Søren
Full Member
I trademarked my name two years ago. Swore I'd kill any turniphead that tried to use it
Posts: 321
|
Post by Søren on Jul 29, 2018 5:38:34 GMT -5
Don't have kids but if I did I would get them vaccinated. There is no reason not to as no link between something like the MMR and autism which seems to be what many are worried about also not getting it done puts all kids at risk
|
|
|
Post by DE Sinclair on Jul 29, 2018 9:10:54 GMT -5
For those who have children, did you or are you going to make the decision to vaccinate your children? For MMR for instance? I'm not here to make any judgments or anything. My wife is actually at a crossroads in regards to this it seems, and has gone far down the rabbit hole. Me personally, I'm not. I like the vibe of this place and the overall demographic here compared to most other communities I frequent online. So I want to hear your insight about this topic. Thanks in advance. Yes my daughter was vaccinated. The objections against it have been debunked thoroughly and repeatedly. The risks of the diseases are far greater both to the child who needs to be vaccinated, and the general public who is put at risk by those not vaccinated.
|
|
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Jul 29, 2018 9:15:40 GMT -5
For those who have children, did you or are you going to make the decision to vaccinate your children? For MMR for instance? I'm not here to make any judgments or anything. My wife is actually at a crossroads in regards to this it seems, and has gone far down the rabbit hole. Me personally, I'm not. I like the vibe of this place and the overall demographic here compared to most other communities I frequent online. So I want to hear your insight about this topic. Thanks in advance. Meaning no disrespect, but people (like Gwyneth Paltrow) who argue that vaccines might pause a problem are the equivalent, scientifically speaking, of flat earthers. There is no scientific debate on the matter. None whatsoever. Any argument to the contrary comes exclusively from conspiracy theorists who keep bringing back a certain paper published by Andrew Wakefield years ago, a Lancet paper that was (a) based on mostly fake data, (b) financially motivated, as Wakefield was paid by a law firm to produce “scientific results” that would help a certain collective suit against a pharmaceutical company, (c) later retracted, (d) caused Wakefield to lose his license to practice, due to his gross scientific misbehaviour. There is no link between vaccination and autism, as loudly proclaimed by every official autism association, who all insist on the importance of vaccinating kids. Vaccination has eliminated the scourge of smallpox. It could soon eliminate the scourge of polio for good. It saves millions of children annually from diseases like mumps and scarlet fever, diseases that don’t sound as scary as the above two but would still lead to thousands of deaths or severe neurological conditions otherwise. It may soon stop Evola fever. I’m a molecular biologist, so I'm not just repeating the official position... I can vouch that vaccination triggers our immune system the same way it is triggered by a disease, but without the risk of actually becoming ill. Unlike what Paltrow might say, there is nothing artificial or unnatural about the way vaccination works; its positive effects are no more unnatural than the effects of regular exercise at the gym is unnatural when it gives us stronger muscles. So by all means, yes, get your kids vaccinated! Why should they be at risk of developing a dangerous disease when it can be easily avoided?
|
|
|
Post by BigPapaJoe on Jul 29, 2018 9:56:29 GMT -5
My wife wanted me to check out a Facebook group to challenge my views about the entire thing. It has over 100,000 members, and seems very...adamant about it's policy of not encouraging different viewpoints. Here is the DM I got from someone that approved me:
I am about to approve your request to join the Vaccination Re-education Discussion Forum. I want to commend you for doing what you feel is best for your family and/or community by participating in the vaccine programs. The very fact that you want to join the group indicates to me that you have an open mind and want to make sure that you have complete information before making important decisions about health and well-being.
After more than half a century aggressive marketing of vaccinations, it has been very easy for so many people to trust them. However, in this day of information and Technology, some of the very ugly underbelly of the vaccine agenda is being exposed. My recommendation to you is to think about the possible motivation that millions of people who are against vaccinations would have to so aggressively fight against them. Thousands of physicians have given up a great deal of money because they can no longer support the vaccination agenda. Hundreds of physicians have faced being black-balled by their industry by being, vocal about their grave concerns about the vaccination program. There have been hundreds and hundreds of studies proving that vaccinations are extraordinarily dangerous in comparison to allowing natural immunity to handle childhood and other illnesses. It's always good to think critically and follow the money when doing so!
Our experience has revealed that most people and physicians do not even know that vaccinations do not have to undergo normal safety testing as individual vaccinations or as vaccinations grouped all together. They also are not aware that there is zero legal liability for any vaccine manufacturer or administrator to face, even when the vaccination is administered in error, in opposition to the recommended method of administration, or with reckless disregard to the current health of the individual that receives the vaccination.
Please feel free to ask any questions that you want in the group, but understand that pushing pro-vaccination propaganda will not be acceptable.
