Max Collins made her a tough reporter who was critical of Batman and had the potential to become a sincere obstacle to him. Marv Wolfman tried to sort of mimic Doug Moench's Pre-Crisis arc for Vicki, having her endure trauma and come out the other end of it, only he handled it a lot more tastefully than Moench. At least one editor at DC felt the Pre-Crisis and Post-Crisis Vicki were the same person. And Grant took the least interesting approach of all, depicting Vicki as a sometimes love interest with no real personality besides that. I'm guessing he was facing pressure from O'Neil to align better with the film continuity, thus giving him a need to cross Vicki off as a potential love interest ahead of Batman Returns. But yes, it really does support your point that this big decision to reveal Bruce's identity to Vicki comes out of nowhere. It makes sense if you are thinking of the 1989 film, but not if your primary interest is in Batman as depicted in the comics.
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on Jun 11, 2022 10:46:26 GMT -5
Gotham Nights #2 (April 1992) "Dreams" Script: John Ostrander Pencils: Mary Mitchell Inks: Bruce Patterson Colors: Adrienne Roy Letters: John Costanza Grade: C+ (Note: My review of Gotham Night #1 can be found here) What would have worked brilliantly as a stand-alone graphic novel begins to struggle a bit as a story told in installments, the second issue faltering without the momentum of the first. Sure, we still have Mitchell's brilliant cityscapes, ably assisted by Patterson and Roy: each section having its own shapes, arrangements, colors, and energy: but, beyond that, the ongoing stories of ordinary Gothamites going about their daily lives is barely enough to sustain our interest. One continues to date recklessly and without attachment (I'm already sensing the irony that she may end up with AIDS after mentioning it last issue), one turns out to be haunted by the memory of his dead wife, one continues to engage in ridiculous romantic fantasies (this time marrying Batman while all the DC heroines are fatter than she is), etc etc. Perhaps the most disappointing of these is the elderly couple facing the husband's terminal prognosis. Whereas this was a powerful dilemma for the husband as he suffered with his own thoughts last issue, he now casually shares them with his wife, and the two weigh the options together with the same intensity with which they might decide where to go for dinner: The tension is gone. Meanwhile, the most successful of these so far is the evolving story of Dio, the ex-con who is inevitably falling back into his old behaviors. Possibly the most surprisingly emotional moment of the issue was where he convinced the gang to let him in on the job in exchange for info about how to deal with Batman: It's clever, and we feel Dio's sense of acceptance along with him once they all start laughing in response. This is where he belongs, and we get that on an emotional level, whereas I feel so little for the others right now. It's therefore even more disturbing when Dio goes home to his wife and is an abusive monster to her all over again. He doesn't fit anywhere other than with his gang. That's the world he understands, and he greets everything else with fear and rage. As for Batman's presence in this issue, it's even more muted than in the first one. There, he was a terrifying and unpleasant disruption to these ordinary lives. Here, he is just a minor disruption, one character getting annoyed after mistaking the Bat Signal for the moon, and another engaging in an absurd romantic fantasy about marrying Batman and discovering that his real name is Frank and that The Joker is actually his half-brother. There's still plenty of room for these characters to win the readers over, but this is a weak second act that doesn't stand well on its own. The heart of this thing is the creepy majesty of Gotham itself and of its protector as viewed by the squabbling throng of ordinary citizens who neither appreciate nor understand them, just trying to live their lives in the background of a Batman panel. Ostrander is losing sight of that. Minor Details:1. Maybe this really was intended as a graphic novel. Otherwise, it's damn strange when Dio makes a meaningful reference here: to what seemed like a throw-away insult a full issue earlier: I'm really annoyed that I had to go back and find that reference when the dialogue could have easily made it clear WHAT Hector had said that afternoon.
|
|
|
Post by chadwilliam on Jul 21, 2022 17:53:43 GMT -5
Alan Grant passed away yesterday and I think that's worth a mention here.
I'd probably rank him as one of the ten best writers who worked consistently on Batman and the last who could honestly be labelled one of the greats. I guess his work on Judge Dredd would explain the plethora of great villains he added to Batman's gallery of rogues - Mortimer Kadaver, Cornelius Stirk, The Ratcatcher, Anarky, and most importantly of all, The Ventriloquist and Scarface - and why such a rapid fire introduction of such foes at a time when Batman seemed to acquire a new worthwhile addition to the ranks of this list only sporadically seemed to come so effortlessly from Grant's pen.
I suppose you could argue that Grant benefited from being paired up with Norm Breyfogle - in my opinion, second only to Jim Aparo himself as Batman's best artist - but he did some amazing work without him. Batman/Judge Dredd: Judgement on Gotham may very well be the best story The Scarecrow has even gotten; "The Misfits" (Batman: Shadow of the Bat #7-9) is as entertaining and original as anything he did with Breyfogle, and as inspired an idea as the meek Arnold Wesker controlling a puppet which, in turn, violently controls him is, he actually manages to make such an idea even more psychologically complex yet entirely believable with the tale he told with John Wagner in Showcase '94 #8-9.
