|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 13, 2017 13:41:52 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Feb 14, 2017 3:00:29 GMT -5
Here's a double take with a twist. I'd like to hear what anyone thinks of these two songs, their relative merits, the relationship (if any) between the two, etc:
Even though I'm probably a bigger Beatles fan than I am Dylan fan, I have to admit I like the Dylan song better of the two. Apologies for the bad sound - only youtube I could find of it
|
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 14, 2017 4:09:58 GMT -5
A very interesting juxtaposition which I've never thought about. John Lennon's Norwegian Wood came first, in 1965, and was obviously Dylan influenced since the lyrics rather than the music carried the song. The 1966 4th Time Around by Dylan has a very similar melody and lyric structure. Those last lines ("I never asked for your crutch / Now don't ask for mine.") could very well be a pointed jab at Lennon on songwriting.
Well played Berkley
The YouTube of Norwegian Wood is blocked on my end. Seems the rights for it does not carry over to the U.S. or so it says
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,197 
|
Post by Confessor on Feb 14, 2017 5:01:53 GMT -5
The similarities between Norwegian Wood and 4th Time Around have been fairly well documented, and I think at the very least Dylan definitely copped the Beatles' melody in a deliberate fashion. Not necessarily in a loaded manner though, maybe just as a good natured nod or homage. On the other hand, perhaps there were veiled messages to the Beatles in that song -- Lennon certainly thought so from interviews of his that I've read. That could just be Lennon's paranoia though.
|
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 14, 2017 5:17:07 GMT -5
Obviously, the nastiest back-and-forth between 2 artists in songs was Lynyrd Skynryd's reply to Neil Young's Southern Man in Sweet Home Alabama
Well I heard Mister Young sing about her
Well I heard ole Neil put her down
Well, I hope Neil Young will remember
A southern man don't need him around anyhow
And of course John Lennon's put-down of Paul McCartney in How Do You Sleep At Night
You live with straights who tell you, you was king
Jump when your momma tell you anything
The only thing you done was yesterday
And since you're gone you're just another day
Any other examples of bitter feuding? Hip Hop got plenty of that but it's a genre I generally don't follow
|
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 15, 2017 3:33:23 GMT -5
50 Years Ago Today- Week 3 February 1967
For the first time this year, the reigning champ changes hand. Every inhabitant by this time owned a copy of The Monkee's I'm A Believer so after 8 straight weeks at #1 it plummeted to the 2nd spot on the Top 40. Taking it's place was
There were plenty of heavy hitters climbing the charts at this time. The Beatles, The Rolling Stones and The Supremes had all released new singles. How long could those Buckingham's fend them off? Meanwhile there was a bunch of quite interesting tunes scattered throughout the Top 40. Plenty of diversity such as this classic jazz piece from a favorite of mine at the #16 spot. The Buckinghams obviously liked it too since they would shortly add lyrics and release their version of the song, scoring another hit.
The Seeds were a proto-acid rock band and an early influence on punk rock. #38 this week
Jimmy Castor already had a big hit with his "Do You Wanna Be Happy For The Rest Of Your Life". He's back again with 'Hey Leroy, Your Mama's Callin' You". #31
We'll conclude for the week with #20, the great Marvin Gaye teamed up with Kim Weston
|
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Feb 16, 2017 0:49:37 GMT -5
The similarities between Norwegian Wood and 4th Time Around have been fairly well documented, and I think at the very least Dylan definitely copped the Beatles' melody in a deliberate fashion. Not necessarily in a loaded manner though, maybe just as a good natured nod or homage. On the other hand, perhaps there were veiled messages to the Beatles in that song -- Lennon certainly thought so from interviews of his that I've read. That could just be Lennon's paranoia though. One thing I wonder about is the title of the Dylan song: did he mean that there are 4 songs in total that are variations on the same tune? If so, what are the other two? The funny thing is, I don't think Norwegian Wood is a particularly Dylanesque song, so I don't see why Dylan would choose it as the one to comment on if he really did mean 4th Time Around as a mild rebuff to Lennon. Hey You've Got to Hide Your Love Away is the Beatles song that strikes me as most obviously an effort to emulate Dylan's sound a bit. |
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Feb 16, 2017 0:57:15 GMT -5
Haven't heard that Mercy Mercy Mercy for years - and I don't think I ever did know who the artist was. Nice pick, and yes, an excellent illustration of the wide range of musical genres represented on the pop charts at the time. Look at the album charts Ish posted for 11th Feb 1967: alongside the Monkees and the Stones you had Sinatra and the Doctor Zhivago soundtrack. Herb Alpert had three albums in the Top 20!
