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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2018 5:26:40 GMT -5
Cute Kittens
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 20, 2018 6:17:24 GMT -5
Jian Ghomeshi used to be a famous radio personality in Canada. A few years ago, the public found out that he was into kinky, S&M-type sex. A few of his ex-partners accused him of going way too far, and although the court eventually found him not guilty, that was that for Ghomeshi’s career... his acting like a d*&# and his self-centered disregard for others as human beings had caught up with him, and he lost everything. The public’s respect, his job, and the ability to go outside without being pointed at. What comes around comes around.
A few days ago he wrote a piece for a New York publication, in which he details what it is like to fall from grace so brutally. I thought it was interesting; he explains how easy it is to let fame and power get to one’s head, to give in to one’s worst instincts and to become a total creep. It was also pretty scary to see how the court of public opinion works, and how his own actions are conflated with those of other people (actual criminals, like Paul Bernardo); how said court now wants him to pay forever and ever for his actions, both real and imagined.
The sad part is that this sort of self-pitying observation is spot on. Right after the publication of this short essay, Ghomeshi was once again attacked in the press and in social media... for daring to say anything. So was the New York Review of Books, where it was published, for giving exposure to a monster. And the editor who published the essay has apparently been shown the door. Because, you see, allowing an individual who has been found guilty by the Facebook and Instagrams of this world is unacceptable; they must never again be seen, heard or thought of. They must be forever hated, shunned and, most importantly, silenced. Their opinion does not matter; their version of events does not matter, and whoever might dare to give them a platform to say anything must by default be a monster too. (That, at least, is what the gist of most reactions to the essay that I read were saying).
I find such an attitude very worrying. Especially so since Ghomeshi’s essay was not a justification after the fact, nor an attempt to blame his victims, but an admission of guilt for letting success go to his head and make him believe that he could give in to his worst instincts. That’s a cautionary tale worth reading. It was also an indictment of a society where the scarlet letter of opprobrium, although not given for the same reasons as in Hawthorne’s book, is as damning as ever.
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Post by Rob Allen on Sept 20, 2018 11:41:45 GMT -5
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 20, 2018 16:37:59 GMT -5
That last piece is pretty much in the tone of others I’ve read. There is just no way Ghomeshi can say anything that will not be construed against him. Unlike Hockenberry, who spends a large part of his essay showing us what a wholesome guy he is, one who just made a few bad choices at a difficult time, Ghomeshi really accepts that he has behaved as a self-centered creep. I also enjoyed how he describes his old habits resurfacing when having a discussion with a lady who doesn’t know him; like a recovering alcoholic, he knows that he could easily fall off the wagon.
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Post by chadwilliam on Sept 20, 2018 19:18:02 GMT -5
Jian Ghomeshi used to be a famous radio personality in Canada. A few years ago, the public found out that he was into kinky, S&M-type sex. A few of his ex-partners accused him of going way too far, and although the court eventually found him not guilty, that was that for Ghomeshi’s career... his acting like a d*&# and his self-centered disregard for others as human beings had caught up with him, and he lost everything. The public’s respect, his job, and the ability to go outside without being pointed at. What comes around comes around. Actually, there was nothing kinky about what Ghomeshi was into - one of his victims was beaten with a belt, choked until near unconsciousness, and left with severe bruises along her body. Another victim recalled exchanging text messages/phone calls with Ghomeshi and then agreeing to show up at his house for a date. Here's how she put it: " I knocked on his door, he opened the door, and I was smiling, happy to see him, saying, 'Hello.' expected to maybe have a tour of his house, have a 'hello' from him, have something to eat, 'How was your flight?' normal conversations," she said.
Instead, "he pushed me against the wall immediately, started making out with me, and then he led me upstairs, told me to get on my knees, and then proceeded to hit me very hard across the head a few times to the point where I couldn’t see straight, my vision was blurred."
She says that's when Ghomeshi took off his belt, put it around her neck and started leading her around the bedroom and down the hall, "pulling really hard."
Then he removed the belt and started beating her on the back with it, she said.
She says she didn't say anything to Ghomeshi.
"I was in so much shock — and I’ve heard this from other women who are speaking as well — I did not know what to say. It totally threw me for a loop. I was speechless," she recalled.
The alleged incident, which she says lasted about 30 minutes, only ended after they ended up having intercourse, she said."
www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/jian-ghomeshi-allegedly-choked-beat-n-b-woman-with-belt-1.2818879When these details began to emerge Ghomeshi used his radio program to attempt to smear his victims and claim that they were lying. For a while, this worked. He was a popular and beloved radio personality and the women accusing him of rape/sexual assault/unwanted advances were regarded as "lying bitches". The CBC helped cover up for him, but had to fire him when Ghomeshi himself realizing that he was close to being outed as a violent rapist, attempted damage control by telling his bosses that he was simply a guy into weird, kinky sex. When he sat down and described what this meant, his bosses were appalled. Again, this isn't a guy who likes dress up and consensual spanking or whatever - this is a monster who punched women in the face, beat them with a belt, made them walk on all fours, and then forced them to have sex with him. Ghomeshi is a raping piece of shit who should be in prison. He had a soapbox at the CBC and used it to further attack the women he had beaten and raped. That soapbox is why his victims had to endure threats from the public and accusations of being whores. Ghomeshi doesn't deserve another one.
