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Post by pinkfloydsound17 on Feb 3, 2020 10:28:02 GMT -5
Am I wrong for asking why should I care about a character navigating a yard as though it were a jungle? Or a bathtub as though it were an ocean? What is the point?
This comes from a guy who has never read any Ant Man or Atom or shrinking character stuff but the initial draw just is not there. Is there a whole "small" world of bad guys out there planning world domination? I view these characters as interesting add ins who you see contribute to a team rather than carry a story on their own. Again, maybe I need some recommended reading to get on board but for the reasons mentioned, that is why I steer clear of the shrinking villains solo stuff. Like unless they had to, why fight small all the time? Seems like it just opens up the door for more problems if you are fighting a villain, shrink and then you have to worry about bees and stuff interfering.
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Post by badwolf on Feb 3, 2020 10:34:32 GMT -5
I enjoyed the Atom series that Byrne drew the first few issues of... if I remember correctly there was a lot of other sciency stuff in it besides just shrinkage.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2020 10:59:41 GMT -5
Morrison wrote him well in JLA. And there are no bad characters (although there are some crappy ones). All it takes is the correct writer to get to the core of the character. However I do think the Atom works better in a team setting or in a limited series rather than an ongoing title.
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Post by mikelmidnight on Feb 3, 2020 12:38:21 GMT -5
Well, I meant headlining, but I was thinking Doll Man had only appeared in Feature Comics and had forgot he had a solo series. Moreover, his fifteen-year tenure makes him one of the more successful superheroes of the Golden Age. He outlasted all of the other Quality Comics characters other than Plastic Man and Blackhawk. |
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Post by zaku on Feb 3, 2020 12:53:30 GMT -5
Atom has a power in shrinking which is the opposite of Flash. Shrinking down to infinitesimal nothingness versus the flashy (sorry) super speed doesn't really compare overly much for most folks. But Atom, like Flash has one of the most incredible super powers that literally does make him unbeatable and capable of stopping ANY villain there is. How do you fight somebody who can go sub-molecular instantaneously and enter your body and enlarge creating instant lobotomy or brain death or exploding lungs or heart? What villain is ever going to want to even consider facing Atom? Joker possibly, because he is freaking crazy ass bat shit insane so he would be the only one stupid enough to try. Well, in Power Of The Atom He showed that if he wanted he could be an unstoppable death machine (it was the latter 80s, so Dark and Gritty was the way). Case in point  |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 3, 2020 16:50:43 GMT -5
I enjoyed the Atom series that Byrne drew the first few issues of... if I remember correctly there was a lot of other sciency stuff in it besides just shrinkage. Yeah, that was a good sequel to the Silver Age Atom. Another distinguishing characteristic of the Atom is that he's the most SCIENCE fiction-y of heroes... he should deal with stuff like theoretical physics and time travel and technological enemies. I really liked that the Byrne/Simone version clearly studied the '60s Atom stories to figure out how they worked and stayed within the same genre and thematic signifiers. |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 3, 2020 16:54:12 GMT -5
Am I wrong for asking why should I care about a character navigating a yard as though it were a jungle? Or a bathtub as though it were an ocean? What is the point? This comes from a guy who has never read any Ant Man or Atom or shrinking character stuff but the initial draw just is not there. Is there a whole "small" world of bad guys out there planning world domination? I view these characters as interesting add ins who you see contribute to a team rather than carry a story on their own. Again, maybe I need some recommended reading to get on board but for the reasons mentioned, that is why I steer clear of the shrinking villains solo stuff. Like unless they had to, why fight small all the time? Seems like it just opens up the door for more problems if you are fighting a villain, shrink and then you have to worry about bees and stuff interfering. (A) So you're simply uninterested in the recontextualisation of the familiar? Honestly, I suspect that a lot of 20th century art is going to be lost on you... and, sorry, but that's your loss. |
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Post by hondobrode on Feb 4, 2020 0:12:46 GMT -5
Am I wrong for asking why should I care about a character navigating a yard as though it were a jungle? Or a bathtub as though it were an ocean? What is the point? This comes from a guy who has never read any Ant Man or Atom or shrinking character stuff but the initial draw just is not there. Is there a whole "small" world of bad guys out there planning world domination? I view these characters as interesting add ins who you see contribute to a team rather than carry a story on their own. Again, maybe I need some recommended reading to get on board but for the reasons mentioned, that is why I steer clear of the shrinking villains solo stuff. Like unless they had to, why fight small all the time? Seems like it just opens up the door for more problems if you are fighting a villain, shrink and then you have to worry about bees and stuff interfering.
