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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2020 20:43:40 GMT -5
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Post by foxley on Jan 14, 2020 1:27:33 GMT -5
Those mid 70s DC sword-and-sorcery titles (Stalker, Claw the Unconquered, and Starfire) are all decent reads if you are a fan of the genre, and generally not to expensive to pick up. Of course, there is no resolution to any of the storylines because they were all cancelled during the DC Implosion (Stalker ran for 4 issues, Claw for 16, and Starfire 8).
Stalker was written by Paul Levitz, and had art by Steve Ditko (pencils) and Wally Wood (inks). Claw was written by David Michelinie and actually lasted long enough to change artists: starting with Ernie Chan and ending with Keith Giffen. Starfire, as noted above, was also by Michelinine and had Mike Vosburg on art.
The fourth title in this group was Beowulf, Dragon Slayer. It lasted 6 issues. This is not as good as the other three, with Mike Vosburg's writing generally subpar (he certainly doesn't know how to write dialogue for a sword-and-sorcery book). The art by Ricardo Villamonte is gorgeous, however, and it is worth picking up the book for that alone (once again, it is usually very cheap).
Stalker, Claw, and Beowulf are all fairly standard sword-and-sorcery books, but Starfire is more in the planetary romance genre, with Starfire being a woman chosen to the lead a rebellion against the two alien races that have conquered her planet and enslaved the human natives.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2020 1:56:10 GMT -5
Those mid 70s DC sword-and-sorcery titles ( Stalker, Claw the Unconquered, and Starfire) are all decent reads if you are a fan of the genre, and generally not to expensive to pick up. Of course, there is no resolution to any of the storylines because they were all cancelled during the DC Implosion ( Stalker ran for 4 issues, Claw for 16, and Starfire 8). Stalker was written by Paul Levitz, and had art by Steve Ditko (pencils) and Wally Wood (inks). Claw was written by David Michelinie and actually lasted long enough to change artists: starting with Ernie Chan and ending with Keith Giffen. Starfire, as noted above, was also by Michelinine and had Mike Vosburg on art. The fourth title in this group was Beowulf, Dragon Slayer. It lasted 6 issues. This is not as good as the other three, with Mike Vosburg's writing generally subpar (he certainly doesn't know how to write dialogue for a sword-and-sorcery book). The art by Ricardo Villamonte is gorgeous, however, and it is worth picking up the book for that alone (once again, it is usually very cheap). Stalker, Claw, and Beowulf are all fairly standard sword-and-sorcery books, but Starfire is more in the planetary romance genre, with Starfire being a woman chosen to the lead a rebellion against the two alien races that have conquered her planet and enslaved the human natives. Claw went on hiatus and returned later for a few issues, it ended with #9 with October 1976 cover date, and returned with a May 1978 cover date for #10, but only lasted 3 issues with #12 being it's final issue. Michelinie lasted 2 issues on Starfire. It changed writers several times in its 8 issue run-Elliot Maggin did 3 issues, Steve Englehart did 2 and Tom DeFalco the final issue. Vosburg lasted all 8 issues, but unfortunately so did Vince Colletta as his inker. Michael Uslan was the writer on Beowulf. It was co-plotted by Allan Asherman for the last 2 issues. -M PS to add: and I was misremembering the Eternal Champion bits, it was revealed in Star Hunters #7 that Starfire and Claw the Unconquered were two of the "eternal champions of the Sornaii" on the world of Pytharia (pseudo Earth). But since Star hunters was cancelled after that issue and neither Starfire nor Claw still had a book that Michelinie was associated with, that bit was never followed up on.
