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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 7, 2019 8:12:31 GMT -5
I enjoyed Dark Horse's stuff in the clone wars era alot more than anything they did in the Original trilogy timeline.. that last series they did just before they lost the license (Brian Wood, I think) was probably their best attempt there.
The current Marvel stuff started out strong.. especially the Vader book. Since the 'Vader down' crossover, though, they've run out of ideas and are just trying to create kewl moments.
I really liked Doctor Aphra at the start, but they've not got too far carried away with evil R2 and C3PO (Which were a fun one off but never should have been permanent fixtures).. never mind evil Chewbacca (sorry I'm too lazy to look up actual names).
The Poe Dameron series was probably (not surprisingly) the most original, but it doesn't feel like it's important, even though it's set close to 'current'.
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Post by aquagoat on Mar 7, 2019 11:59:41 GMT -5
I'm hoping Marvel jump ahead to post-TESB, although that would obviously mean no Han.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 7, 2019 22:42:15 GMT -5
I'd ideally like to see them work with this 'new era' and actually do something with it... its like they're afraid.
While I love the classic characters, there's been just about story that can be told during the original trilogy years (3 different versions, no less) time to move on.
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Post by tarkintino on Mar 8, 2019 1:27:55 GMT -5
I'd ideally like to see them work with this 'new era' and actually do something with it... its like they're afraid. While I love the classic characters, there's been just about story that can be told during the original trilogy years (3 different versions, no less) time to move on. "New era" as in the sequel trilogy characters? |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 8, 2019 7:44:37 GMT -5
yeah.. move the story forward! I'm SO tired of these producer types refusing to break any new group.. it's all side story this and prequel that.
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Post by tarkintino on Mar 8, 2019 9:22:06 GMT -5
I would be willing to guess that two films in, if the sequel characters are not generating many spin off comics, it has much to do with their lack of appeal and the perception that they are just not good characters in an equally judged sequel series. When Star Wars was releases in 1977, I remember a lot of people looking for ancillary SW material; while some of it was hit and miss (starting with the Marvel adaptation of the first film), the interest was still high, so when a new publication was released (e.g., the poster magazines, novels, etc.), fans emptied their pockets for it. The sequel series seems to generate more negative attention than anything else, hence the lack of publishers basing much on the films and its characters.
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Post by aquagoat on Mar 8, 2019 17:01:57 GMT -5
I would be willing to guess that two films in, if the sequel characters are not generating many spin off comics, it has mush to do with their lack of appeal and the perception that they are just not good characters in an equally judged sequel series. When Star Wars was releases in 1977, I remember a lot of people looking for ancillary SW material; while some of it was hit and miss (starting with the Marvel adaptation of the first film), the interest was still high, so when a new publication was released (e.g., the poster magazines, novels, etc.), fans emptied their pockets for it. The sequel series seems to generate more negative attention than anything else, hence the lack of publishers basing much on the films and its characters. Sorry, but that's clearly inaccurate. The Force Awakens - $2b at the box office. The Last Jedi - $1.3b. Episodes VII and VIII have been hugely successful, and Rey, Finn and Poe Dameron have proved hugely popular. Poe has his own comic, they've all been in cartoons and video games....and if you go on Amazon, there are plenty of books (and toys) about Rey and Finn. Sure, there are a lot of disgruntled Star Wars fans complaining about certain issues online, but you have to remember than fans are the minority of the audience for huge blockbusters like this. I'm not saying any complaints are right or wrong, just that there is plenty of interest in the new characters. |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 8, 2019 17:12:14 GMT -5
It likely has more to do with the fact that, by and large, comic book buyers are a superstitious and cowardly lot and don't want much of anything that they haven't read a couple score times over the last forty years.
