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Post by brutalis on Jun 13, 2019 9:02:57 GMT -5
The ARTWORK is scrumptious indeed and one of the main draws for this mini. While the story has flaws, it is not any more flawed than the movies themselves. I quite liked this mini and appreciate that Walker chose to focus upon other Apes than Cornelius and Zira. Lots of wiggle room for Ursus and the good Doctor to play with characterization wise. The comic does explore the POA world with respect to the movies and it attempts to evoke (sometimes unsuccessfully) and fill in the blank spots while doing so. I can forgive the mistakes based on this aspect as I want MORE comics connection to the movies rather than always going with stories outside of the movie-verse.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 13, 2019 10:44:38 GMT -5
The ARTWORK is scrumptious indeed and one of the main draws for this mini. Yes, especially the flashbacks. Sometimes the artwork in the present moment looks rushed, but I'm hardly complaining. The film are full of logic gapse that require a very healthy suspension of disbelief, but they're GOOD stories that are full of ideas and (with the exception of the second film) rich characterization. This story is adequate. It's not bad, but it never comes close to emulating the creativity and characterizations that made the franchise a success. It's merely...adequate. Agreed, though he isn't using it well. I don't feel like I'm seeing either character in a particularly different light. Zaius has been used almost as often as the other apes in these comics, and he's certainly been handled better. Ursus just isn't working for me. I'm not buying the character beneath the tough militant exterior. Here's where I couldn't disagree with you more. We've had sooooo many film tie ins. Here they are: Film Continuity (note: these stories align with the films, but do not necessarily align with one another) Vol. 4, Annual #1: "The Scroll" (40 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Sins of the Father! (30 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Betrayal of the Planet of the Apes #1 (20 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Betrayal of the Planet of the Apes #2 (20 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Betrayal of the Planet of the Apes #3 (20 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Betrayal of the Planet of the Apes #4 (20 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Exile on the Planet of the Apes #1 (18 years prior to "Planet of the Apes") Exile on the Planet of the Apes #2 (18 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Exile on the Planet of the Apes #3 (18 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Exile on the Planet of the Apes #4 (18 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #1 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #2 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #3 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #4 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #5 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #6 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #7 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #8 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #9 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #10 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes") Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #11 (8 years prior to "Planet of the Apes")Revolution on the Planet of the Apes #6 (B story): "Catch a Falling Star" (minutes prior to the events of "Planet of the Apes," though in an interrelated alternate timeline)Planet of the Apes (1968)Planet of the Apes: Ursus #1 (coinciding with the events of Planet of the Apes)Planet of the Apes: Ursus #2 (coinciding with the events of Planet of the Apes)Planet of the Apes: Ursus #3 (coinciding with the events of Planet of the Apes)Planet of the Apes: Ursus #4 (coinciding with the events of Planet of the Apes)Planet of the Apes: Ursus #5 (coinciding with the events of Planet of the Apes)Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #1 (immediately following Planet of the Apes)Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #2 (immediately following Planet of the Apes)Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #3 (immediately following Planet of the Apes)Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #4 (immediately following Planet of the Apes)Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #4 (immediately following Planet of the Apes)Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #5 (just prior to, during, and after Beneath the Planet of the Apes)Kong on the Planet of the Apes #1-6 (A few days prior to Beneath The Planet of the Apes)Planet of the Apes / Green Lantern #1 (just prior to Beneath the Planet of the Apes)Planet of the Apes / Green Lantern #2-6 (alters the events of Beneath the Planet of the Apes)Beneath the Planet of the Apes (1970)Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #12 (concurrent with "Beneath the Planet of the Apes," and just prior to "Escape")Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Prime Directive #5 (just prior to, during, and after Beneath the Planet of the Apes)Escape from the Planet of the Apes (1971) Tarzan on the Planet of the Apes #1 (alternate timeline to the events of "Escape") Tarzan on the Planet of the Apes #2 Tarzan on the Planet of the Apes #3 Tarzan on the Planet of the Apes #4 Tarzan on the Planet of the Apes #5 Conquest on the Planet of the Apes (1972)Vol. 2, #19: "Quitting Time." (concurrent with "Conquest of the Planet of the Apes")Revolution on the Planet of the Apes #1: "the end of the world" (one, two, and three days after "Conquest of the Planet of the Apes")Revolution