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Post by Icctrombone on Sept 11, 2015 9:05:15 GMT -5
Age range of users who access this site: 33.5% 25-34 yrs old 27.5% 18-24 yrs old 15.5% 35-44 yrs old 12.5% 45-54 yrs old 5.5% 55-64 yrs old 5.5% 65+ yrs old (figures from Google Analytics. Note that it tracks all people who access the site, not just those who join or actively participate). So, despite most folks' assumptions, we're a pretty young community, albeit with mature tastes. Batman really took over as the fan favorite in the late 1980s. 61% of folks accessing the CCF were still very young (or not even born yet) when this happened. The real $64,000 question is... what was the average age of the 40 voters? Don't be a sore winner. Uh... wait |
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rossn
Full Member
Posts: 173
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Post by rossn on Sept 11, 2015 13:09:22 GMT -5
Do you mean "weaklink" as in an in-universe weakness (ie. Superman needs to save Lois from Lex) or a narrative weakness (ie. the characters are bad.) I can see the former but not the latter; I actually think Clark has a more interesting, characterful, likeable 'civilian' supporting cast than just about any other super. I guess to me, The characters have been around too long. I compare it to Spider-mans supporting cast which is always having people added and subtracted. For Superman it's been the same 3 people for 70 years. To be honest I don't see that much difference; while Spider-Man does indeed have blow ins and exits a lot of his core supporting cast has been set in stone since day one - only last year we had a Spider-Man movie with Gwen Stacy, Harry Osborn and Aunt May (lot of deaths and ressurections in that group...) Likewise with Superman it is true Lois has been around since literally day one (though I don't see that as a problem - she's iconic in her own right) but we've still seen the likes of Cat Grant, Bibbo Bibbowski, Professor Hamilton and Maggie Sawyer show up. In fact even Lana Lang only showed up for the first time in 1950, 12 years into Superman's run. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Sept 11, 2015 14:04:18 GMT -5
I guess to me, The characters have been around too long. I compare it to Spider-mans supporting cast which is always having people added and subtracted. For Superman it's been the same 3 people for 70 years. To be honest I don't see that much difference; while Spider-Man does indeed have blow ins and exits a lot of his core supporting cast has been set in stone since day one - only last year we had a Spider-Man movie with Gwen Stacy, Harry Osborn and Aunt May (lot of deaths and ressurections in that group...) Likewise with Superman it is true Lois has been around since literally day one (though I don't see that as a problem - she's iconic in her own right) but we've still seen the likes of Cat Grant, Bibbo Bibbowski, Professor Hamilton and Maggie Sawyer show up. In fact even Lana Lang only showed up for the first time in 1950, 12 years into Superman's run. I guess you have a point, but for me, Those 3 have made Superman stale. I remember Reading Spider-man in the 80's and seeing different social challenges than when he was first written in the 60's. I like that he had many romantic interests that had run its course. From Liz Allen to Gwen to MJ to Betty Brant, it was always real changes. Superman not so much. |
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Post by foxley on Sept 11, 2015 18:11:54 GMT -5
To me, Superman is so powerful I don't really get how you can tell an interesting story about him that doesn't involve kryptonite or magic. And anything that is at level to challenge is so powerful that it doesn't really interest me. I prefer the more human level stories of Batman.
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Post by Phil Maurice on Sept 11, 2015 19:40:06 GMT -5
This one's too close to call. Do you vote for Yin or Yang? Salt or Pepper? Hollandaise or Béarnaise? It's impossible. I'm as conflicted as Mechagodzilla. Here's my vote:
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Post by dupersuper on Sept 11, 2015 19:45:19 GMT -5
Do you mean "weaklink" as in an in-universe weakness (ie. Superman needs to save Lois from Lex) or a narrative weakness (ie. the characters are bad.) I can see the former but not the latter; I actually think Clark has a more interesting, characterful, likeable 'civilian' supporting cast than just about any other super. I guess to me, The characters have been around too long. I compare it to Spider-mans supporting cast which is always having people added and subtracted. For Superman it's been the same 3 people for 70 years. deleted: rossn beat me to it. |
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Post by dupersuper on Sept 11, 2015 19:49:20 GMT -5
To me, Superman is so powerful I don't really get how you can tell an interesting story about him that doesn't involve kryptonite or magic. And anything that is at level to challenge is so powerful that it doesn't really interest me. I prefer the more human level stories of Batman. Most Batman stories these days he seems human-in-name-only... |
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Post by foxley on Sept 11, 2015 20:17:39 GMT -5
To me, Superman is so powerful I don't really get how you can tell an interesting story about him that doesn't involve kryptonite or magic. And anything that is at level to challenge is so powerful that it doesn't really interest me. I prefer the more human level stories of Batman. Most Batman stories these days he seems human-in-name-only... Maybe, but I tend to look at Batman over the whole of his career. And I get more caught up in the schemes of Batman's villains than I do in Brainiac shrinking cities, or Luthor inventing satellites to make everyone forget Superman exists or whatever. The power level of Superman stories just distances me too much from the action, and I don't feel as involved in them. |
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Post by dupersuper on Sept 12, 2015 0:22:59 GMT -5
To each their own. I love high power levels, crazy cosmic stories, sci-fi/cosmic stuff. Give me Supes, JL, Avengers, FF, Silver Surfer, New Gods, GLC, LoSH etc. any day.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,865
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Post by shaxper on Sept 12, 2015 19:23:57 GMT -5