Have you ever read the original Micronauts run ? Baron Karza, one of comicdom's best villains, was threatening to break through into the mainstream MCU, and it was quite the threat.
That's what I mean : Have Ray, or Ryan Choi, Ray's successor, get trapped in sub-atomica, stranger in a strange land. There's umpteen stories and unexplored theories and connections right there within the DC Megaverse.
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Post by rberman on Feb 4, 2020 0:31:30 GMT -5
Am I wrong for asking why should I care about a character navigating a yard as though it were a jungle? Or a bathtub as though it were an ocean? What is the point? This comes from a guy who has never read any Ant Man or Atom or shrinking character stuff but the initial draw just is not there. Is there a whole "small" world of bad guys out there planning world domination? I view these characters as interesting add ins who you see contribute to a team rather than carry a story on their own. Again, maybe I need some recommended reading to get on board but for the reasons mentioned, that is why I steer clear of the shrinking villains solo stuff. Like unless they had to, why fight small all the time? Seems like it just opens up the door for more problems if you are fighting a villain, shrink and then you have to worry about bees and stuff interfering. "Woah, the regular world looks scary when you're tiny" is good for exactly one story, and it was told by Kafka already. But there's so much more that a shrinking person can do. That's why Shrinking Violet is a member of the Legion Espionage Squad for instance. Her power is as useful in the right context as invisibility, intangibility, or shape-shifting. Especially if you can shrink and then re-enlarge things besides yourself. "Shrinking so small as to enter another dimension where everything else is my size" is not inherently interesting. At that point, you might as well just be teleporting regular-size into another dimension. But there can still be interesting stories told about visiting another dimension, regardless of how you got there. |
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Post by zaku on Feb 4, 2020 10:20:33 GMT -5
Thanks to this thread I was rereading The Power Of Atom (excellent series, by the way). I realized that perhaps writing a story for such a character with similar powers can be a little more challenging for the authors.
I mean, if I have to write that our hero has to stop yet another bank robbery, I already know that Superman will use his super-strength and Batman will launch his batrang. But with Atom I have to figure every time in what imaginative way he will use his powers to bring the criminals to justice.
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Post by Prince Hal on Feb 4, 2020 12:13:33 GMT -5
Well, no shrinking character has been able to sustain its own series for an extended period of time. Ant-Man was changed to Giant-Man rather quickly and the Atom got teaed up with Hawkman, after a sell. Atom got several shots at it; but, must lasted a few years. The problem is that it's a gimmick premise. It takes a pretty creative mind to see all the potential in the premise. It also takes a really inventive artist. Working against that, though, are the deadline pressures of doing monthly comics. That kind of regularity usually leads to a plot formula, which is a death sentence, when the formula runs out of steam. The Flash is also a gimmick character; but, speed seems to inspire more than a worm's eye view of the world. Just to be that guy, your comment made me check up on Doll Man, who I thought had a nice run back in the Golden Age. It was far better than I'd thought. He started in Feature Comics 27 (Dec 1939), an anthology title, and appeared there through #139 (Oct 1949). He alternated as the cover feature from #s 32-74 and then became the cover feature from 77 through 139. Meanwhile, he also appeared in his own titles: Doll Man, which began as Doll Man Quarterly in the fall of 1941 and ran through #47 (Oct 1953). He starred in 276 stories in his nearly 14-year stint at Quality. All stats, of course, courtesy, the Amazing Mike (All praise to him!) at www.mikesamazingworld.com/mikes/index.phpPS: Sorry: Got to the party late. Not trying to pile on.  |
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Post by codystarbuck on Feb 4, 2020 13:07:29 GMT -5
