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Post by rich on Nov 7, 2024 19:23:03 GMT -5
What War did Reed and Ben fight in now? Maybe they just look good for 104? ;-)
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Post by MRPs_Missives on Nov 7, 2024 20:14:07 GMT -5
If they're not going to stick to original numbering, I'd at least like to see a different system that maybe incorporates the year, just to make it easy to figure out what you're buying when flipping through back issue bins. That way they could reboot every year. For example, the first issue of Avengers to come out in 2025 would be labeled 2025-1 (with the year on top in small letters, and the issue number a little bit larger underneath). Personally I think it would have been better if comics had used the numbering convention of other American periodicals right from the get go, i.e. Vol. I #1 9-12) for the first year, Vol. II #1-12 for the second year, etc. So many of the bad habits and #ing peccadillos so prominent on the collecting hobby would have been avoided and irrelevant if they had. -M
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Post by wildfire2099 on Nov 7, 2024 21:45:01 GMT -5
How would you track which order to read comics in if they were all #1s? 🧐 They have dates on them...just like every other periodical has had forever, almost none of which were numbered. the dates are pretty hidden these days... just in the indicia, if anywhere. I've gotten used to it. I think since the series isn't an ongoing story anymore (ie, each writer pretty much does their own thing and barely references what has gone before) its fine. You can... mostly... go with 'Aaron's Thor' or 'Cantwell's Iron Man' to describe things, and which order doesn't matter all that much.
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Post by berkley on Nov 8, 2024 0:40:10 GMT -5
I'm another guy who doesn't read Marvel or DC - I assume it's them we're talking about? - and who hasn't done so for many years now, so it's all the same to me whatever they do. I'm not sure what I would thought if they had done it in the 70s, say. It might have made sense to start a new volume and new #1 of the FF after Kirby left, for example - but of course that's exactly what Stan wouldn't have wanted since the whole idea was to sell the reader that this was the same comic they'd been following from the 60s, just with a new artist. And Doctor Strange did start with a new #1 when it was brought back in the early 70s, which was fine with me then and now - actually, I kind of wish they'd started it with #1 in the 60s too, rather than #170, or whatever it was, carrying on from Strange Tales. Same with Thor.
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Post by MRPs_Missives on Nov 8, 2024 1:25:32 GMT -5
Lest we forget, there were legitimate reasons involving postal rates for subscription copies for comics not to renumber with #1 into the 70s. You didn't see an increase of new #1 until US Postal regulations changed and subscription copies became much less a factor in total sales (aided and abetted by the advent of the direct market making it easier for fans to find books where comic shops existed and fueling the growth of mail order comic suppliers of new issues).
Once those market obstacles were out of the way in the early 70s, using #1 issues became a de rigeur way of increasing sales and we no longer saw companies (Marvel. DC. Charlton etc.) keeping old numbering when relaunching or changing the titles of books, and every new book launched with a #1. I think DC hung on the longest with continuing old numbers when they revived books like Challengers, All Star Comics and Plastic Man in the early/mid-70s, but they were launching all kinds of new #1 at the same time (at least until the DC Implosion hit).
-M
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Damn #1s
Nov 8, 2024 11:09:40 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by rich on Nov 8, 2024 11:09:40 GMT -5
Let's turn the question around... would it be a good idea for 2000AD to scrap the current numbering and start from #1 again every year or so? Would it improve their sales and make someone happier?
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Post by DubipR on Nov 8, 2024 12:30:09 GMT -5
Let's turn the question around... would it be a good idea for 2000AD to scrap the current numbering and start from #1 again every year or so? Would it improve their sales and make someone happier? That's up to 2000AD. Would it boost sales? Possibly. Would it make people happy? Maybe. The company's been doing it for so long it would be a kick in the teeth to the readers I would imagine just to stop and re-number.
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Damn #1s
Nov 8, 2024 13:06:04 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by rich on Nov 8, 2024 13:06:04 GMT -5
Let's turn the question around... would it be a good idea for 2000AD to scrap the current numbering and start from #1 again every year or so? Would it improve their sales and make someone happier? That's up to 2000AD. Would it boost sales? Possibly. Would it make people happy? Maybe. The company's been doing it for so long it would be a kick in the teeth to the readers I would imagine just to stop and re-number. Care to stick a percentage on your "maybe" probability. I'd put it in the region of 0.1% of readers! 😅 The chance of sales being higher after a year also seems unlikely, based on facts provided by Marvel and DC on how short lived the boost is...
