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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 24, 2022 21:26:22 GMT -5
Tempted to pick Bruce for the lulz. yeah, I had to throw that in there for Wertham Pretty even so far, interesting. We need more comments though! I always feel a little bit cringey when I see Dick and Barbara together, myself. At one point in Bat history, I feel like Barbara was alot older... now they seem to be about the same as (the 20-somethings that most superheros stay forever), but if that's the case and they were raised together, (which recent flashbacks kinda go with).. that's more a brother-sister vibe to me. Whereas in the Titans with Kory, it was all sparks and romance. FWIW, and I'm sure this isn't a popular opinion, I likely the Kyle Rayner-Donna Troy relationship alot.
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Post by tarkintino on Sept 24, 2022 22:51:07 GMT -5
Starfire.
She was not a silly knock-off, or simply incompatible (e.g., more in the friendzone or no Bat-baggage) but brought as much of a new personality (and world) to Grayson as he did to her, both granting much the other never found in anyone else.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Sept 25, 2022 0:10:54 GMT -5
Starfire was never right for him. It was all physical; they had nothing in common. Babs Gordon was a little too good for him. He always looked like a bumbling fool next to her. And Donna Troy was more of a sister at best. Honestly, considering Dick's long history of friends, romantic partners, and friends who could have become romantic partners, Duela Dent was probably the best candidate. She was every bit as clever and as driven as him, and they were both living in the shadows of someone else. Unfortunately, I couldn't stand how Duela Dent was written after she crossed into the Teen Titans.
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Post by berkley on Sept 25, 2022 1:18:42 GMT -5
In my DC universe, there is no Dick Grayson (at least not one with a costumed identity) or Wally West or Roy Harper or any other kid sidekicks. They are anathema to me.
Cei-U! I summon the truant officer!
I'm offended that this well-worn superhero trope has not yet been reversed to give us teenaged lead characters with senior-citizen sidekicks. How long must we wait until this historic imbalance is redressed?
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Post by Cei-U! on Sept 25, 2022 4:39:32 GMT -5
I always feel a little bit cringey when I see Dick and Barbara together, myself. At one point in Bat history, I feel like Barbara was alot older... now they seem to be about the same as (the 20-somethings that most superheros stay forever), but if that's the case and they were raised together, (which recent flashbacks kinda go with).. that's more a brother-sister vibe to me. You aren't wrong. Nearly everyone has forgotten that when she was first introduced it was as Dr. Barbara Gordon, whose PhD landed her the prestigious job of Head Librarian of the Gotham Public Library (cf. Detective #359, page 2, panel 4). This would make her at least ten years older than then-high schooler Dick. So yeah, "cringey" is kinda how I feel about it too.
Cei-U! I summon the age gap!
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Post by tarkintino on Sept 25, 2022 5:57:34 GMT -5
I always feel a little bit cringey when I see Dick and Barbara together, myself. At one point in Bat history, I feel like Barbara was alot older... now they seem to be about the same as (the 20-somethings that most superheros stay forever), but if that's the case and they were raised together, (which recent flashbacks kinda go with).. that's more a brother-sister vibe to me. You aren't wrong. Nearly everyone has forgotten that when she was first introduced it was as Dr. Barbara Gordon, whose PhD landed her the prestigious job of Head Librarian of the Gotham Public Library (cf. Detective #359, page 2, panel 4). This would make her at least ten years older than then-high schooler Dick. So yeah, "cringey" is kinda how I feel about it too.
Cei-U! I summon the age gap!
I too thought the Dick / Barbara relationship to be cradle-robbing on her part; even as he entered his college years, she was still well into adulthood and should not viewed him as romantic partner at all.
Starfire was the right fit for him.
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Post by Hoosier X on Sept 25, 2022 8:03:41 GMT -5
Or Lori Elton!
If I was writing a Dick Grayson series, I would bring back Lori Elton.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 25, 2022 19:40:58 GMT -5
Or Lori Elton! If I was writing a Dick Grayson series, I would bring back Lori Elton. I have no idea who Lori Elton is... OK, I see now.. I haven't ever read the college years, and Shax's reviews didn't really inspire me to do so. I don't think a relationship not in the superhero world works for him, unless he's going to retire. They'd just be a constant prop/damsel in distress.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 25, 2022 19:43:46 GMT -5
I always feel a little bit cringey when I see Dick and Barbara together, myself. At one point in Bat history, I feel like Barbara was alot older... now they seem to be about the same as (the 20-somethings that most superheros stay forever), but if that's the case and they were raised together, (which recent flashbacks kinda go with).. that's more a brother-sister vibe to me. You aren't wrong. Nearly everyone has forgotten that when she was first introduced it was as Dr. Barbara Gordon, whose PhD landed her the prestigious job of Head Librarian of the Gotham Public Library (cf. Detective #359, page 2, panel 4). This would make her at least ten years older than then-high schooler Dick. So yeah, "cringey" is kinda how I feel about it too.
Cei-U! I summon the age gap!
I don't think it's forgotten so much as they've both entered the eternal adulthood of superheroes, where characters reach the age of 'graduated from college' but never get passed 'grey temples' Marvel has that issue often when they hook Kitty Pryde or any of the New Mutants characters up with other X-types... they forget they're a whole different generation.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Sept 25, 2022 21:30:40 GMT -5
Or Lori Elton! If I was writing a Dick Grayson series, I would bring back Lori Elton. I have no idea who Lori Elton is... OK, I see now.. I haven't ever read the college years, and Shax's reviews didn't really inspire me to do so. You didn't miss much. Don't write off the Robin and Batgirl team-ups, but the Robin solo stories truly are forgettable, as was Lori Elton (beyond the fact that she was there each month).
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Post by Rob Allen on Sept 26, 2022 11:11:14 GMT -5
I'm offended that this well-worn superhero trope has not yet been reversed to give us teenaged lead characters with senior-citizen sidekicks. How long must we wait until this historic imbalance is redressed?
Stripesy wasn't exactly a senior citizen, but he's the first adult sidekick to a teen hero that I think of.
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shaxper
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Posts: 22,376
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Post by shaxper on Sept 26, 2022 15:29:04 GMT -5
I'm offended that this well-worn superhero trope has not yet been reversed to give us teenaged lead characters with senior-citizen sidekicks. How long must we wait until this historic imbalance is redressed?
Stripesy wasn't exactly a senior citizen, but he's the first adult sidekick to a teen hero that I think of. Luke Wilson looked so different back then.
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Post by EdoBosnar on Sept 27, 2022 3:46:04 GMT -5
Luke Wilson looked so different back then. No kidding. So did Owen...
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Post by dbutler69 on Sept 27, 2022 15:11:11 GMT -5
"Someone Else" Betty Kane, of course, the original Bat-Girl. And I hope Hoosier X agrees with me! Yowza! I was thinking Starfire, but you make a compelling point! I love me some Bat-Girl, and much as I agree with wildfire2099's point, I have to say that for most of the NTT run that I read (up through maybe 1988) they weren't much of a couple for most of that time. Mostly Dick either being aloof or reprimanding Koriand'r for something or other.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 28, 2022 18:04:24 GMT -5
There was some of that for sure... Angst was the order of the day in the 80s, after all! Still, they work REALLY well after that . I actually think some the the recent DCU Titans Cartoons actually show their relationship the best.. that's the way I picture it in MY DCU
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