Well, no shrinking character has been able to sustain its own series for an extended period of time. Ant-Man was changed to Giant-Man rather quickly and the Atom got teaed up with Hawkman, after a sell. Atom got several shots at it; but, must lasted a few years. The problem is that it's a gimmick premise. It takes a pretty creative mind to see all the potential in the premise. It also takes a really inventive artist. Working against that, though, are the deadline pressures of doing monthly comics. That kind of regularity usually leads to a plot formula, which is a death sentence, when the formula runs out of steam. The Flash is also a gimmick character; but, speed seems to inspire more than a worm's eye view of the world. Just to be that guy, your comment made me check up on Doll Man, who I thought had a nice run back in the Golden Age. It was far better than I'd thought. He started in Feature Comics 27 (Dec 1939), an anthology title, and appeared there through #139 (Oct 1949). He alternated as the cover feature from #s 32-74 and then became the cover feature from 77 through 139. Meanwhile, he also appeared in his own titles: Doll Man, which began as Doll Man Quarterly in the fall of 1941 and ran through #47 (Oct 1953). He starred in 276 stories in his nearly 14-year stint at Quality. All stats, of course, courtesy, the Amazing Mike (All praise to him!) at www.mikesamazingworld.com/mikes/index.phpPS: Sorry: Got to the party late. Not trying to pile on. Yeah!!!!!!  I already admitted I forgot the Doll Man regular series. Do the reading, man!  |
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Post by pinkfloydsound17 on Feb 4, 2020 13:15:15 GMT -5
Am I wrong for asking why should I care about a character navigating a yard as though it were a jungle? Or a bathtub as though it were an ocean? What is the point? This comes from a guy who has never read any Ant Man or Atom or shrinking character stuff but the initial draw just is not there. Is there a whole "small" world of bad guys out there planning world domination? I view these characters as interesting add ins who you see contribute to a team rather than carry a story on their own. Again, maybe I need some recommended reading to get on board but for the reasons mentioned, that is why I steer clear of the shrinking villains solo stuff. Like unless they had to, why fight small all the time? Seems like it just opens up the door for more problems if you are fighting a villain, shrink and then you have to worry about bees and stuff interfering.
Have you ever read the original Micronauts run ? Baron Karza, one of comicdom's best villains, was threatening to break through into the mainstream MCU, and it was quite the threat.
That's what I mean : Have Ray, or Ryan Choi, Ray's successor, get trapped in sub-atomica, stranger in a strange land. There's umpteen stories and unexplored theories and connections right there within the DC Megaverse.
I have not but know that I should. The Micornauts appeal to me more than Ant Man or Atom do. And I am not a big team reader, yet I have a healthy Micronauts stash that needs reading soon. I really enjoy the cover art which is why I have accumulated a fair amount. |
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Post by beccabear67 on Feb 4, 2020 14:14:06 GMT -5
I guess it's appropriate that the in store promo 'poster' for Sword Of the Atom was a mini one... only 8 1/2 x 11", same image as the #1 cover, riding a frog. I probably have it in a drawer someplace. Strnad and Kane also did a one-off Talos special...  and for the completist, this Amazing Heroes #28...  |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 5, 2020 14:42:41 GMT -5
Thanks to this thread I was rereading The Power Of Atom (excellent series, by the way). I realized that perhaps writing a story for such a character with similar powers can be a little more challenging for the authors. I mean, if I have to write that our hero has to stop yet another bank robbery, I already know that Superman will use his super-strength and Batman will launch his batrang. But with Atom I have to figure every time in what imaginative way he will use his powers to bring the criminals to justice. That's a good encapsulation of why the Atom is my favorite DC straight-up superhero. It takes a lot of visual imagination to draw the Atom and there's a lot of room for sight-gag based comedy (granted, this is a lost art post-1970 or so) in how he interacts with a world of giant objects and doubly giant people. |
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I already admitted I forgot the Doll Man regular series. Do the reading, man! 
