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Post by codystarbuck on Oct 10, 2024 13:02:41 GMT -5
You can skip the second half of Jack's Jimmy Olsen run and issues #11-17 of Mister Miracle but otherwise, yeah, you'll want to read it all.
Cei-U! I summon the Kirby Kosmik Komix!
Thanks. I was planning to read New Gods 1-11 and then Forever People 1-11 and so on. Early on, they are heavily connected, with Darkseid appearing in The Forever People before New Gods. Also, you meet Tigra, Orion's mother, in Mister Miracle, before the originally unpublished story in New Gods, which was eventually published in the Baxter format reprints, in the mid-80s, to lead into the Hunger Dogs graphic novel. DC put out some nice hardcover collections of the complete Fourth World, in color, with introductions by Mark Evanier, which presented all four series, in publication order, and you could see the whole picture develop. You can just read New Gods and get the central story; but, you will miss a lot about Darkseid and his agents and a lot about the Anti-Life Equation (covered most directly in the Forever People) and more about the Cold War between Apokalips and New Genesis. Jimmy Olsen introduces a lot of the concepts and the world that he is exploring, especially Darkseid and how he acts, through various third parties, to avoid being seen openly acting against New Genesis and the universe at large. New Gods explores the central battle as things go from Cold War to Hot War. Mister Miracle and Scott Free's escape from Apokalips factors heavily into that escalation, but New Gods shows us why that was so important, in "The Pact." Early on, in The Forever People, Darkseid has captured Beautiful Dreamer, because she holds key information about the Anti-Life Equation. A little later, we meet Glorious Godfrey and Kirby illustrates just what he means by "anti-life." Mister Miracle actually takes us into Apokalips, into a direct challenge to Darkseid and his forces, and we meet Tigra, with hints as to her importance, before Kirby eventually did the story meant for New Gods, but canceled before it could be published, in the 70s. New Gods is really the only one that stuck to the central story, from start to finish. Forever People starts diverging after the Glorious Godfrey story and Mister Miracle does right after the Female Furies defect from Darkseid and turns into dealing with paranormal events, since the Code had eased restrictions on horror and such things were selling. Jimmy Olsen turned into comedy-adventure with Goody Rickles and homages to Universal Monsters and similar things. |
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Post by tonebone on Oct 10, 2024 13:44:05 GMT -5
I can remember DC Comics would resort to a few panels (or pages) of 'narrated flashbacks'when a 'deeper dive' was needed. (A Superman-Black Canary team-up in DC COMICS PRESENTS summed up the death of Larry Lance, and even recreated that panel of the JLA and JSA mourning at the grave). The exposition I hated was via diary/journal entries, in cursive. 'There's no CURSIVE in COMICS!' One of the lamest Batman tropes to emerge since Year One, is that Alfred always thinks in cursive. |
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Post by kirby101 on Oct 10, 2024 13:46:43 GMT -5
Earlier this year I completed my Fourth world collection. I was wondering ( the Jack Kirby fans will know) could I read just the New Gods 11 issue series and get a complete story? I’m not sure if I need the other fourth World books to get a full experience. I know there’s an issue of Mr. Miracle that connects , but do I need to read further? You can skip the second half of Jack's Jimmy Olsen run and issues #11-17 of Mister Miracle but otherwise, yeah, you'll want to read it all.
Cei-U! I summon the Kirby Kosmik Komix!
You can skip them for the full Fourth World saga. But they are still fun books. I am in the middle of the Jimmy Olsen run and having a great time with it. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Oct 10, 2024 13:48:25 GMT -5
I can remember DC Comics would resort to a few panels (or pages) of 'narrated flashbacks'when a 'deeper dive' was needed. (A Superman-Black Canary team-up in DC COMICS PRESENTS summed up the death of Larry Lance, and even recreated that panel of the JLA and JSA mourning at the grave). The exposition I hated was via diary/journal entries, in cursive. 'There's no CURSIVE in COMICS!' One of the lamest Batman tropes to emerge since Year One, is that Alfred always thinks in cursive. Surely it should be in the form of an enlightened manuscript! |
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Post by rich on Oct 10, 2024 14:09:14 GMT -5
He probably thinks in American cursive 🤮
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 10, 2024 14:26:37 GMT -5
You can skip the second half of Jack's Jimmy Olsen run and issues #11-17 of Mister Miracle but otherwise, yeah, you'll want to read it all.
Cei-U! I summon the Kirby Kosmik Komix!
You can skip them for the full Fourth World saga. But they are still fun books. Yeah, that's what I meant. Worth reading for their own sakes but not essential to understanding the overall Fourth World story.
Cei-U! What he said!