"The Secret Origin of Scarface"... man, I don't even know where to begin with this one. When Arnold Wesker is sentenced to Blackgate prison, he meets his cellmate Donnegan and his puppet Woody. Donnegan is a lifer who suspects that he's going mad when his dummy spills the secrets of the hidden escape tunnel he's been building for 15 years during a talent show in the prison. Though dismissed as a joke, Donnegan begins to wonder just who's controlling who here. Insanely possessive of the dummy, Donnegan threatens to kill Wesker should he ever touch Woody. However, when Donnegan sleeps the doll threatens to wake him if Wesker doesn't take him when he uses Donnegan's escape route. Is the doll alive? Is Wesker going crazy? Is Donnegan so crazy that he's now throwing his voice in his sleep? And what happens when Woody decides to throw his chips in with Wesker. Such a brilliant story, but with Grant, there were so many.
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on Jul 21, 2022 21:33:45 GMT -5
Just got back from my honeymoon the other day and worked through the jetlag in time to leave for the annual family vacation in a few hours, so I thought to myself, "I'll check in on the CCF and make sure nothing too crazy has happened while I've been gone..." Alan Grant passed away yesterday and I think that's worth a mention here. I am not okay. Grant does not place as one of my favorite Batman writers, but I respect him all the same. He was writing at a time when Denny O'Neil would often step in and muck up everything on a moment's notice in the name of sales with absolutely zero regard for creative vision. Working under those conditions, not many would produce anything worthy of note, let alone stories and characters that are still being discussed decades later and adapted into new media. I've actually been really excited to get to Shadow of the Bat, as I presume that is Grant's opportunity to finally write Batman without much editorial interference. I'm truly sorry I couldn't get there in the man's lifetime. Rest in peace, Mr. Grant, and thank you for all that you've given us.
|
|
|
Post by Icctrombone on Jul 22, 2022 4:26:48 GMT -5
Just got back from my honeymoon the other day and worked through the jetlag in time to leave for the annual family vacation in a few hours, so I thought to myself, "I'll check in on the CCF and make sure nothing too crazy has happened while I've been gone..." Alan Grant passed away yesterday and I think that's worth a mention here. I am not okay. Grant does not place as one of my favorite Batman writers, but I respect him all the same. He was writing at a time when Denny O'Neil would often step in and muck up everything on a moment's notice in the name of sales with absolutely zero regard for creative vision. Working under those conditions, not many would produce anything worthy of note, let alone stories and characters that are still being discussed decades later and adapted into new media. I've actually been really excited to get to Shadow of the Bat, as I presume that is Grant's opportunity to finally write Batman without much editorial interference. I'm truly sorry I couldn't get there in the man's lifetime. Rest in peace, Mr. Grant, and thank you for all that you've given us. Welcome back shax, the Batman family is taking a hit this year by losing Adams, Sale and now Grant.
|
|
|
Post by chadwilliam on Jul 22, 2022 14:21:27 GMT -5
Just got back from my honeymoon the other day and worked through the jetlag in time to leave for the annual family vacation in a few hours, so I thought to myself, "I'll check in on the CCF and make sure nothing too crazy has happened while I've been gone..." Alan Grant passed away yesterday and I think that's worth a mention here. I am not okay. Grant does not place as one of my favorite Batman writers, but I respect him all the same. He was writing at a time when Denny O'Neil would often step in and muck up everything on a moment's notice in the name of sales with absolutely zero regard for creative vision. Working under those conditions, not many would produce anything worthy of note, let alone stories and characters that are still being discussed decades later and adapted into new media. I've actually been really excited to get to Shadow of the Bat, as I presume that is Grant's opportunity to finally write Batman without much editorial interference. I'm truly sorry I couldn't get there in the man's lifetime. Rest in peace, Mr. Grant, and thank you for all that you've given us. I hope my congratulations to you doesn't lose something with my unintentionally breaking this news to you so soon after your honeymoon, Shaxper. She's snagged herself one hell of a great guy though to be honest, part of me can't help thinking "Shaxper's gotten married? Gee, must be nice to live in a city with no crimes only a single (I repeat, SINGLE) Shakespearean spouting masked vigilante should feel obligated to unraveling". Still, if anyone deserves to shirk a sworn oath delivered to a giant statue of Lady Liberty, it's someone who's done as much as you have here. Congratulations again to you both.