I don't want new stuff...I want to see Han Solo doing the same thing over and over and over and over again.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 8, 2019 19:55:25 GMT -5
It likely has more to do with the fact that, by and large, comic book buyers are a superstitious and cowardly lot and don't want much of anything that they haven't read a couple score times over the last forty years. I don't want new stuff...I want to see Han Solo doing the same thing over and over and over and over again. Sadly, I think this is it. The Poe Dameron comic (what I read of it) was actually quite good.... they even tied it in to one of the decent bits of the Chuck Wendig books. I still have the last trade to grab at some point. If they want to grow a new generation of fans, that's the sort of thing that needs to happen... any old fans that come along for the ride are just a bonus. |
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Post by tarkintino on Mar 9, 2019 5:08:46 GMT -5
Sorry, but that's clearly inaccurate. The Force Awakens - $2b at the box office. The Last Jedi - $1.3b. Episodes VII and VIII have been hugely successful, and Rey, Finn and Poe Dameron have proved hugely popular. Poe has his own comic, they've all been in cartoons and video games....and if you go on Amazon, there are plenty of books (and toys) about Rey and Finn. Inaccurate is using a box office number to sell the idea of the sequel characters/story being popular. Further, according to a January 2018 article from The Wall Street Journal: "Despite being one of last year’s most successful movies, ‘Star Wars: The Last Jedi’ has fallen short of Wall Street’s expectations due to a faster than expected falloff at the box office, declining toy sales and a poor showing in China.” “Star Wars toy sales during the 2017 Holidays were the lowest since Disney relaunched the brand in 2015, according to NPD Group.”..and had the fastest drop at the box office of any SW film to date. That's not a sign of a strong appeal with the moviegoers or general SW fanbase. Moreover, go check the reports of retailer meetings with SW toy manufacturers like Hasbro had over the past few years, where sales numbers on sequel-based toys steadily dropped, but in this year--at Toy Fair 2019 (NY), the company's biggest announcement centered on a reissue of the original Kenner action figure line to great fanfare / consumer response. Why is all of this happening? Its connected to publishing as well; if the sequel films were truly as popular as you suggest, surely the vast majority of comics, games, novels and coffee-table books would not be based on the Original Trilogy--but they have been and continue to be. Production follows the money and public interest, and the OT smothers the sequel films in every ancillary market category. There is a reason for that. |
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,222 
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Post by Confessor on Mar 9, 2019 6:51:55 GMT -5
It likely has more to do with the fact that, by and large, comic book buyers are a superstitious and cowardly lot and don't want much of anything that they haven't read a couple score times over the last forty years. I don't want new stuff...I want to see Han Solo doing the same thing over and over and over and over again. I think that's definitely part of it, but I don't think that's quite the whole story in this case. I think that tarkintino is closer to the truth insofar as the new characters (Finn, Rey, Poe, Rose etc), as well as the new films in general, simply arent good enough and haven't captured the public imagination in a comparable way to the original trilogy. Now, while that is an entirely subjective opinion on my part, I think that the sequel trilogy's failure to adequately engage both old and new fans is borne out on a wider scale by the lack of success of the attendant toys (while original trilogy toys continue to sell like gangbusters, of course), and the lack of Rey's, Fyn's, or Poe's likenesses appearing on merchandise. There is some merch that features these characters, of course, but not in the same quantities that the original trilogy characters appear, both in modern times and back in the day. I mean, by 1979, the images of Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo and Princess Leia et al were everywhere. On lunchboxes, books, clothing, comics, stationary, pajamas, bed covers, curtains, wallpaper, pinball machines etc, etc, and, importantly, that merch was selling in hitherto unheard of quantities. Those characters were ubiquitous in the late '70s and early '80s, in a way that the sequel characters simply aren't. I mean, in terms of younger fans in 2019, merchandise featuring the likes of Frozen, the Marvel Cinematic Universe characters, and Harry Potter dwarf "new" Star Wars *, in terms of commercial success and saturation into the mainstream. I don't have any comic sales figures to band about or prove my point, but my impression is that a comic featuring the further adventures of Luke, Han and Leia is going to outsell a comic featuring Poe Dameron or whoever. Part of the reason for that is that the public care more about those older characters, and are invested in what happens to them in a way that they just aren't about the sequel trilogy characters. It doesn't matter how well written or drawn a Poe Dameron comic is, it's not going to have the market pull of a Luke Skywalker book. Part of the reason for that is that Poe is nowhere near as compelling a character as Luke. * = I'm only talking about SW merchandise that features the newer, sequel trilogy characters here, not SW merchandising as a whole. |
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Post by aquagoat on Mar 9, 2019 9:00:32 GMT -5