on the Planet of the Apes #2: "Lines of Communication" (four, five, and six days after "Conquest of the Planet of the Apes")Revolution on the Planet of the Apes #3: "Intelligent Design" (14+ days after "Conquest on the Planet of the Apes")Revolution on the Planet of the Apes #4: "Truth and Consequences| (14+ days after "Conquest on the Planet of the Apes")Revolution on the Planet of the Apes #5: "weapon of choice" (14+ days after "Conquest on the Planet of the Apes")Revolution of the Planet of the Apes #6: "Survival of the Fittest" (14+ days after "Conquest on the Planet of the Apes")Vol. 1, #22: "Quest on the Planet of the Apes" (just prior to "Battle for the Planet of the Apes" [shooting script version])Battle of the Planet of the Apes (1973) Meanwhile, I feel like the only truly great Apes stories we've seen told outside of that immediate continuity were the Doug Moench stories in volume one. Everything else has either been derivative of the films or not particularly good.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2019 13:59:43 GMT -5
you can see more of his pages at Felix art his art dealer's website. -M I'm fascinated by this, but none of your images are showing. There's a link in there to the art dealer's webpage where you can view the pages. -M
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Post by tarkintino on Jun 13, 2019 15:27:26 GMT -5
Planet of the Apes: Ursus #5 (May 2018) Script: David F. Walker Oh, man. Apparently, Walker has not familiarized himself with the APJAC series, since we know if one survived as part of a line of descendants (e.g., "Negro" the mutant from Beneath the Planet of the Apes), then it stands to reason that there were more. Arguably, they might have been part of the mutant population (or tended to migrate elsewhere), which had a larger diversity of races than the more racially homogeneous, wild humans that occupied the areas surrounding Ape City, which would account for the treatment of Dodge's corpse as an unusual specimen. ...and its incredibly misguided and inapplicable to the original series depiction of the apes and their beliefs. Not once do any apes make a racial distinction based on color and link that with behavior, Its never mentioned at all, but Walker--as I've observed before--seemed desperate to inject his own ideas / analogies on race into the character of apes based on the APJAC movies, when its nowhere to found or even implied. Is as though he's like people who never watched The Twilight Zone (the original) and through the watered don filter of person-to-person chatter over the decades, thought it was all about twist endings, when it was far more than that. To this end, Walker appears to base this forced racial sub-plot based on writers and film reviewers talking about racial analogies in the APJAC films, and somehow thought it opened the door to the apes adopting human behavior/social patterns. Terrible. Your synopsis makes me wonder if he's ever really understood or just watched the films enough.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 13, 2019 15:33:38 GMT -5
Terrible. Your synopsis makes me wonder if he's ever really understood or just watched the films enough. Could just as easily be that his editor asked him to abandon the edgy direction he was heading in. Or that he just wanted to make Ursus a little more of an a**hole in that first issue. I'm disappointed and confused, but you have a level of hatred for it that I frankly don't understand.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 13, 2019 15:57:58 GMT -5
Planet of the Apes: Ursus #6 (June 2018) Script: David F. Walker Pencils: Lalit Kumar Sharma Inks: Lalit Kumar Sharma Colors: Jason Wordie Letters: Ed Dukeshire Grade: C- In the true Boom! style, we were given a massively decompressed limited series with teased clues to mysterious events, shocking final page twists, and a plethora of nods to the classic films and past properties. When you strip all of that away, you get a story that can be told in three pages. Here we go: It's a story that's been done before...a lot. Outright cliche. And yet good characterization could have saved it. But, as I remarked while reviewing Walker's writing on Tarzan on the Planet of the Apes, We get a lot of moments where you can see Walker, Seeley, and Dagnino TRYING so damn hard to make us feel something for these guys: ...but it always seems forced. Apparently, not much has changed. So Ursus dies at the end of the second film (I mean, we knew that was coming), and I'm not even sure whether he regrets his life choices after his wife died, or if he simply regrets that his wife died. Six issues spent studying a single character, and I still don't really know him or (for that matter) really care. The best I can ultimately say about this series in hindsight is that, some great art and nods to true POTA fans aside, this is a bland, uninteresting story that doesn't really do anything wrong. It's just utterly unremarkable. IMPORTANT DETAILS: - Whereas the first five issues took place during the events of the first film, this one takes place during the events of the second film. Theoretically, this timeline can co-exist with that of Star Trek / Planet of the Apes: The Primate Directive and Planet of the Apes: Cataclysm #12, which both occurred at the same time, but not Kong on the Planet of the Apes, nor Planet of the Apes / Green Lantern, which also occurred in this time window. MINOR DETAILS: - We never got an ape named after Mike Ploog.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 13, 2019 16:04:07 GMT -5
Summary of Planet of the Apes: Ursus (Boom!) (2018)
Overview: The story no one asked for, in which the first two Planet of the Apes films get retold from the perspective of General Ursus, intermixed with an obligatory backstory.