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Post by foxley on Jan 14, 2020 2:31:34 GMT -5
Claw went on hiatus and returned later for a few issues, it ended with #9 with October 1976 cover date, and returned with a May 1978 cover date for #10, but only lasted 3 issues with #12 being it's final issue. Michelinie lasted 2 issues on Starfire. It changed writers several times in its 8 issue run-Elliot Maggin did 3 issues, Steve Englehart did 2 and Tom DeFalco the final issue. Vosburg lasted all 8 issues, but unfortunately so did Vince Colletta as his inker. Michael Uslan was the writer on Beowulf. It was co-plotted by Allan Asherman for the last 2 issues. -M PS to add: and I was misremembering the Eternal Champion bits, it was revealed in Star Hunters #7 that Starfire and Claw the Unconquered were two of the "eternal champions of the Sornaii" on the world of Pytharia (pseudo Earth). But since Star hunters was cancelled after that issue and neither Starfire nor Claw still had a book that Michelinie was associated with, that bit was never followed up on. Oops! Score one for my notoriously faulty memory, and for attempting to write an entry while away from collection and references. I did check some stuff on Wikipedia, but that is notoriously hit and miss. As someone who used to be a professional researcher, I slap myself over the wrist for taking the quick and easy route.
I may have been subconsciously adding the two issues of Warlord where Claw ran as a back-up to the tally of issues, but that would still leave me a couple short. And I honestly thought Michelinie wrote the entire run of Starfire. Just goes to show how long its been since I last read it.
And I do apologize to Mike Vosberg for my mis-attribution, but my comment on the quality of the writing in Beowulf stands.
Thanks for the corrections @mrp. One of the things I love about CCF is that when I screw up, someone will politely correct me.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2020 3:38:59 GMT -5
Claw went on hiatus and returned later for a few issues, it ended with #9 with October 1976 cover date, and returned with a May 1978 cover date for #10, but only lasted 3 issues with #12 being it's final issue. Michelinie lasted 2 issues on Starfire. It changed writers several times in its 8 issue run-Elliot Maggin did 3 issues, Steve Englehart did 2 and Tom DeFalco the final issue. Vosburg lasted all 8 issues, but unfortunately so did Vince Colletta as his inker. Michael Uslan was the writer on Beowulf. It was co-plotted by Allan Asherman for the last 2 issues. -M PS to add: and I was misremembering the Eternal Champion bits, it was revealed in Star Hunters #7 that Starfire and Claw the Unconquered were two of the "eternal champions of the Sornaii" on the world of Pytharia (pseudo Earth). But since Star hunters was cancelled after that issue and neither Starfire nor Claw still had a book that Michelinie was associated with, that bit was never followed up on. Oops! Score one for my notoriously faulty memory, and for attempting to write an entry while away from collection and references. I did check some stuff on Wikipedia, but that is notoriously hit and miss. As someone who used to be a professional researcher, I slap myself over the wrist for taking the quick and easy route.
I may have been subconsciously adding the two issues of Warlord where Claw ran as a back-up to the tally of issues, but that would still leave me a couple short. And I honestly thought Michelinie wrote the entire run of Starfire. Just goes to show how long its been since I last read it.
And I do apologize to Mike Vosberg for my mis-attribution, but my comment on the quality of the writing in Beowulf stands. Thanks for the corrections @mrp. One of the things I love about CCF is that when I screw up, someone will politely correct me.
One of the things that keeps me coming back here is that whenever I think I know a few things about comics, someone here shows me how much I don't know, which only helps and inspires me to learn more. It drives home the Socratic tenet that wisdom comes in knowing what you do not know. I agree with you about the Beowulf series. I used to own it, but no longer do, adding it to the purge pile after I read it as something I wouldn't want to revisit, but the others I keep around and revisit every so often (Star Hunters too). -M
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Post by EdoBosnar on Jan 14, 2020 6:18:36 GMT -5
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Post by Rob Allen on Jan 14, 2020 12:41:03 GMT -5
The forerunner to those DC sword & sorcery books was Sword of Sorcery, featuring Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, by Denny O'Neil and Howard Chaykin. That's the book that really put Chaykin on my radar.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2020 12:44:20 GMT -5
The forerunner to those DC sword & sorcery books was Sword of Sorcery, featuring Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, by Denny O'Neil and Howard Chaykin. That's the book that really put Chaykin on my radar. And of course that pair of miscreants had appeared in Wonder Woman prior to that (#202). But the crown jewel of the line was, is, and will be Warlord. -M
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Post by kirby101 on Jan 14, 2020 12:50:09 GMT -5
The forerunner to those DC sword & sorcery books was Sword of Sorcery, featuring Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, by Denny O'Neil and Howard Chaykin. That's the book that really put Chaykin on my radar. I remember buying that. My only Wonder Woman comic until Perez and Byrne.
