Crimebuster
CCF Podcast Guru
Making comics!
Posts: 3,958 
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Post by Crimebuster on Mar 8, 2021 10:38:16 GMT -5
I have a bootleg copy of Song of the South somewhere on VHS. I got it in the late 90s at the dawn of ebay. It's a copy of an official release from the UK from, I think, the 80s.
It's as bad as you'd think, but as a Disney fan I wanted the full picture of what I was being a fan of. The fact that they are only now planning to finally remove the Song of the South elements from the Splash Mountain ride at the parks says something.
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Post by Prince Hal on Mar 8, 2021 10:42:53 GMT -5
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 8, 2021 10:51:00 GMT -5
Leaving aside the race issues, Song of the South is an objectively bad film. It's 95 minutes of tedium sporadically interrupted by some decent, but uninspired, Disney cartoons and one catchy song.
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Post by impulse on Mar 8, 2021 10:57:52 GMT -5
Everyone is up in arms about whether or not to cancel Dr. Seuss for outdated and racist content when it's just as easy to say they should be cancelled because they are terrible. Have you tried reading Green Eggs and Ham to a kid recently? I'd rather help them math homework.
There, I said it, and I'm kidding (mostly). And I know that at least some of them are actually really good for teaching kids to read. Still not as bad as Go Dog Go.
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Post by Prince Hal on Mar 8, 2021 11:00:11 GMT -5
Everyone is up in arms about whether or not to cancel Dr. Seuss for outdated and racist content when it's just as easy to say they should be cancelled because they are terrible. Have you tried reading Green Eggs and Ham to a kid recently? I'd rather help them math homework. There, I said it, and I'm kidding (mostly). And I know that at least some of them are actually really good for teaching kids to read. Still not as bad as Go Dog Go. Among the great crimes perpetrated against humanity is the musical "Seussical." |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 8, 2021 11:16:41 GMT -5
I'm sick to death of hearing that "Dr. Seuss has been canceled" when that is absolutely not the case. The entire "cancel culture" argument is as intellectually flaccid as "political correctness" was in its day. And almost always as disingenuous.
There, I said it.
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Post by Cei-U! on Mar 8, 2021 11:30:32 GMT -5
(...) Like I said, Dr Seuss Entertainment has decided to remove them which is their right; but, I think the specific book, To Think That I Saw It on Mulberry Street, is so big a part of Dr Seuss' history that it would seem a better to idea to use it as a learning tool, than try to erase it. The others I don't think are as significant and won't be greatly missed. (...) I'd contest that claim; personally, I've always thought both McElligot's Pool and, especially, On Beyond Zebra are way better than Mulberry Street. On Beyond Zebra was my favorite Seuss book as a wee'n, but I haven't read it in 55 years or so. I understand why they're allowing these books to go out of print. I think a disclaimer about context and maybe a parental warning on the covers would be better, but I get it.
Cei-U! I summon the childhood favorite!
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 8, 2021 11:35:40 GMT -5
(...) Like I said, Dr Seuss Entertainment has decided to remove them which is their right; but, I think the specific book, To Think That I Saw It on Mulberry Street, is so big a part of Dr Seuss' history that it would seem a better to idea to use it as a learning tool, than try to erase it. The others I don't think are as significant and won't be greatly missed. (...) I'd contest that claim; personally, I've always thought both McElligot's Pool and, especially, On Beyond Zebra are way better than Mulberry Street. You may personally like them, but all six were among the ten worst selling Seuss books. The Cat's Quizzer sold a whopping two copies last year. Mulberry Street was the best seller of the six selling about 600 copies a year. Most of the other sold under 300 copies a year. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Mar 8, 2021 11:57:30 GMT -5
(...) Like I said, Dr Seuss Entertainment has decided to remove them which is their right; but, I think the specific book, To Think That I Saw It on Mulberry Street, is so big a part of Dr Seuss' history that it would seem a better to idea to use it as a learning tool, than try to erase it. The others I don't think are as significant and won't be greatly missed. (...) I'd contest that claim; personally, I've always thought both McElligot's Pool and, especially, On Beyond Zebra are way better than Mulberry Street. Not referring to quality but to the sales I saw as a bookseller. Really, none of those titles were even close to the Seuss top sellers, which is probably a factor in the owners deciding to pull them, rather than alter them. If we were talking Cat in the Hat or the Grinch, it would probably be a different story. |
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Post by impulse on Mar 8, 2021 12:06:19 GMT -5
It makes sense that a company would not want to spend money producing and distributing books that no one buys that contain outdated and controversial material that could land them bad PR.
