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Post by Phil Maurice on Oct 11, 2017 19:17:35 GMT -5
People are writing a lot here, but I think the characters that really last and capture the public have a clear, definitive image and personality that can be boiled down to a dozen words or less. Yes, I think that's a large part of it, being easily digestible and almost universally relatable. "Powers and abilities far beyond those of mortal men" is wish fulfillment distilled down to its very essence. That the bleak circumstances of Depression-era America produced these colorful characters who were interested mainly in righting perceived wrongs and championing the underclass, I think forever burnished them as Heroes with a capital "H."
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Post by chadwilliam on Oct 11, 2017 20:18:05 GMT -5
That the greatness of these characters stems not from their powers but an inner quality - a morality that isn't compromised by doubt or selfishness but driven by an absolute conviction that is directed towards doing the right thing in the broadest leaps possible. The sense comics conveyed that there is no evil in the world that can't be fought and defeated; that every corrupt politician, drunk driver, and gormless thug who got away with their activities in our world had a counterpart in another where they got their comeuppannce at the hands of a superhero. The way that every trap has its own built in escape if you only accept that you can see it. That these are perfect beings doing selfless things.
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Pat T
Full Member
Posts: 103
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Post by Pat T on Oct 11, 2017 21:46:23 GMT -5
I was first drawn to Spider-Man from reruns of the 60's cartoon when cable tv was new. The costume was (and is) so perfect and different from the only other superheroes I knew of back then, the Super Friends. To me, Superman and Batman seemed boring in comparison. I started reading ASM right after Harry became the Green Goblin for the first time, so I was right in the middle of Peter trying to get over Gwen and developing feelings for Mary Jane, when the Gwen clone showed up and blew everything up for Peter. At the same time, I was able to read reprints in Marvel Tales that featured Gwen while she was alive, so I was able to see what Peter had lost first-hand and sympathize with him. Considering I was 9-10 years old, the writing felt like I was reading something more "adult" than a comic book, and I liked that the series pretty much always dealt with themes other than Spidey beating up bank robbers all the time. I've always liked how Peter has used humor (although some writers were much better at it than others) particularly when it was self-aware. See, in my opinion, "Parker Luck" isn't what always kept Peter from achieving his potential; from the time he made the wrong choice with Uncle Ben's killer, he feels a responsibility above all else to do whatever he can in a situation,repercussions be damned. It's cost him in every way imaginable, and the times he has shirked his responsibility, it has always come back to bite him. Yet he soldiers on with whatever life throws at him and does what he can. I have to admit it's been a long time since I've seen him portrayed like this, but it's the core of the character. It's difficult to put into words what I'm trying to say, so I hope what I wrote makes sense.
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Post by batusi on Oct 12, 2017 12:22:39 GMT -5
For me, it's Adam West that brought Batman to life and saved the Batman Title from cancellation and to me, he's always be my Batman today and forever. I've met him 4 times in my life and he was kind, personable, and considerate to his fans. Christopher Reeve - embodied the spirit of Superman and once Superman the Movie came on - I dream that a man can fly and he brought that character to life in a Modern Spirit just like George Reeves years ago. He was perfect in everyway possible and that's made Superman great. With these two actors - Superman will always be my favorite hero. Lynda Carter as Wonder Woman - man, she fits the bill just spot on, perfect, and truly plays the part just magnificently and she made it very real to me. Too Bad, that they didn't make a Justice League Movie back then with Christopher Reeve and Lynda Carter headlining it; along with Adam West supporting it. It would be a dream to see these three making a JLA Movie back then ... it would be sight to see! Now that would have been a JLA movie to behold!!
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Post by Icctrombone on Oct 12, 2017 13:45:41 GMT -5
Of the three, only Christopher Reeve had acting ability.
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 12, 2017 17:19:39 GMT -5
Of the three, only Christopher Reeve had acting ability. I disagree. It takes a good actor to pull off the '66 Batman. Adam West never once lets us know that he's in on the joke, playing every scene with a conviction that makes it all hilarious. Lynda Carter, on the other hand, couldn't act her way out of a wet paper bag if you started a tear in it for her. Cei-U! I summon my critical faculties!