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Post by MRPs_Missives on Nov 8, 2024 13:25:35 GMT -5
Since I have no idea what the comic market in the UK looks like let me ask this-is 200AD available in places where anyone can pick it up (like an actual newsstand or market that doesn't just sell comic/hobby products) or is it available only in a niche market that is a destination marketplace only people who are interested in buying comics would go to?
If it is the former, my guess would be that people would continue to pick up the latest issue of 200AD to read no matter what the numbering was as long as they could tell it was the new issue (and numbering isn't the only indicator of that, distinctive covers or cover copy, dates, etc. all serve the same function). If its the former, then I would guess the buyers would be more interested in the trade dress than continuing to get the content they enjoy and have enjoyed which is entirely unaffected by that trade dress.
But again, if you let trade dress determine your enjoyment of the content inside the book, I think you've put the cart before the horse.
-M
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Post by rich on Nov 8, 2024 14:04:19 GMT -5
Congratulations on offering no argument FOR remembering, merely arguments against.
Obviously the numbering brings no happiness or enjoyment by being there.
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Post by MRPs_Missives on Nov 8, 2024 14:17:05 GMT -5
Congratulations on offering no argument FOR remembering, merely arguments against. Obviously the numbering brings no happiness or enjoyment by being there. Thank you for not answering my question as to how 200AD is sold in the UK. As for buying the next issue of something for the content, I can not remember anyone outside of comics fans caring about what the issue number or trade dress was for a periodical they were purchasing. They wanted the next issue for the content-the stories, the news, the pictures or what have you. No one cared what issue of the Times it was, as long as it was the next issue. Of Life. Or Playboy. Or TV Guide. Or Newsweek. Or Weird Tales. Or Reader's Digest. Etc. As long as they could tell it was the next issue and they continued to enjoy the content and could afford it, they would continue to buy it. Comic fans seem to have fetishized the trade dress, numbering, logos, brand names, etc. and prioritized it over content (which could go a long ways towards explaining why readership of periodical comics continued to dwindle while publishers focused on and prioritized the trade dress over content). People who consume the content and enjoy the content focus on the content and not the trade dress. It's only with the advent of the "collectors" of comics and the rise of the direct market that this stops being the case with comics, which is about the time readership numbers started dwindling (not sales numbers, readership numbers as with comics as a collectible the two are not the same and with the advent of the direct market they are totally separate as direct market sells to retailers who own the issue whether they resell it to a reader or collector or not. Yes, collectors seem to derive enjoyment from the numbers or trade dress of comics. I don't deny that. But I think that's part of the problem, not a feature of comics as a hobby/feature and thus puts the cart before the horse. Opinions may vary and that's cool, but not every comic reader cares about numbers of trade dress, and most who aren't collectors in addition to readers, even give it a second thought. -M
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Post by The Captain on Nov 8, 2024 14:20:56 GMT -5
My biggest issue is that Marvel (especially) wants to have its cake and eat it too. Case in point:
The next issue of the current Incredible Hulk run is #19, a thoroughly unremarkable number, except…
…it is also Legacy #800, so they’re having a super-sized issue to celebrate the achievement of that lofty figure.
If they want to restart series every 18-24 issues to be more like TV series, I can live with that, and if they want to make it one unending string of issues, that’s all fine also.
However, don’t insult one side of the argument or the other by having it both ways, celebrating phony milestones for long-timers while also rebooting every two years to juice sales by hopefully hooking people on the “new season” of the title.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Nov 8, 2024 15:33:45 GMT -5
Congratulations on offering no argument FOR remembering, merely arguments against. Obviously the numbering brings no happiness or enjoyment by being there. Maybe it's because some of us can't imagine why a number makes someone happy or is enjoyable. I mean, I guess it does and can be. But I don't understand it in any way.
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Post by rich on Nov 8, 2024 15:41:30 GMT -5
Congratulations on offering no argument FOR remembering, merely arguments against. Obviously the numbering brings no happiness or enjoyment by being there. Maybe it's because some of us can't imagine why a number makes someone happy or is enjoyable. I mean, I guess it does and can be. But I don't understand it in any way. Still no idea why "happiness" and "enjoyment" are words you guys are choosing. Logical numbering that is easy to sort and follow isn't related to 'fun'.
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Post by chaykinstevens on Nov 8, 2024 16:38:47 GMT -5
Still no idea why happiness and enjoyment are adjectives you guys are choosing. Aren't happiness and enjoyment nouns?
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