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Post by beccabear67 on Sept 20, 2018 19:28:05 GMT -5
I think he was trying to live out the rock star dream of excess mostly, without being capable of being one (how many can be), but I tended to only listen to or watch his interviews on Q if the subject was of major interest to me... he seemed a right sycophant to all the guests to the point of putting me off! So funny that in private he wanted to 'dominate' in such a clumsy way.
I think the NYT Review Of Books could have published a piece by Ghomeshi if it was tied in with a book and I wouldn't have any issue with it. Was that not the case? I heard the editor left but no more details, so perhaps his choice seemed salacious or sales motivated?
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Post by chadwilliam on Sept 20, 2018 19:38:45 GMT -5
And I really want to add and I hope it doesn't get lost in the anger I displayed above - none of my anger is meant to be directed at the original poster or anyone here. Part of my problem with Ghomeshi (if it isn't obvious from I wrote above) is how he manipulated people into thinking that he was just a normal, regular guy into odd stuff. By putting this statement out there, he managed for a time to be seen as a quirky guy being crucified for being quirky. I didn't know anything about the guy since I don't listen to CBC radio (well, I had heard about him since he did an interview with Billy Bob Thornton and his band where he singled him out for special attention when Thornton had previously requested that Ghomeshi focus on the whole band as equals and not simply his back-up guys which proved to be as controversial as Ghomeshi got) and when Ghomeshi presented himself as just a weird, lovable guy, I didn't know what to make of what I was reading. Of course, as a Canadian, I heard a lot more details than I suspect most posters here did especially since the Cosby stuff broke around the same time. If it weren't for my being Canadian however, I would probably respond to the name Jian Ghomeshi today and think either "Who's that?" or "This guy can't be that big of a deal since I don't hear about him as much as Cosby or Weinstein (or even Asia Argento or whoever)".
So again - Ghomeshi is scum, but I don't fault anyone who might think he's some guy unfairly caught up political correct nonsense because I understand that outside of Canada, few people have heard the details that I read about daily for a while there.
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Post by beccabear67 on Sept 20, 2018 23:11:43 GMT -5
I have to admit I haven't followed things too closely, although naturally it was in the Canadian news a lot back then and again a bit now. On my list of people who get to feel persecuted or aggrieved over injustice he wouldn't even rate an honorable mention. Same with anyone at the CBC or elsewhere who chose to cover things up for him, or help in any way. You couldn't pay me enough to protect someone like that. I hope he doesn't gather any supporters in that sense. I am aware of some weird behavior in the music biz mostly in the past among some of the bigger names on stage and off... how consentual all of it was is open to some debate (see Kim Fowley and Runaways member Jackie Fox, also British personality/DJ Jimmy Saville). These people bring their very messed-up selves into the world and their relationships along with any talents and one does not entirely eclipse the other either way.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,069
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Post by Confessor on Sept 21, 2018 1:03:58 GMT -5
I am aware of some weird behavior in the music biz mostly in the past among some of the bigger names on stage and off... how consentual all of it was is open to some debate (see ... DJ Jimmy Saville). Woah, woah, woah! Jimmy Savile was not just some guy into weird stuff, which may or may not have been consensual. The guy was one of Britain's most prolific predatory sex offenders and paedophiles. Though there had been some accusations against him during his lifetime, the Police received around 450 claims of assault against Savile after he died -- an unprecedented volume of such accusations in Britain. The authorities estimate that he sexually assaulted at least 300 people aged between 5 to 75 (and nearly 100 of those were under 16), and many were ill or mentally infirm. Then there's all that time he insisted in being left alone with the corpses in the morgue at Leeds general infirmary and what he might've been getting up to with the bodies in there... [[[shudder!]]]. Savile used his fame to gain access to and prey upon hundreds of the most vulnerable people in our society. He was not just some eccentric radio personality with weird sexual kinks. The man was a f***ing monster.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 21, 2018 5:19:08 GMT -5
So again - Ghomeshi is scum, but I don't fault anyone who might think he's some guy unfairly caught up political correct nonsense because I understand that outside of Canada, few people have heard the details that I read about daily for a while there. In case it wasn’t clear above : at no time did I express the idea that Ghomeshi might be a regular bloke caught up in PC nonsense. He is by his own admission someone who enjoys S&M sex, and who treated his partners as so much meat to be enjoyed. He’s the kind of entitled dude who made his bed and now has to lie in it. My point is that despite not having been found guilty of anything, despite having been shown to have acted in a despicable manner but not having committed any crime, Ghomeshi is now seen as so toxic by a certain press that anyone who dares give him the opportunity to say anything is seen guilty by association as an enabler of some kind. That might hold water if Ghomeshi’s essay was a justification for his actions, but that’s not what it was; it was the testimony of a successful guy whose power gave him the impression that he was free to act as he wished, with no regard to anyone else’s dignity, and who now says he realizes how creepy that was and how easy it would be to be a creep again. The piece in and of itself was perfectly appropriate, and in no way deserving of the outrage storm it generated. Were people writing scathing opinion pieces on Ghomeshi’s behaviour, I couldn’t care less. But they’re mostly about how inappropriate it is for him to dare say anything, and for someone else to let him say anything. That is too close to mob-dictated censorship for my taste. I dislike trials by Facebook. If people don’t believe him, fine; but how can readers make an opinion for themselves if he can’t write anything in the first place?