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Post by pinkfloydsound17 on Jan 14, 2020 13:17:13 GMT -5
Yep, that would be her. Her suit looks even less sword-proof than Sonja's does. The attire distracts attackers. Generally males will think with their....brains...for a second whilst analyzing the armour, which is all the time Sonja/Starfire need to strike. As for female combatants, the split second thought of "hmm I wonder where she got that outfit" provides the brief moment of delay in which Sonja/Starfire can strike.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 9,625
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Post by Confessor on Jan 14, 2020 13:42:23 GMT -5
The attire distracts attackers. Generally males will think with their....brains...for a second whilst analyzing the armour, which is all the time Sonja/Starfire need to strike. As for female combatants, the split second thought of "hmm I wonder where she got that outfit" provides the brief moment of delay in which Sonja/Starfire can strike. Sounds like cast iron comic book logic to me!
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Post by beccabear67 on Jan 14, 2020 14:17:04 GMT -5
I have the eight issues of the '70s Starfire but haven't read them yet (also the Star Hunters in DC Super-Stars and #1 (used to have the whole regular series way back minus that first one).
I was very lucky to communicate with L. Sprague DeCamp for awhile years ago, but rather than ask about Fafhrd etc. it was more about archeological news of the time. I just never really got into straight 'barbarian' stories or comics for some reason, but throw in something different and I was there (John Carter, Carson Of Venus, Pellucidar... Warlord, Killraven, Arion...). I did like C.L. Moore, Leigh Brackett and Andre Norton stories though that may not have had anything 'more' than the sword and sorcery. I do a bit better with jungle characters than the Conan and Red Sonja (Marada) sort, but again the highlight of Ka-Zar for me was that story tying in with ancient Atlantean technology, just like with Tarzan it was the lost civilizations ala H. Rider Haggard. Planet Of the Apes (1968) is still to me what I think Star Wars was to a lot of others (also King Kong) I seem able to re-enjoy visiting it's universe often.
Anyway, this reminds me to get to that Starfire series... was there ever an unpublished ninth issue? Was the title part of that whole implosion?
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Post by foxley on Jan 14, 2020 15:11:34 GMT -5
Anyway, this reminds me to get to that Starfire series... was there ever an unpublished ninth issue? Was the title part of that whole implosion? I don't think there ever was a ninth issue written. Certainly there was nothing published in Cancelled Comic Cavalcade which published most of the leftover stories from the Implosion for copyright reasons.
On that note, I figured out where I got 16 issues of Claw the Unconquered from. There were 12 published issues, 2 completed but unpublished issues in Cancelled Comic Cavalcade, and the two-part backup in Warlord intended to be a finale. Somewhere I must have seen a list of total stories in the original run and had that number in my head.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2020 15:51:45 GMT -5
Thanks to the kindness of "Secret Santa", I got, among other things, the Secret Origins trade. One of the stories is "Batman: The Man Who Falls".
In that story, Bruce Wayne does spend some time in the FBI, where he learns detective skills. Was his FBI stint mentioned prior to "The Man Who Falls"? Is it canon now?
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Post by berkley on Jan 17, 2020 16:24:07 GMT -5
Missed all the sword and sorcery talk, but I have a related question, though more one of opinion than of fact: why didn't Claw or any of the other REH-style sword and sorcery comics (as opposed to Warlord which I assume is more of an ERB-style thing) ever catch on? Was it just that Marvel had actual REH characters and not imitations, or was it the personnel working on the books, or the concepts, or a combination of many things?
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