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Post by dbutler69 on Oct 25, 2019 9:05:50 GMT -5
Ok, now I'm still on that Baxter series, and just read #15. This is Greg LaRocque's first issue, and he is really competing with Dave Cockrum as my all-time favorite Legion artist! As good as his predecessor, Steve Lightle was, LaRocque is taking this book to another level, the same way Cockrum did when he took over.
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Post by beccabear67 on Oct 25, 2019 13:14:41 GMT -5
I don't know if I made it as far in the Baxter comic. I remember Steve Lightle so maybe didn't make it to LeRocque. When The Legion was good it was very good, Cockrum added a lot visually, and so did Giffen even if he went a bit abstract further along. The old John Forte comics seem like a quaint Victorian futurism in comparison.
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Post by brutalis on Oct 25, 2019 13:26:26 GMT -5
LaRocque gave the LOSH a nice futuristic visual punch and really had a sleek and bright (appropriate for the future) design element to the cast and costumes. Personally I feel LaRocque is a very underappreciated artist. He started out a bit rough and bland but he developed quickly a fun comic book look I enjoyed seeing. Really liked his Wally West Flash run as well.
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Post by String on Nov 9, 2019 21:02:54 GMT -5
A few thoughts and questions:
- I was reading LSH #284 wherein Karate Kid appears, mentioning his recent return from the past. This was helpfully accompanied by a nice footnote directing readers to check out his late lamented series. What's the general opinion on Val's solo title? Good, bad, neither?
- Speaking of Karate Kid staying in the past, in which issue of LSH did he disappear? How many issues was he gone or was it more that Val was gone 'in-between' Legion issues?
- I haven't seen that much Legion art by Pat Broderick and Bruce Patterson but what I have seen of their work in these few issues has been quite good.
- I've also been slowly making my way through the Baxter series, reading portions of the run for the very first time. Currently up to #30 and I must say that LaRocque along with Mike Decarlo have created some fine art indeed. I remember from that time all the fuss and mystery surrounding the Who Is Sensor Girl? plot. I think the mystery holds up rather well today although back then, with my limited Legion knowledge, there was no way I could correctly guess her identity. Kudos to Levitz for pointing out the clues he laid out for fans along the way in the various issues in a follow-up letters page after her reveal.
-Last, what is it with the weak nicknames? PG, KK, LL for example. The only nicknames I can say I like are Dreamy and Jeckie. Was it considered so odd if they referred to each other by their real names?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2019 21:23:00 GMT -5
A few thoughts and questions: - I was reading LSH #284 wherein Karate Kid appears, mentioning his recent return from the past. This was helpfully accompanied by a nice footnote directing readers to check out his late lamented series. What's the general opinion on Val's solo title? Good, bad, neither? - Speaking of Karate Kid staying in the past, in which issue of LSH did he disappear? How many issues was he gone or was it more that Val was gone 'in-between' Legion issues? From what I remember Karate Kid's solo series was unremarkable. I believe he went into the past chasing a villain and ended up proving his worthiness to Projectra's family to be her husband. I also think his adventures in the past happened "in between" the Superboy & the LoSH issues.
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Post by rberman on Nov 9, 2019 21:51:49 GMT -5
-Last, what is it with the weak nicknames? PG, KK, LL for example. The only nicknames I can say I like are Dreamy and Jeckie. Was it considered so odd if they referred to each other by their real names? LSH has a large cast already. Keeping track of real names and hero identities for so many characters is already a chore, compounded by difficult names like "Luornu Durgo" and "Condo Arlik."