|
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 16, 2017 3:31:40 GMT -5
1967- When Band Names Got Weird
Prior to 1967, generally speaking, names for bands were simple or rather bland and safe. The Beach Boys, The Four Seasons, The Four Tops. OK guess there are 4 in the group. Got plenty of variations of Joe Schmo and His Schmo-Men. And honestly speaking, The Beatles using the word Beat was only slightly humorous. But around 1967, names started getting pretty inventive. Probably the drugs but once it started new bands jumped on the trend
Here's my quick A-Z list of favorite names by letter for performers from the 1960's. I reserve the right to change my mind tomorrow
13th Floor Elevators
Allman Joys
Bloodwyn Pig or Bubble Puppy
Crazy World Of Arthur Brown
Dixie Cups
Electric Prunes
Flamin Groovies
Grateful Dead
Humble Pie
Iron Butterfly
Jefferson Airplane
King Crimson
Lovin' Spoonful
Moby Grape
Napoleon XIV
Ohio Express
Pink Floyd
Quicksilver Messenger Service
Rare Earth
Strawberry Alarm Clock
Troggs
Unit 4 + 2
Vanilla Fudge
Who
Youngbloods
Zombies
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,197
|
Post by Confessor on Feb 16, 2017 3:43:18 GMT -5
An awful lot of those bands you've listed were going by those names well before 1967. I do agree that '67 was the year that a lot of bands with weirder, drug induced names burst into the mainstream, but some of those in that list aren't great examples of that phenomena.
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,197
|
Post by Confessor on Feb 16, 2017 4:05:59 GMT -5
The similarities between Norwegian Wood and 4th Time Around have been fairly well documented, and I think at the very least Dylan definitely copped the Beatles' melody in a deliberate fashion. Not necessarily in a loaded manner though, maybe just as a good natured nod or homage. On the other hand, perhaps there were veiled messages to the Beatles in that song -- Lennon certainly thought so from interviews of his that I've read. That could just be Lennon's paranoia though. One thing I wonder about is the title of the Dylan song: did he mean that there are 4 songs in total that are variations on the same tune? If so, what are the other two? The funny thing is, I don't think Norwegian Wood is a particularly Dylanesque song, so I don't see why Dylan would choose it as the one to comment on if he really did mean 4th Time Around as a mild rebuff to Lennon. Hey You've Got to Hide Your Love Away is the Beatles song that strikes me as most obviously an effort to emulate Dylan's sound a bit. If "4th Time Around" is indeed aimed at John Lennon and the Beatles, I've always thought that the number 4 in its title was probably just a characteristically oblique reference by Bob Dylan to there being four members of the Beatles. Not that there were four songs on a similar theme. I also have to say that I personally think "Norwegian Wood" is very Dylanesque. Not just in its folky melody and folk music style 3/4 time signature, but in the poetic ambiguity of its lyric. Lennon was attempting to write about an affair he'd had, while simultaneously hiding it from his wife Cynthia, and he chose Dylan's ambiguous lyric style as a device with which to accomplish this. The addition of George Harrison's sitar gives the finished track an exotic, raga rock ambiance that is nothing like Dylan's music, but the basic chords and lyrics of the song are definitely heavily indebted to Dylan. I agree that "You've Got To Hide Your Love Away" is also heavily influenced by Dylan, but the first song that Lennon wrote in which he was consciously influenced by Dylan was "I'm a Loser" from Beatles for Sale. |
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 16, 2017 4:07:41 GMT -5
An awful lot of those bands you've listed were going by those names well before 1967. I do agree that '67 was the year that a lot of bands with weirder, drug induced names burst into the mainstream, but some of those in that list aren't great examples of that phenomena. That's correct but perhaps I didn't phrase it clearly. My preamble was a generality. My list was favorite names during the entire decade in alphabetical order. |
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,197
|
Post by Confessor on Feb 16, 2017 4:09:47 GMT -5
An awful lot of those bands you've listed were going by those names well before 1967. I do agree that '67 was the year that a lot of bands with weirder, drug induced names burst into the mainstream, but some of those in that list aren't great examples of that phenomena. That's correct but perhaps I didn't phrase it clearly. My preamble was a generality. My list was favorite names during the entire decade in alphabetical order. Ah, right...gotcha. No West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band in your list though? For shame, for shame. |
|
|
|
Post by Ish Kabbible on Feb 16, 2017 4:17:18 GMT -5
That's correct but perhaps I didn't phrase it clearly. My preamble was a generality. My list was favorite names during the entire decade in alphabetical order. Ah, right...gotcha. No West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band in your list though? For shame, for shame. maybe tomorrow. I had to leave off some other favs like The Chocolate Watchband, Crazy Elephant, The Bonzo Dog Doo-Dah Band, Dr. Strangely Strange, Every Mother's Son, Frumious Bandersnatch, Sam The Sham And The Pharoahs and Spooky Tooth |
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Feb 16, 2017 4:53:29 GMT -5
I was about to comment that there was a whole subset of names like Iron Butterfly that contrasted heavy and light - Led Zeppelin being the most obvious - but just as I was about to type a bunch of other examples I found I couldn't think of any. Am I forgetting a bunch of obvious ones or were there really just those two? I suppose Vanilla Fudge contrasts light and dark, rather than light and heavy - and besides, there really is such a thing as vanilla fudge, so I don't think that name should count, even at a stretch.
|
|