Worthwhile To Read?: There's some very strong artwork, as well as some fun nods that only true Apes fans will pick up on, but unless Ursus is your favorite character from the films, there's nothing truly "must read" about this massively decompressed six issue story that could have been told in one.
Key Issues/Highlights?: Chris Mooneyham's artwork on the first two issues is really something.
Worth Re-Reading?: Probably not.
This volumes includes: Planet of the Apes: Ursus #1-6
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 13, 2019 16:09:30 GMT -5
At this point, I'm finally nearly caught up on these reviews. All that's left in the original cinematic universe are:
Planet of the Apes: The Time of Man, and Planet of the Apes: The Simian Age
Of course, anytime I start to catch up, it means Boom! is about to announce their next Planet of the Apes project. Anybody hear anything?
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Post by tarkintino on Jun 13, 2019 22:40:12 GMT -5
Terrible. Your synopsis makes me wonder if he's ever really understood or just watched the films enough. Could just as easily be that his editor asked him to abandon the edgy direction he was heading in. Or that he just wanted to make Ursus a little more of an a**hole in that first issue. I'm disappointed and confused, but you have a level of hatred for it that I frankly don't understand. Its a comic. There's no hatred, but I've never been a fan of people who like to inject their own inapplicable ideas in a licensed property at the expense of said property. The idea of Ursus (or any movie-based ape) making racial distinctions about humans when that's nowhere to be found in the five APJAC films (or 1974 TV series) shows a level of A) ignorance about very clear messages / intent of the apes' views or B) not caring about the film series' carefully laid out character and story structure in favor of pushing a writer (or publisher's) agenda. To me, its no different that what's happening to the current Star Wars movies, where Disney/Kathleen Kennedy are willing to shove anything into / subvert many established ideas of the original trilogy, to replace it with whatever their agenda happens to be. This is one of the most significant reasons so many comic adaptations of TV and movie properties have failed throughout the life of the medium.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 14, 2019 6:13:11 GMT -5
Its a comic. There's no hatred, but I've never been a fan of people who like to inject their own inapplicable ideas in a licensed property at the expense of said property. People said the same thing about Conquest on the Planet of the Apes (which, by the way, is my second favorite of the bunch). Whereas the racial allegory had been incredibly muted in the first two films, Paul Dehn really threw it in the viewers' face so much so that Fox ended up rewriting and reshooting that final scene. POTA has always been a franchise unafraid to disrupt the status quo (even its own) to send a message. I have no problem with that. Where I struggle is with Walker's message/intent being so confusing, unfinished, and misleading. My guess at this point is he was trying to stir controversy in order to sell the book, where someone like you would go "This guy's a racist!" and someone like mrp would reply, "But he's black!".