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Post by dbutler69 on Nov 10, 2019 10:50:29 GMT -5
A few thoughts and questions: - I was reading LSH #284 wherein Karate Kid appears, mentioning his recent return from the past. This was helpfully accompanied by a nice footnote directing readers to check out his late lamented series. What's the general opinion on Val's solo title? Good, bad, neither? - Speaking of Karate Kid staying in the past, in which issue of LSH did he disappear? How many issues was he gone or was it more that Val was gone 'in-between' Legion issues? - I haven't seen that much Legion art by Pat Broderick and Bruce Patterson but what I have seen of their work in these few issues has been quite good. - I've also been slowly making my way through the Baxter series, reading portions of the run for the very first time. Currently up to #30 and I must say that LaRocque along with Mike Decarlo have created some fine art indeed. I remember from that time all the fuss and mystery surrounding the Who Is Sensor Girl? plot. I think the mystery holds up rather well today although back then, with my limited Legion knowledge, there was no way I could correctly guess her identity. Kudos to Levitz for pointing out the clues he laid out for fans along the way in the various issues in a follow-up letters page after her reveal. -Last, what is it with the weak nicknames? PG, KK, LL for example. The only nicknames I can say I like are Dreamy and Jeckie. Was it considered so odd if they referred to each other by their real names? I thought his series was so-so. Frankly, my main problem was with the art. The main penciller, Ric Estrada, seems to have done his homework regarding the martial arts, but I just didn't like the illustations - too cartoonish for me. The art did get better towards the end with a new art team, though. Having a few different writers didn't help, either. Some of the villains were pretty lame. In fact, most of them were. I guess they put him in the 20th century to make the comic appeal to non-Legion fans. Whether that was a good choice or a bad choice, I can't really tell. They did seem to waffle on whether to make it a martial arts comic or a superhero comic. Technically, Val was gone for an extended period, not "in-between" Legion issues, but honestly, I don't remember his absence being mention much in the Legion comic until later in the Karate Kid series, and in fact I think he even appeared in some Legion issue earlier on during the Karate Kid series, implying that they didn't take place at the same time. I suspect that the KK series happened a little after the concurrent Legion issue. I agree with you on the Broderick/Patterson art team. I thought they did an excellent job. Thank you for sending some kudos to Greg LaRocque. I LOVE his Legion art! I just finished #25 of the Baxter series, where Sensor Girl's identity is revealed on the last page. Though I knew who she was because I remember it from the last time I read these stories about 10 years ago, I agree with you that the mystery hold up well, and the Levitz did a good job of laying out subtle clue. It's funny reading the letter columns how many people thought it was Supergirl! As far as weak nicknames, I don't think it's just true of the Legion. I remember when professional athletes used to have really cool nicknames like the Galloping Ghost, the Sultan of Swat, The Iron Horse, etc. Nowadays, they simply go with initials or some lame shortening of the players name (I don't even consider these to be nicknames) such as LT, A-Rod, etc.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 13, 2019 14:56:53 GMT -5
Re-reading a bunch of LSH and Legionnaires books from the '90s, I find that I had missed that era's characters a lot... Brainiac 5.1, Gates, the non-powered Chuck Taine, Thunder, Monstress... The new faces were usually pretty interesting, and while some of the reinventions weren't always successful (Wildfire was awful before D&A fixed him in Legion Lost), the rebooted legionnaires really managed to fill their predecessors' shoes.
I feel short-changed at having that version of the heroes not continuing their career for a longer time. It's good that those long boxes exist!
I sort of remembered that R.J. Brande was actually J'onn J'onzz, but read online that that particular revelation was never actually used in the book. Is that true?
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Post by rberman on Nov 13, 2019 15:01:44 GMT -5
I sort of remembered that R.J. Brande was actually J'onn J'onzz, but read online that that particular revelation was never actually used in the book. Is that true? Huh, I've never heard that before, but there would be a certain elegance if 20th century Martians were 30th century Durlans. Living 1000 years though?