Very likely. After all, 25-34 probably encapsulates the demographic most likely to be surfing the net, looking for new communities. We may be getting a lot of the 18-24 year olds through our facebook page, too. Just found a way of exclusively tracking repeat visitors to the site via Google Analytics. Presumably, this would mostly be our active members. It will take Google 24 hours to begin returning the results and, even then, our Friday thru Monday traffic is not the same as the higher traffic and activity levels we tend to see Tuesday thru Thursday. In short, we'll have a better picture by this time next week. I just have to remember to return to this thread and post the data... Okay, here's the data from yesterday. So the breakdown for repeat visitors to the site on Friday breaks down as follows: 35-44 yr olds: 90 45-54 yr olds: 72 25-34 yr olds: 33 18-24 yr olds: 0 54+ yrs old: 0 This is a very slim snapshot of the board's traffic, and a regular member who only checked in on the board once would not have been counted. Also bear in mind that this number includes the large number of silent repeat visitors we have here who either haven't joined yet or who do not regularly post. |
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Post by thwhtguardian on Sept 12, 2015 19:38:17 GMT -5
Just found a way of exclusively tracking repeat visitors to the site via Google Analytics. Presumably, this would mostly be our active members. It will take Google 24 hours to begin returning the results and, even then, our Friday thru Monday traffic is not the same as the higher traffic and activity levels we tend to see Tuesday thru Thursday. In short, we'll have a better picture by this time next week. I just have to remember to return to this thread and post the data... Okay, here's the data from yesterday. So the breakdown for repeat visitors to the site on Friday breaks down as follows: 35-44 yr olds: 90 45-54 yr olds: 72 25-34 yr olds: 33 18-24 yr olds: 0 54+ yrs old: 0 This is a very slim snapshot of the board's traffic, and a regular member who only checked in on the board once would not have been counted. Also bear in mind that this number includes the large number of silent repeat visitors we have here who either haven't joined yet or who do not regularly post. Certainly not perfect, but in comparing it to the comm survey(which again is not perfect) the two seem to match fairly well with 6 votes for being between 31 and 40, 8 votes for 41-50, 11 votes for 51-60 and 3 votes for 20-30. |
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Post by Randle-El on Sept 12, 2015 20:43:20 GMT -5
To me, Superman is so powerful I don't really get how you can tell an interesting story about him that doesn't involve kryptonite or magic. And anything that is at level to challenge is so powerful that it doesn't really interest me. I prefer the more human level stories of Batman. Darwyn Cooke wrote a Superman story a few years back that played with the concept of Superman experiencing fear, and I thought it was a great way to show Clark's humanity. The idea was that Superman was still fairly inexperienced and wasn't aware of the full scope of his invulnerability. In the story, there's one scene where he dives into a volcano but is quickly engulfed by lava and becomes disoriented. He knows that the lava won't burn his skin, but he doesn't know what would happen if entered his body, or if can be suffocated by it. He starts to panic and basically has a drowning experience. I think moments like these, where Superman experiences doubt or doesn't know what to do, can be just as effective at providing limitations for him and thereby create dramatic tension. While Batman is "human", he rarely shows this kind of frailty in his character. |
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,865
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Post by shaxper on Sept 12, 2015 20:58:18 GMT -5
I think one thing we have to consider when comparing Batman to Superman is whether we're more interested in the comics or the mythology.
For storytelling purposes, I agree that it's far more challenging to write a compelling Superman tale because he is so powerful and generally sure of himself as well. For those choosing Batman in this poll, that's the most common rationale I am hearing.
For those who chose Superman, it seems generally to be based more upon viewing the character as a modern day mythological figure than a comic book protagonist -- a hero to look up to moreso than a character to read about from month to month.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Sept 13, 2015 14:40:21 GMT -5
I think one thing we have to consider when comparing Batman to Superman is whether we're more interested in the comics or the mythology. For storytelling purposes, I agree that it's far more challenging to write a compelling Superman tale because he is so powerful and generally sure of himself as well. For those choosing Batman in this poll, that's the most common rationale I am hearing. For those who chose Superman, it seems generally to be based more upon viewing the character as a modern day mythological figure than a comic book protagonist -- a hero to look up to moreso than a character to read about from month to month. I'm not sure I agree with either of those. Writing a good Batman story means writing a good mystery which - as Greg Hatcher noted - the last couple decades of Batman writers seem completely incapable of. And, personally, I've read a fair amount of Superman and a fair amount of Batman and I think, on average, that over the last 70 years the Superman books are stronger. |
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Post by thwhtguardian on Sept 13, 2015 21:05:35 GMT -5
I think one thing we have to consider when comparing Batman to Superman is whether we're more interested in the comics or the mythology. For storytelling purposes, I agree that it's far more challenging to write a compelling Superman tale because he is so powerful and generally sure of himself as well. For those choosing Batman in this poll, that's the most common rationale I am hearing. For those who chose Superman, it seems generally to be based more upon viewing the character as a modern day mythological figure than a comic book protagonist -- a hero to look up to moreso than a character to read about from month to month. I'm not sure I agree with either of those. Writing a good Batman story means writing a good mystery which - as Greg Hatcher noted - the last couple decades of Batman writers seem completely incapable of. And, personally, I've read a fair amount of Superman and a fair amount of Batman and I think, on average, that over the last 70 years the Superman books are stronger. It's not even just the last few decades, I don't think I can name a single good mystery with Batman, I've seen the lack of mystery levied against the book but I've just never seen it as an important part of Batman's history. |
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