|
|
|
Post by kasparhauser on May 2, 2023 15:25:13 GMT -5
|
|
shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,870
Member is Online
|
Post by shaxper on May 2, 2023 21:03:41 GMT -5
shaxper, apparently since 1989 Denny O Neil had written a Bat-Bible that was handed out to all writers that came into contact with Batman: This is awesome! Thank you. The problem with this, inevitably, is going to be that Denny O'Neil wasn't paying any attention to continuity in his own office, so I have to wonder 1) how accurate this will be, and 2) whether or not ensuing writers took it seriously. Problems already. According to all the work I did in resolving references to time and age with Post-Crisis Batman, Bruce is somewhere between 34 and 41 in 1989. Even 34 wouldn't really count as "early 30s". Yes. Much of this was established in the Destroyer storyline. What about Vicki Vale? This is fascinating and hasn't really worked its way into the comics as of 1991. It feels more like O'Neil lifted all of this from the '89 film. More details we haven't seen in the comics as of 1991. Very interesting. We've seen much of this already. The mimicry specifically came up in his Who's Who? entry in the back of Batman Annual #13. This portion cannot be from 1989. It's from 1992 the absolute earliest, as Tim hasn't dated yet in 1991. Fascinating. Leslie Tompkins hasn't been mentioned since Year Two, and it's highly debatable whether or not that story even exists in Post-Crisis continuity for a number of reasons. I touch upon this briefly here. All pretty much taken from Year One. This also cannot be from 1989, as Barbara was paralyzed in 1988 (real-time) and time in late '80s/early '90s DC tends to work out as one month in our time being one week in theirs. In order for her to have been paralyzed "several years ago," we'd have to be in the mid 1990s already. Also, how odd that she is said to have "briefly" been a crimefighter and not "briefly" a politician. In the Pre-Crisis, she served one term as a congresswoman and was Batgirl for a long time both before and after that. Still trying to downplay Batgirl all this time after... I don't think we've seen Bullock in the Post-Crisis as of 1989. If memory serves, it's not until the 1992 Batman Animated Series gives him a major role that we start seeing him show up in the comics again, though I may be mistaken there. Again, I seriously doubt this is material from 1989. We haven't really been given this depiction of the GCPD as of this point in the reviews (1991). You might be able to infer some of it from Year One. Otherwise, this is mostly new information that I haven't seen reflected in the comics. ...except when he fights aliens with Giffen's Justice League. I'm a little surprised to see O'Neil contradicting DKR, one of his biggest cash cows. Of course, as of 1989, aligning closely with the Tim Burton film was where the money was at, so I guess this makes sense after all. Yup. Says the guy who wrote and created Richard Dragon? Is it physically possible to bench like that and not look as big as Arnold Schwartzenager? if Bruce's frame looks too glaringly large, wouldn't that kill the whole lazy/directionless act and draw comparisons with Batman? This has been hinted at a few times Post-Crisis, but never outright said. It also used to be Batgirl's special ability that made her unique among the Bat Family. Once again, "ouch". Interesting, as so many writers in both the Pre and Post Crisis seemed to treat Batman as if he was an expert on every possible subject. "Gee, Batman, the murderer left a spot of blood on this Ming vase." "No, Robin. This particular pattern would have been alien to craftsmen of the Ming Era. Look at the slight green distortion in the background. That suggests the use of copper, which was more frequently used in pottery earlier on, around 3,000 BC." "F*ck you, Batman." Well that doesn't exactly match with the 1989 Burton film. Writers seem to flipflop on this one a lot. Yup. None of this has been mentioned anywhere in the comics, and the Robin II storyline (1991-1992) outright contradicts it when Tim and Alfred are not able to get into the one and only Batmobile while Bruce is absent. No concern about compact thermite charges is ever expressed when they discuss the futility of trying to boost it. Sure. News to me. Yup. Say what? Then why was he trying to call the Batcave on the phone during the Idiot Root storyline (1991-1992)? I'd be surprised if O'Neil had Solomon Wayne planned prior to the Destroyer storyline (1991). That doesn't make any sense. What is the point of Bruce spending each night fighting crime if he doesn't honestly believe he is making a difference? Batman cannot afford to be realistic about the effects of his crimefighting because, if he is, then the only solution is to pour all of his energy and resources into economic and social reform initiatives via Wayne Enterprises instead of making punching people who have already slipped through the cracks his primary focus. I feel like we've seen exceptions to nearly every one of these mandates. Do you want to remind him about Millenium, Cosmic Odyssey, Invasion, and Armageddon 2001, or should I? from Batman: Holy TerrorWell, I guess we did go a very long time without "I'm the goddamn Batman". O'Neil was gone by that point, right? I mean, aren't these just reasonable expectations for ANY professional comic book art? from Detective Comics #625I'm running out of time for tonight, but (suffice to say) I take this batbible with a generous helping of salt. There is no way O'Neil wrote portions of this in 1989 (maybe just the bottom text?), O'Neil didn't have any idea what was happening in his own books much of the time, and a lot of this is contradicted in what we've already seen. Still, it's a fascinating glimpse into what might have been how O'Neil envisioned his Bat Office at one point. Thanks again for this!
|
|
|
Post by kasparhauser on May 4, 2023 5:53:44 GMT -5
I think the bible started in 1989, this was probably updated so it is a later version.
|
|