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Post by tarkintino on Jun 14, 2019 19:18:21 GMT -5
People said the same thing about Conquest on the Planet of the Apes (which, by the way, is my second favorite of the bunch). Whereas the racial allegory had been incredibly muted in the first two films, Paul Dehn really threw it in the viewers' face so much so that Fox ended up rewriting and reshooting that final scene. It was "muted" in POTA/BTPOTA because there was no intention (in the script, or from Schaffner or Jacobs) to have the apes judge humans by human racial prejudice constructs, instead looking at them as a single, cancerous threat. That was the only and best way to hard sell the ideas behind Zaius' specist statements in order for misanthropic Taylor to be the unlikely advocate for humans, and of course, the slap in the face he received in the end. That would not be possible if the apes were targeting individual races. POTA was one entire species vs another, which continued into Beneath the Planet of the Apes with the mutant's views of the entire ape species--the heart of that film's final conflict. Regarding Conquest, Dehn (as mentioned earlier) used race only as a mirror of the mistreatment apes were receiving (re: the conversation between MacDonald and Caesar, which some black viewers did not appreciate in 1972, given the history of racists drawing idiotic, false "parallels" between those of African descent and apes), but not within the ape perspective on humans. Before his change of heart, Caesar--like Also in the final film--when making hateful statements about humans, spoke of the entire species, not by sub-categories, which was consistent to the way apes saw humans in POTS/BTPOTA. This comic trying to (allegedly) disrupt the status quo was unnecessary, as POTA had already addressed a number of issues that were boiling over in the world culture of the late 1960s/early 70s in a near-perfect manner. Adding material unsupported by the movie plots comes off as an attempt to take this series in a direction it never needed to take in order to make its points.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jun 15, 2019 15:48:34 GMT -5
This comic trying to (allegedly) disrupt the status quo was unnecessary, as POTA had already addressed a number of issues that were boiling over in the world culture of the late 1960s/early 70s in a near-perfect manner. Adding material unsupported by the movie plots comes off as an attempt to take this series in a direction it never needed to take in order to make its points. If every POTA comic followed this outlook and simply stayed within the confines of the original films, that would be a sad state of affairs, indeed. There are ways to do this tastefully, and ways to do this that are tacky, but if creators don't evolve the original properties, why keep reading them? You're entitled to your opinion. I just happen to think it's an ill-considered one.
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Post by tarkintino on Jun 15, 2019 18:52:15 GMT -5
This comic trying to (allegedly) disrupt the status quo was unnecessary, as POTA had already addressed a number of issues that were boiling over in the world culture of the late 1960s/early 70s in a near-perfect manner. Adding material unsupported by the movie plots comes off as an attempt to take this series in a direction it never needed to take in order to make its points. If every POTA comic followed this outlook and simply stayed within the confines of the original films, that would be a sad state of affairs, indeed. There are ways to do this tastefully, and ways to do this that are tacky, but if creators don't evolve the original properties, why keep reading them? You're entitled to your opinion. I just happen to think it's an ill-considered one. Ultimately, we can agree to disagree, but a license holder and those who work for them can do whatever they desire, but that does not mean it will work. Its not working here. If this was some sort of Ape Expanded Universe, where some gorilla on the other side of the world held those views, that would not be an issue, as its removed from the characters, stated beliefs and situations from the films, but that's not the case here. "Evolving" the original properties in the hands of those nowhere near the beliefs (and arguably creativity) of those who made the films also got us--in Star Wars--endless Palpatine clones, Luke clones, Boba Fett/Mandalorian stories for what was originally (on film) a single-purpose character, "Dark This," "Dark That," ancient Sith characters/wars, lightsabers galore--all of which we were once told were ever-so-important to and/or connected the film series events, but consistently misunderstand the point of the films. Walker is right in line with all of those SW Expanded Universe writers, where they stuck whatever their whims were into a story with a clear message, but its not in line with the creators intended/presented, hence his attempt to shoehorn human conflicts about race into the apes who never once said anything other than statements condemning the entire species.
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Post by thwhtguardian on Jan 16, 2021 19:15:53 GMT -5
Not related to the comics based on the original films but I saw an illustrated hard cover edition of the original novel and couldn't help thinking of you shaxper
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Jan 16, 2021 22:41:15 GMT -5
Not related to the comics based on the original films but I saw an illustrated hard cover edition of the original novel and couldn't help thinking of you shaxper Oh, that is VERY cool!
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