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Post by dbutler69 on Nov 13, 2019 15:11:44 GMT -5
Re-reading a bunch of LSH and Legionnaires books from the '90s, I find that I had missed that era's characters a lot... Brainiac 5.1, Gates, the non-powered Chuck Taine, Thunder, Monstress... The new faces were usually pretty interesting, and while some of the reinventions weren't always successful (Wildfire was awful before D&A fixed him in Legion Lost), the rebooted legionnaires really managed to fill their predecessors' shoes. I feel short-changed at having that version of the heroes not continuing their career for a longer time. It's good that those long boxes exist! I sort of remembered that R.J. Brande was actually J'onn J'onzz, but read online that that particular revelation was never actually used in the book. Is that true? My 90's Legion reading is sporadic (though I plan on rectifying that some time in the next year) but I loved Gates and Monstress. My two favorite post Magic Wars Legionnaires. I'd never heard of R.J. Brande being J'onn J'onzz. I don't like that revelation, but then I also didn't like the revelation that R.J. Brande was actually Chameleon Boy's father. I'm not sure which one was worse. Certainly I'm not buying J'onzz living 1,000 years, but there are ways around that.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 13, 2019 16:21:43 GMT -5
Re-reading a bunch of LSH and Legionnaires books from the '90s, I find that I had missed that era's characters a lot... Brainiac 5.1, Gates, the non-powered Chuck Taine, Thunder, Monstress... The new faces were usually pretty interesting, and while some of the reinventions weren't always successful (Wildfire was awful before D&A fixed him in Legion Lost), the rebooted legionnaires really managed to fill their predecessors' shoes. I feel short-changed at having that version of the heroes not continuing their career for a longer time. It's good that those long boxes exist! I sort of remembered that R.J. Brande was actually J'onn J'onzz, but read online that that particular revelation was never actually used in the book. Is that true? My 90's Legion reading is sporadic (though I plan on rectifying that some time in the next year) but I loved Gates and Monstress. My two favorite post Magic Wars Legionnaires. I'd never heard of R.J. Brande being J'onn J'onzz. I don't like that revelation, but then I also didn't like the revelation that R.J. Brande was actually Chameleon Boy's father. I'm not sure which one was worse. Certainly I'm not buying J'onzz living 1,000 years, but there are ways around that. Well, he was at the marriage of Chuck and Luornu! But yeah, I dislike those unnecessary connections; they always make our fictional universes look smaller, and therefore less real. Having Brande turn out to be a Durlan wasn't much to my taste the first time around, but after the Glorith soft reboot from the 5YL period I thought it worked better (since the concept had been there from the start).
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Post by dbutler69 on Nov 13, 2019 19:16:01 GMT -5
My 90's Legion reading is sporadic (though I plan on rectifying that some time in the next year) but I loved Gates and Monstress. My two favorite post Magic Wars Legionnaires. I'd never heard of R.J. Brande being J'onn J'onzz. I don't like that revelation, but then I also didn't like the revelation that R.J. Brande was actually Chameleon Boy's father. I'm not sure which one was worse. Certainly I'm not buying J'onzz living 1,000 years, but there are ways around that. Well, he was at the marriage of Chuck and Luornu! But yeah, I dislike those unnecessary connections; they always make our fictional universes look smaller, and therefore less real. Having Brande turn out to be a Durlan wasn't much to my taste the first time around, but after the Glorith soft reboot from the 5YL period I thought it worked better (since the concept had been there from the start). Yeah, I was going to mention that he was at that wedding. I also dislike these connections that shrink our universes. The Star Wars prequels did too much of that, too. Having Anakin having made C3-PO is just one example.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 13, 2019 20:02:39 GMT -5
Well, he was at the marriage of Chuck and Luornu! But yeah, I dislike those unnecessary connections; they always make our fictional universes look smaller, and therefore less real. Having Brande turn out to be a Durlan wasn't much to my taste the first time around, but after the Glorith soft reboot from the 5YL period I thought it worked better (since the concept had been there from the start). Yeah, I was going to mention that he was at that wedding. I also dislike these connections that shrink our universes. The Star Wars prequels did too much of that, too. Having Anakin having made C3-PO is just one example. Absolutely! And Yoda knowing Chewie, plus Han having kickstarted the rebellion, made it even worse. It sounds like self-indulgent fanfic. I much preferred the Star Wars universe described in the pages of the original novelization: Palpatine was just a disconnected ruler, and Darth Vader was nothing more than an imperial enforcer (even lower in the pecking order than Moff Tarkin). One connection that I absolutely loved in the Legion was how Mon-El/Valor was retroactively made responsible for sending so many superpowered humanoids across the galaxy, and particularly to planets where their powers were so useful (Polar Boy coming from a very hot planet, for example). That they were all the result of mutagenesis performed on Earthlings by the Dominators explained why they were human to begin with and explained why they had powers; that Valor had been the one to take them to a new home explained why he was widely seen as a messianic figure, and the suitability of everyone’s powers to their environment makes more sense if people were moved to a certain place where they could thrive than if they spontaneously developed the ability to project cold because it’s hot outside.
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Post by hondobrode on Nov 17, 2019 23:31:24 GMT -5
Totally agree
I thought this entire theme was brilliant
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Post by rberman on Nov 28, 2019 17:42:13 GMT -5
Here's an interesting Legion souvenir: The original drawing of Emerald Empress by Jim Shooter, age 13. When he was put on Legion in the first place, he provided not only scripts but designs and layouts.
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