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Oct 17, 2017 15:06:33 GMT -5
It all depends on the time and place in your life as to what makes these spandex covered folk so great. For many it is that initial surge of adrenaline found upon your 1st exposure, whether it is in a cartoon, s comic book, a television show or a movie makes no difference. What creates such an impact is the visualization which is burned into your mind. You may find a personal connection with an individual character or feel you are a part of a greater whole or fill a void in your heart, mind or soul or just believe they are your personal friend in life. This is fantastic in a general and overall sense. True in every word. But who is it that gets into your soul? Is it the true goodness for the sake of good in Captain America? Is it the "bring the world together" of Superman (who although his catchphrase was Truth, Justice, and the American Way - loved all people). Is it the "I don't need to prove myself, I just need to be who I am" of Wonder Woman? Who is your inspiration? I was thinking about this thread and I was going to do a short, short essay on why characters were popular in the first place (Superman: Secret Identity + Sci-Fi trappings. Captain America: Simon & Kirby. Batman: Robin, and a decent design, but 90% Robin and we would not have a Batman today or in 1953 if it wasn't for the phenomenal popularity of Robin in his first appearances) but maybe this thread is more about characters that work for me, personally? Huh. My favorite characters tend to be those that don't have a lot of conflicting interpretations - and since every character becomes many different characters due to differences in creator POV and changing times, that means my favorites are those that don't have a lot of appearances. So is this the thread for a short essay on the greatness of Stegron the Dinosaur Man? I'm not quite sure that fits with Spider-Man and the Joker.
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 17, 2017 19:21:23 GMT -5
I was thinking about this thread and I was going to do a short, short essay on why characters were popular in the first place (Superman: Secret Identity + Sci-Fi trappings. Captain America: Simon & Kirby. Batman: Robin, and a decent design, but 90% Robin and we would not have a Batman today or in 1953 if it wasn't for the phenomenal popularity of Robin in his first appearances) but maybe this thread is more about characters that work for me, personally? Huh. My favorite characters tend to be those that don't have a lot of conflicting interpretations - and since every character becomes many different characters due to differences in creator POV and changing times, that means my favorites are those that don't have a lot of appearances. So is this the thread for a short essay on the greatness of Stegron the Dinosaur Man? I'm not quite sure that fits with Spider-Man and the Joker. It doesn't have to fit Spiderman or the Joker. Those are the characters (and I just mean superheroes) I picked because they are iconic. I'm more talking along the lines of comic book characters in general. You can pick up a book and read about anyone you want, but what is it about "comic" book characters that get into your soul? Not who is the most popular for the sake of the masses, but who is the most interesting, who is the most endearing, who is the one you pick up and read again and again and speaks to you specifically? And why are they they kind of character?
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 17, 2017 19:25:17 GMT -5
I disagree. It takes a good actor to pull off the '66 Batman. Adam West never once lets us know that he's in on the joke, playing every scene with a conviction that makes it all hilarious. Lynda Carter, on the other hand, couldn't act her way out of a wet paper bag if you started a tear in it for her. Cei-U! I summon my critical faculties! Cei-U...my soul has cried out in anguish and been suddenly silenced. Carter is the classic Wonder Woman...it was the writing for the show that did her in. But Adam West was the perfect camp Batman.
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 17, 2017 20:28:31 GMT -5
I disagree. It takes a good actor to pull off the '66 Batman. Adam West never once lets us know that he's in on the joke, playing every scene with a conviction that makes it all hilarious. Lynda Carter, on the other hand, couldn't act her way out of a wet paper bag if you started a tear in it for her. Cei-U! I summon my critical faculties! Cei-U...my soul has cried out in anguish and been suddenly silenced. Carter is the classic Wonder Woman...it was the writing for the show that did her in. But Adam West was the perfect camp Batman. Don't get me wrong, I love the show and I love her in it. But her other acting gigs are just embarrassing. For what it's worth, a friend of mine who worked with her says she's a very sweet and gracious lady. Cei-U! Am I forgiven just a little?
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 18, 2017 5:22:56 GMT -5
Cei-U...my soul has cried out in anguish and been suddenly silenced. Carter is the classic Wonder Woman...it was the writing for the show that did her in. But Adam West was the perfect camp Batman. Don't get me wrong, I love the show and I love her in it. But her other acting gigs are just embarrassing. For what it's worth, a friend of mine who worked with her says she's a very sweet and gracious lady. Cei-U! Am I forgiven just a little? Yes. Yes you are. I think the only other things I have seen her in are Sky High and Supergirl. But I have always loved her. She is amazingly beautiful and she always seemed like she would be a sweetheart. So yes. You are forgiven and my soul has been resurrected.