We have four sister groups that are affiliated with our group that are all public and very valuable and telling the vaccine story. I highly recommend you browse through some of the posts on these pages to get a picture of the empirical evidence against vaccinations. I'm also going to recommend that you watch this cute little YouTube video to give you an idea of how the big bad scary measles were thought of before there were vaccinations to sell. All of the links and explanations are below!
The first page is dedicated to sharing the stories of diseases that are typically referred to as vaccine "preventable" illnesses that you or someone close to you have experienced, such as a bout with chicken pox or pertussis. This is an excellent resource to help people know what these diseases that are often referred to as deadly look like. When someone says "I'd rather my child have autism than have to suffer through measles," they clearly misunderstand what measles is. (https://www.facebook.com/groups/VaccinePreventableIllnessStories/)
One of our most powerful groups tells about vaccine injury stories that others have experienced. This is an excellence reference tool for someone who still believes that the chances of vaccine injury are in the one in a million range. (Spoiler alert, they're not!)
(https://www.facebook.com/groups/VaccineInjuryStories/).
A page that is excellent for reading articles, watching videos, learning of legislative matters across the globe, and accessing common sense information about vaccinations is Vaccination/Immunization Common Sense (https://www.facebook.com/groups/VaccinationImmunizationCommonSense/).
Our final page is dedicated to the memory of those who have lost their lives to vaccines. Most of these were beautiful, healthy children who had been given a check up showing they were healthy and meeting or exceeding milestones immediately before their vaccinations which resulted in their death. (https://www.facebook.com/groups/VaccineMemorialPage/)
Welcome to our community!
The thing that made me apprehensive about even proceeding to read anything else is that this is a place for only looking at one side of the coin. Seems that any subject in the world like 9/11, JFK, or vaccinations people will go leaps and bounds to push something that hasn't been universally accepted as truth.
|
|
|
Post by hondobrode on Jul 29, 2018 10:26:32 GMT -5
Father of four and I wouldn't dream of not having my kids vaccinated.
Nothing in life is perfect, but, it's the far better choice than not.
|
|
Søren
Full Member
I trademarked my name two years ago. Swore I'd kill any turniphead that tried to use it
Posts: 321
|
Post by Søren on Jul 29, 2018 10:53:11 GMT -5
I wouldn't trust a facebook group as my source of info, would trust even less a Facebook group of possible grieving parents looking for any answers other then what the doctors told them and they can't accept. With any medical thing there is chance of it going wrong
Like the Birthday Paradox, only need small number and can prove you point to those who want to believe it when really it just statistics.
|
|
|
Post by Slam_Bradley on Jul 29, 2018 11:52:45 GMT -5
The first page is dedicated to sharing the stories of diseases that are typically referred to as vaccine "preventable" illnesses that you or someone close to you have experienced, such as a bout with chicken pox or pertussis. This is an excellent resource to help people know what these diseases that are often referred to as deadly look like. When someone says "I'd rather my child have autism than have to suffer through measles," they clearly misunderstand what measles is. (https://www.facebook.com/groups/VaccinePreventableIllnessStories/) This is pure propaganda. Do people really believe that The Donna Reed Show and Leave it to Beaver in any way represent reality? That's like saying Gilligan's Island is a primer for sailing. Or better yet...Hogan's Heroes as a statement about P.O.W. camps in Nazi Germany. The fact is that in the decade before 1963, when the measles vaccine became available nearly every child got the disease. Of those 400-500 died, 48,000 were hospitalized and 1,000 suffered encephalitis. That's from the Centers For Disease Control. That was just in the U.S. According to the World Health Organization 89,780 people died from measles world-wide in 2016 the first year measles deaths dropped below100,000. Meanwhile the "link" of vaccines to autism has been shown to be a hoax and was admitted as such by the perpetrator. I would go one better than Roquefort Raider. Anti-vaxxers are far worse than flat-Earthers. Flat-Earthers are generally harmless cranks who spread misinformation but aren't hurting anyone. Anti-vaxxers are actively making the world a more dangerous places and are allowing people to die through ignorance.
|
|
|
Post by Slam_Bradley on Jul 29, 2018 12:07:15 GMT -5
By way of further disclosure...besides my Dad surviving polio in the early 40s, I had the measles when I was a kid...probably somewhere around 1973-74. I've never been sicker in my life. I also had two good friends who had mumps in the early 70s...one of whom ended up sterile because of them.
Vaccines are important. They save lives.
|
|
|
Post by Prince Hal on Jul 29, 2018 12:10:07 GMT -5
With all of you here. Of course we had our kids vaccinated.
My wife's aunt suffered the after-effects of polio her entire life. She contracted it as a youngster in the late 1920s.