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Post by EdoBosnar on Mar 8, 2021 12:43:26 GMT -5
I'd contest that claim; personally, I've always thought both McElligot's Pool and, especially, On Beyond Zebra are way better than Mulberry Street. On Beyond Zebra was my favorite Seuss book as a wee'n, but I haven't read it in 55 years or so. I understand why they're allowing these books to go out of print. I think a disclaimer about context and maybe a parental warning on the covers would be better, but I get it.
Cei-U! I summon the childhood favorite!
I last read it a few years ago - I've got several of his books on my shelf, including Green Eggs and Ham, and I occasionally read them. They're fun little books and I love the illustrations. (And, although it's not by Seuss, I love Go Dog Go, too.)
That said, I agree with you (and several others here) about letting them go out of print due to concerns about objectionable or potentially objectionable content. I'm not even sure the disclaimer/content warning route would be an entirely feasible or workable solution.
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Post by impulse on Mar 8, 2021 12:59:25 GMT -5
On Beyond Zebra was my favorite Seuss book as a wee'n, but I haven't read it in 55 years or so. I understand why they're allowing these books to go out of print. I think a disclaimer about context and maybe a parental warning on the covers would be better, but I get it. Cei-U! I summon the childhood favorite!
I last read it a few years ago - I've got several of his books on my shelf, including Green Eggs and Ham, and I occasionally read them. They're fun little books and I love the illustrations. (And, although it's not by Seuss, I love Go Dog Go, too.) That said, I agree with you (and several others here) about letting them go out of print due to concerns about objectionable or potentially objectionable content. I'm not even sure the disclaimer/content warning route would be an entirely feasible or workable solution.
You're a stronger person than me. I loathe Go, Dog, Go. We "misplaced" our copy so our toddler would stop asking us to read it. And yeah, I think the disclaimered version would have to be an exclusive or special-order only thing targeted at educational yes. I doubt there would be much interest in just stocking it at Barnes and Noble. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Mar 8, 2021 13:41:21 GMT -5
Everyone is up in arms about whether or not to cancel Dr. Seuss for outdated and racist content when it's just as easy to say they should be cancelled because they are terrible. Have you tried reading Green Eggs and Ham to a kid recently? I'd rather help them math homework. I don't think people are reacting to some of Dr. Seuss's low-selling books being cancelled so much as to the self-serving virtue-signalling of the publishers. The latter's self-censorship, well intentioned as it might be, also reinforces the concept that people may be hurt by being exposed to a caricature in a children's book from sixty years ago, a concept that many people find patronizing. Warning: this episode of Star Trek includes scenes in which a character is being made fun of because he has green blood. Parental discretion is advised. |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 8, 2021 14:10:51 GMT -5
Everyone is up in arms about whether or not to cancel Dr. Seuss for outdated and racist content when it's just as easy to say they should be cancelled because they are terrible. Have you tried reading Green Eggs and Ham to a kid recently? I'd rather help them math homework. I don't think people are reacting to some of Dr. Seuss's low-selling books being cancelled so much as to the self-serving virtue-signalling of the publishers. The latter's self-censorship, well intentioned as it might be, also reinforces the concept that people may be hurt by being exposed to a caricature in a children's book from sixty years ago, a concept that many people find patronizing.Warning: this episode of Star Trek includes scenes in which a character is being made fun of because he has green blood. Parental discretion is advised. Are we now taking polls about what feelings people are allowed to have? Who gives a hairy rat's ass what people may find patronizing? I'm not an Asian-American. I haven't ever had to look at caricatures of bright yellow people in Coolie hats and have to explain to my children why people who look like them were objects of ridicule, so ultimately it's not my business to decide if they should be offended. It's more than possible that what you call "virtue-signaling" is in fact simply choosing not to continue to be assholes. I guess I'll worry about people with green blood when they actually exist. Until then it remains a sad strawman. |
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Post by impulse on Mar 8, 2021 14:25:55 GMT -5
It's probably just pure, self-interested capitalism. Too high a risk for too little return to keep publishing books with offensive portrayals that no one is buying anyway. From their standpoint, it seems like a no brainer.
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