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Post by Dizzy D on Oct 19, 2017 11:27:27 GMT -5
Why do we love characters like Superman, Captain America, Wonder Woman, Wolverine, and Spiderman? What makes Magneto, Lex Luthor, and the Joker our go-to villains? What is it about these characters that make them so popular? Is it the writing, the illustrations, or their own make-up and characteristics? Good or bad. Villain or hero. Why do they deserve the popularity they have received? (This is by far a non-exhaustive list.) Superman: I always loved the concept more than the execution. The best Superman stories to me are the ones that don't have him as the main character and more how other people react to and behave around him. I do like his early Golden Age version: two Jewish guys imagining what they would do if they had the power to set the world right. Captain America: Never a fan, sorry. I think it's the Atlantic divide. Wonder Woman: I think I only run on Wonder Woman I completely read was the Azarello run, so let's say I don't have a firm grasp on here. I would like to read more of Marston's original comics (quite interested in the documentary about him coming up as well). Also would totally read a version of Wonder Woman drawn and written by Sejic. Magneto: More in my wheelhouse here. It's the combination between Claremont's man who has understable motives but wrong methods and Kirby's very strong design. That helmet will always be his best design point, people changed it a little over the years but the core visual concept is so strong. He also has superpowers that have been used in many creative ways, so a strong visual with interesting powers and an understandable motivation. The only weird thing is that Claremont chose this guy to be a holocaust survivor when he was basically just superpowered Nazi under Lee&Kirby (just look at the way he dresses his personal army in early X-Men). Lex Luthor: Lex has been all over the place over the years: the Golden Age crazy scientist, the bronze Age corrupt businessman, Hackman's conman, his current flawed hero, ... whatever Eisenberg was.. I think his pride and arrogance are the only real constant. Whatever he is, he won't accept that there is a Super(ior) Man. Joker: Not that fan of his newer incarnations (he's crazy, he's super-unpredictable! He has another plan where he releases poison gas while hiding out in an abandoned carnival), but the criminal prankster I always liked, puncturing Batman's self-seriousness, but losing his sense of humor once the joke is on him.
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 19, 2017 16:29:16 GMT -5
Why do we love characters like Superman, Captain America, Wonder Woman, Wolverine, and Spiderman? What makes Magneto, Lex Luthor, and the Joker our go-to villains? What is it about these characters that make them so popular? Is it the writing, the illustrations, or their own make-up and characteristics? Good or bad. Villain or hero. Why do they deserve the popularity they have received? (This is by far a non-exhaustive list.) Superman: I always loved the concept more than the execution. The best Superman stories to me are the ones that don't have him as the main character and more how other people react to and behave around him. I do like his early Golden Age version: two Jewish guys imagining what they would do if they had the power to set the world right. Captain America: Never a fan, sorry. I think it's the Atlantic divide. Wonder Woman: I think I only run on Wonder Woman I completely read was the Azarello run, so let's say I don't have a firm grasp on here. I would like to read more of Marston's original comics (quite interested in the documentary about him coming up as well). Also would totally read a version of Wonder Woman drawn and written by Sejic. Magneto: More in my wheelhouse here. It's the combination between Claremont's man who has understable motives but wrong methods and Kirby's very strong design. That helmet will always be his best design point, people changed it a little over the years but the core visual concept is so strong. He also has superpowers that have been used in many creative ways, so a strong visual with interesting powers and an understandable motivation. The only weird thing is that Claremont chose this guy to be a holocaust survivor when he was basically just superpowered Nazi under Lee&Kirby (just look at the way he dresses his personal army in early X-Men). Lex Luthor: Lex has been all over the place over the years: the Golden Age crazy scientist, the bronze Age corrupt businessman, Hackman's conman, his current flawed hero, ... whatever Eisenberg was.. I think his pride and arrogance are the only real constant. Whatever he is, he won't accept that there is a Super(ior) Man. Joker: Not that fan of his newer incarnations (he's crazy, he's super-unpredictable! He has another plan where he releases poison gas while hiding out in an abandoned carnival), but the criminal prankster I always liked, puncturing Batman's self-seriousness, but losing his sense of humor once the joke is on him. This is more of just an off the top of my head list than the scope of the idea. Who are your particular characters and what makes them great? They are popular to you...why should they be to us?
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