Oh, and like every other person my age, I had mumps, chicken pox and measles. Mumps left my brother-in-law sick unto death. Why would I take the chance that my kids would have to go through any of that? (They were a bit too old for the chicken pox vaccine, but never had any of the other childhood diseases that were de rigueur for my generation.)
Never any question.
This is just another 180 this society pulls with impudence:
Trump, bankrupter par excellence = business genius.
Less income tax collected = deficit reduction.
The Bible = science.
Credit cards = cash.
Celebrity = expertise.
Exercising free speech = treason.
Coincidence = causation.
Experts = fools.
One constant remains: most people = stupid.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2018 12:26:40 GMT -5
Robert Anton Wilson (co-author of the Illuminatus Trilogy) once said an expert is nothing more than an idiot in a room full of morons willing to listen to him and take him at his word. I used to scoff at this, believing that knowledge can provide a foundation for real expertise, but as I have gotten older and seen what is happening in the world around me, I realize he hit the nail on the head. All it takes to be an expert is a group of people foolish enough to be willing to listen to you and take you at your word no matter what kind of bullshit you spout. Facts and evidence are an anathema to expertise, not the foundation for it.
-M
|
|
|
Post by The Captain on Jul 29, 2018 12:27:22 GMT -5
Two kids here, and there was never a second where we considered not vaccinating them against all of the biggies. I was on the fence about the HPV vaccine for a little while for my older daughter, but my sister, who is an ob/gyn, explained everything about it to me and I was fine with it after that.
|
|
|
Post by The Captain on Jul 29, 2018 12:34:23 GMT -5
Robert Anton Wilson (co-author of the Illuminatus Trilogy) once said an expert is nothing more than an idiot in a room full of morons willing to listen to him and take him at his word. I used to scoff at this, believing that knowledge can provide a foundation for real expertise, but as I have gotten older and seen what is happening in the world around me, I realize he hit the nail on the head. All it takes to be an expert is a group of people foolish enough to be willing to listen to you and take you at your word no matter what kind of bullshit you spout. Facts and evidence are an anathema to expertise, not the foundation for it. -M I had a job coach once encourage me to put "Supply Chain Expert" on my resume back when I was laid off two years ago, based on my decade-plus of being in that field. I told them I would only put "Experienced Supply Chain Professional", because the majority of people who identify themselves as "experts" in anything are self-aggrandizing prats. For some reason unknown to me at the time, they stopped working with me, until I saw their LinkedIn profile that read "Career Guidance Expert" and it all became clear.
|
|
|
Post by Slam_Bradley on Jul 29, 2018 12:36:21 GMT -5
Robert Anton Wilson (co-author of the Illuminatus Trilogy) once said an expert is nothing more than an idiot in a room full of morons willing to listen to him and take him at his word. I used to scoff at this, believing that knowledge can provide a foundation for real expertise, but as I have gotten older and seen what is happening in the world around me, I realize he hit the nail on the head. All it takes to be an expert is a group of people foolish enough to be willing to listen to you and take you at your word no matter what kind of bullshit you spout. Facts and evidence are an anathema to expertise, not the foundation for it. -M My Dad used to define an expert as follows...an ex is a has-been and a spurt is a drip under pressure. Now he was being facetious. But there's a germ of truth in there. There are far too many "talking heads" whose expertise lies not in actual knowledge but in them having a platform to spout their alleged information.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2018 12:43:50 GMT -5
"I am the wisest man alive, for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing." -Socrates
-M
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,069
|
Post by Confessor on Jul 29, 2018 13:04:42 GMT -5
For those who have children, did you or are you going to make the decision to vaccinate your children? For MMR for instance? I'm not here to make any judgments or anything. My wife is actually at a crossroads in regards to this it seems, and has gone far down the rabbit hole. Me personally, I'm not. I like the vibe of this place and the overall demographic here compared to most other communities I frequent online. So I want to hear your insight about this topic. Thanks in advance. Yes my children were vaccinated. There is no reason on Earth not to have them vaccinated. My father was lucky to be a polio survivor. Anti-vaxxers are a menace. Can't put it any better than Slam. I don't have kids, but if I did, I'd sure as hell get them vaccinated. I even have my cat (who is basically mine and my wife's "fur baby") vaccinated. There's absolutely no reason not to have your kids vaccinated. The benefits far out-weigh the risks. Besides, the absolute worst that can happen is your child has an anaphylactic reaction, which is extremely rare -- less than 1 in a million, actually -- and these reactions are completely reversible anyway, with prompt medical assistance. That claptrap about vaccines causing autism and whatnot is just a load of anti-scientific, "flat-earther" mumbo-jumbo, which is best forgotten about, if you've got half a brain. Edit: Of course, if you live in China, it might be wiser to be suspicious of your vaccines... www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-44920193
|
|