Sorry, but that's clearly inaccurate. The Force Awakens - $2b at the box office. The Last Jedi - $1.3b. Episodes VII and VIII have been hugely successful, and Rey, Finn and Poe Dameron have proved hugely popular. Poe has his own comic, they've all been in cartoons and video games....and if you go on Amazon, there are plenty of books (and toys) about Rey and Finn. Inaccurate is using a box office number to sell the idea of the sequel characters/story being popular. Further, according to a January 2018 article from The Wall Street Journal: "Despite being one of last year’s most successful movies, ‘Star Wars: The Last Jedi’ has fallen short of Wall Street’s expectations due to a faster than expected falloff at the box office, declining toy sales and a poor showing in China.” “Star Wars toy sales during the 2017 Holidays were the lowest since Disney relaunched the brand in 2015, according to NPD Group.”..and had the fastest drop at the box office of any SW film to date. That's not a sign of a strong appeal with the moviegoers or general SW fanbase. Moreover, go check the reports of retailer meetings with SW toy manufacturers like Hasbro had over the past few years, where sales numbers on sequel-based toys steadily dropped, but in this year--at Toy Fair 2019 (NY), the company's biggest announcement centered on a reissue of the original Kenner action figure line to great fanfare / consumer response. Why is all of this happening? Its connected to publishing as well; if the sequel films were truly as popular as you suggest, surely the vast majority of comics, games, novels and coffee-table books would not be based on the Original Trilogy--but they have been and continue to be. Production follows the money and public interest, and the OT smothers the sequel films in every ancillary market category. There is a reason for that. But that's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying the new characters are more popular than Luke, Han and co. What I'm saying is that the new characters are popular, and they do have a lot of toys, books etc, in contrast to your statement that the lack of comics, and online criticism, means they're not popular. |
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Post by aquagoat on Mar 9, 2019 9:06:28 GMT -5
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Post by aquagoat on Mar 9, 2019 9:07:10 GMT -5
It likely has more to do with the fact that, by and large, comic book buyers are a superstitious and cowardly lot and don't want much of anything that they haven't read a couple score times over the last forty years. I don't want new stuff...I want to see Han Solo doing the same thing over and over and over and over again. I think that's definitely part of it, but I don't think that's quite the whole story in this case. I think that tarkintino is closer to the truth insofar as the new characters (Finn, Rey, Poe, Rose etc), as well as the new films in general, simply arent good enough and haven't captured the public imagination in a comparable way to the original trilogy. Now, while that is an entirely subjective opinion on my part, I think that the sequel trilogy's failure to adequately engage both old and new fans is borne out on a wider scale by the lack of success of the attendant toys (while original trilogy toys continue to sell like gangbusters, of course), and the lack of Rey's, Fyn's, or Poe's likenesses appearing on merchandise. There is some merch that features these characters, of course, but not in the same quantities that the original trilogy characters appear, both in modern times and back in the day. I mean, by 1979, the images of Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo and Princess Leia et al were everywhere. On lunchboxes, books, clothing, comics, stationary, pajamas, bed covers, curtains, wallpaper, pinball machines etc, etc, and, importantly, that merch was selling in hitherto unheard of quantities. Those characters were ubiquitous in the late '70s and early '80s, in a way that the sequel characters simply aren't. I mean, in terms of younger fans in 2019, merchandise featuring the likes of Frozen, the Marvel Cinematic Universe characters, and Harry Potter dwarf "new" Star Wars *, in terms of commercial success and saturation into the mainstream. I don't have any comic sales figures to band about or prove my point, but my impression is that a comic featuring the further adventures of Luke, Han and Leia is going to outsell a comic featuring Poe Dameron or whoever. Part of the reason for that is that the public care more about those older characters, and are invested in what happens to them in a way that they just aren't about the sequel trilogy characters. It doesn't matter how well written or drawn a Poe Dameron comic is, it's not going to have the market pull of a Luke Skywalker book. Part of the reason for that is that Poe is nowhere near as compelling a character as Luke. * = I'm only talking about SW merchandise that features the newer, sequel trilogy characters here, not SW merchandising as a whole. Fair enough, but we're drifting towards an 'original trilogy vs new trilogy' debate, which was not the original point. The point is that the new movies are very popular, as as Rey, Finn, Poe and Kylo Ren, and the lack of comics about them isn't really an indication of anything. |
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Post by rberman on Mar 9, 2019 10:24:19 GMT -5
The new movies are popular as action movies, but not as a culture-consuming leviathan. The original Star Wars was lightning in a bottle on that account; it's not a moment that can be planned as a repeat event. The best Star Wars can hope for at this point is what James Bond has: Every now and then, a new installment comes out, and people say, "Oh good, that will probably be fun," and they spend two hours enjoying it. But the sequels don't and can't have the culture dominance that the original trilogy had, despite the high grosses at the box office. Part of it is the relative quality of the product, but many other societal factors are in play as well.
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