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Oct 10, 2024 17:30:02 GMT -5
Roquefort Raider MRPs_Missives and other Conan fans, have you guys ever read the Death Covered in Gold miniseries from 1999? A lot of the art on Roy Thomas' late 90s Conan miniseries looks rough, but this one has John Buscema inking himself. I agree with MRPs_Missives ; the all-Buscema art is nice, but the story is pretty standard. From a continuity point of view it also annoyed me a bit for two reasons. The first is that the miniseries reintroduces Jenna, Conan's treacherous lover whom he had dumped in a cesspool in issue#11. The two decide to let bygones be bygones, but... we had already seen their reunion, waaaaaay back in one of the J.M. DeMatteis issues. (Also, Jenna who was a blond is turned into a redhead). The second is that the country of Ophir is known for its wealth; it has lots of gold. But here, the expression "streets paved with gold" is taken literally, with gold present everywhere, which is downright silly. (Roy went overboard with the gold of Ophir in the Road of Kings maxiseries from Dark Horse, too). Trivia time: the title was supposed to be Death Carved in Gold, but someone made a typo. |
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Post by tartanphantom on Oct 11, 2024 17:49:53 GMT -5
You can skip the second half of Jack's Jimmy Olsen run and issues #11-17 of Mister Miracle but otherwise, yeah, you'll want to read it all.
Cei-U! I summon the Kirby Kosmik Komix!
Thanks. I was planning to read New Gods 1-11 and then Forever People 1-11 and so on.
I know everybody's got their own way of doing it, but I've always taken the four different titles and read them pretty much in order of newsstand release. The whole thing actually kicks off in Jimmy Olsen #133 several months before any of the other books. I know they weren't necessarily scripted in this order, but if you were buying every issue for the first time as they came out, then the order would be:
Jimmy Olsen 133-135 first, Forever People #1 New Gods #1 Mister Miracle #1 then repeat the sequence with each additional issue number. Obviously, Jimmy Olsen and Mister Miracle tend to leave the Fourth World Farm later in their respective series as Cei-U! has already pointed out. I do think the first 5 or so issues of MM are important in lending to the backdrop of the New Genesis vs. Apokolips feud, but plot-wise, things go off the rails after that, and also after issue 141 of Jimmy Olsen.
I enjoy it more when I read them this way, as opposed to reading each series independently in their individual sequential orders.
Either way, it's gonna be way more enjoyable than trying to keep up with DC's later cross-title Millennium or Zero Hour events. 
But you do what works best for you.
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Post by Icctrombone on Oct 11, 2024 17:55:41 GMT -5
tartanphantom, I was hoping I could get away with reading each series individually. I think I will follow your suggestion and read them based on their release date.
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 11, 2024 18:36:26 GMT -5
tartanphantom , I was hoping I could get away with reading each series individually. I think I will follow your suggestion and read them based on their release date. The 14-year-old I was when I first read these is wriggling with envy at the thought of you experiencing these comics for the first time. If you're going to enjoy Kirby's magnum opus, though, you will need to turn off the adult, rational side of your brain and turn your inner geek up to 11. Do that and you'll have a blast.
Cei-U!
To paraphase the cover copy from one of Kirby's more outlandish issues: "Don't ask! Just read them!" |
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Post by Icctrombone on Oct 11, 2024 19:00:50 GMT -5
tartanphantom , I was hoping I could get away with reading each series individually. I think I will follow your suggestion and read them based on their release date. The 14-year-old I was when I first read these is wriggling with envy at the thought of you experiencing these comics for the first time. If you're going to enjoy Kirby's magnum opus, though, you will need to turn off the adult, rational side of your brain and turn your inner geek up to 11. Do that and you'll have a blast.
Cei-U!
To paraphase the cover copy from one of Kirby's more outlandish issues: "Don't ask! Just read them!" I read them as they came out but only remember the events in the Mr. Miracle book. It will be like reading them for the first time. |
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Post by kirby101 on Oct 12, 2024 8:27:33 GMT -5
tartanphantom , I was hoping I could get away with reading each series individually. I think I will follow your suggestion and read them based on their release date. The 14-year-old I was when I first read these is wriggling with envy at the thought of you experiencing these comics for the first time. If you're going to enjoy Kirby's magnum opus, though, you will need to turn off the adult, rational side of your brain and turn your inner geek up to 11. Do that and you'll have a blast.
Cei-U!
To paraphase the cover copy from one of Kirby's more outlandish issues: "Don't ask! Just read them!" Could say the same about most Silver Age books.  |
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Post by Ozymandias on Oct 12, 2024 13:36:56 GMT -5
My oldest and his friend recently watched F4 Silver Surfer movie and my boy asked me if in comics Dr Doom ever got a hold of his board. And said I dont think so. But I cant say 100%. Egads  ! Oh Adam, you've never read the classic Doom-steals-Surfer's-board arc from FF #57-60?  A Silver Age masterpiece!  I like "The Galactus Trilogy" as much as the next guy or gal, but if I had to choose I'd go with this one instead, no doubt. Best Kirby/Lee ever. |
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Post by Ozymandias on Oct 12, 2024 15:41:05 GMT -5
I don’t get the aversion to thought bubbles today. I miss them too, a narrative tool has been lost by dropping them. |
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Post by kirby101 on Oct 12, 2024 15:44:52 GMT -5
Agreed. Talk about firing on all cylinders. This was that period of FF 40-67 which I think is unparalleled as far a creative force. (I will demur from whose creativity I refer to). Just look at some pages from FF #57, the first issue of this story arc. Look at the top panel, this is just a throw away image by Kirby.  And what needs to said about this page.  |
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! Oh Adam, you've never read the classic Doom-steals-Surfer's-board arc from FF #57-60?