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Post by The Captain on Sept 21, 2018 7:38:12 GMT -5
Today is a freeing day for my wife and me, as we made the final payment on her student loan yesterday and are now out from under that burden. We were blessed to be able to make advance payments (which we were also doing weekly, to help mitigate the compounding interest), so we paid these off about 9 years ahead of schedule.
It's going to be nice to have the extra money not being tied up in that area, and we sat down last night to game-plan our next move. Looking forward to what is in store next.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 9:04:12 GMT -5
Today is a freeing day for my wife and me, as we made the final payment on her student loan yesterday and are now out from under that burden. We were blessed to be able to make advance payments (which we were also doing weekly, to help mitigate the compounding interest), so we paid these off about 9 years ahead of schedule. It's going to be nice to have the extra money not being tied up in that area, and we sat down last night to game-plan our next move. Looking forward to what is in store next. I would used the "extra money" to pay off your mortgage and/or save that money for a special vacation for you and your wife. And, one more thing ... congratulations on getting that Student Loan paid off -- you are a smart man paying it on a weekly basis to cut down the compound interest. Nice Going ...
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Post by The Captain on Sept 21, 2018 9:21:09 GMT -5
Today is a freeing day for my wife and me, as we made the final payment on her student loan yesterday and are now out from under that burden. We were blessed to be able to make advance payments (which we were also doing weekly, to help mitigate the compounding interest), so we paid these off about 9 years ahead of schedule. It's going to be nice to have the extra money not being tied up in that area, and we sat down last night to game-plan our next move. Looking forward to what is in store next. I would used the "extra money" to pay off your mortgage and/or save that money for a special vacation for you and your wife. And, one more thing ... congratulations on getting that Student Loan paid off -- you are a smart man paying it on a weekly basis to cut down the compound interest. Nice Going ... We're actually going to put the extra money into our retirement accounts. Paying off the mortgage sounds like a good idea, except you tie up your money in an asset that becomes untouchable once the mortgage is closed, so you can be asset rich and cash poor. As well, losing the tax deduction for the mortgage interest is a bad idea now, as we no longer have the interest deduction for the student loans. The interest rate on our mortgage is so low that we will easily exceed that in gains on our investments, and as it is our goal to retire by 62 (preferably 60), we want to take advantage of the compound interest over a longer period of time rather than only being able to tap the equity in the house by selling it (which we plan to do anyway once our girls move out). We do also plan to travel a little more, with the goal next year to get to Wales. As you may be able to guess, one of my hobbies is personal financial management, so much so that I have toyed with the idea of becoming a consultant on the side to help people with their own situations, particularly younger married couples who are just starting out and who have little idea of how to get their finances in order.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 9:25:35 GMT -5
That's even better putting that money into retirement accounts -- The Captain, and that's a very wise decision ...
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Post by beccabear67 on Sept 21, 2018 12:15:22 GMT -5
the Police received around 450 claims of assault against Savile after he died -- an unprecedented volume of such accusations in Britain. The authorities estimate that he sexually assaulted at least 300 people aged between 5 to 75 (and nearly 100 of those were under 16), and many were ill or mentally infirm. Yikes, I knew it was bad but... yikes! I meant to use those examples as obviously not debatable for whatever that's worth, sometimes my intent doesn't come across as I think it will though. I don't understand stuff like that in the least, I don't know why human beings can think of never mind go anywhere near doing some of the things we do. The closest I can get is that the middle sized monkey was 'done unto' and passes it on to a littler monkey, but some stuff falls way way way outside anything like that. I'm old enough to know how it was when nobody talked about such things and so most people could think it didn't happen. Reminds me of that John Fogerty song 'Don't You Wish It Were True'. I wish we could go back to the safe seeming world we thought we once had, or some of us fortunate people thought we had (I never quite had it as someone 'went off' on me once when I was five and it took twenty years to be able to break through to say anything and get set up with the local assault center for counseling, my hands still go a bit numb after all this time to type much about it).
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