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Post by Outrajs on Oct 26, 2017 3:36:46 GMT -5
I'm going to guess that no one from the big two will ever stayed retired as long as the creative teams continue to change hands. It might happen in an Independent book. I mean , heck, they couldn't even keep Barry Allen and Bucky in the grave.  It's like a soap opera...no body? Great, they're not really dead! But wait...sometimes there IS a body and they're still not dead! Why does it seem like they are afraid to actually kill anyone off and keep them that way? |
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 26, 2017 3:38:09 GMT -5
Batgirl quit. Granted, she continued on as Oracle but one could argue that without the events of Killing Joke, Barbara Gordon could have remained a retired superhero. Coming back as another hero negates the whole "quit and never came back" part. |
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 26, 2017 3:44:50 GMT -5
Oh, they eventually tried to undo that grotesque decision by showing his wife was actually a Mr. Sinister construct (a demon-possessed one too, eventually), that Cyke was mentally manipulated by the evil Cameron Hodge, that he actually stayed oin New York for a very short time before going home again and blah blah blah. Typical awkward retcon of an undefensible, editorially mandated plot twist. Cyclops, the ultimate boy scout with starched underwear, would never have abandoned his wife and kid. That was character assassination, and I don’t hold it against him any more than I blame Peter Parker for striking his pregnant wife when Marvel tried to replace him with Ben Reilly. Such unforgiveable behaviour is not representative of who these characters are, and is attributable only to lousy decisions by misguided writers and editors. If it is explained that the recent soft reboot of the Marvel Universe got rid of that type of event, I won’t mind! Those kinds of "plot twists" make my heart hurt. And if his ex-wife was a construct, what about their kid? Look, people can make bad decisions (in real life or in comic books) and I think they should be able to move on...but seriously. Take the Hank Pym slap. Okay, was it a breakdown in communication between the writer and the illustrator? Was it intentionally scripted that way? Either way it happened, he should be able to move on once he has paid the price of the consequences. Cyclops should be able to have the same, but they never seem to have to deal with the repercussions of their actions. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Oct 26, 2017 6:05:44 GMT -5
Oh, they eventually tried to undo that grotesque decision by showing his wife was actually a Mr. Sinister construct (a demon-possessed one too, eventually), that Cyke was mentally manipulated by the evil Cameron Hodge, that he actually stayed oin New York for a very short time before going home again and blah blah blah. Typical awkward retcon of an undefensible, editorially mandated plot twist. Cyclops, the ultimate boy scout with starched underwear, would never have abandoned his wife and kid. That was character assassination, and I don’t hold it against him any more than I blame Peter Parker for striking his pregnant wife when Marvel tried to replace him with Ben Reilly. Such unforgiveable behaviour is not representative of who these characters are, and is attributable only to lousy decisions by misguided writers and editors. If it is explained that the recent soft reboot of the Marvel Universe got rid of that type of event, I won’t mind! Those kinds of "plot twists" make my heart hurt. And if his ex-wife was a construct, what about their kid? Look, people can make bad decisions (in real life or in comic books) and I think they should be able to move on...but seriously. Take the Hank Pym slap. Okay, was it a breakdown in communication between the writer and the illustrator? Was it intentionally scripted that way? Either way it happened, he should be able to move on once he has paid the price of the consequences. Cyclops should be able to have the same, but they never seem to have to deal with the repercussions of their actions. That’s correct, or the repercussions are minor and the event is brushed under the carpet because no writer wants to follow through on someone else’s awful plotting decision. Cyclops had to pay a much higher price for killing Xavier while possessed by the Phoenix than for abandoning his family, even if it’s easily argued that he had very mitigating circumstances in the first case and not in the second. But it’s just not him, naturally. Over the years we’ve seen a popular fellow like Wolverine stab Rachel Summers through the heart because he disagreed with her philosophically (according to him, believe it or not, “X-Men don’t kill!”) He never had to answer for that. Years later he tried to murder the innocent Hope Summers just to be safe, because she might become a new Phoenix. No consequence. Captain America defied the government over a regulation issue, and in the following Civil War among costumed heroes people died and gazillions of dollars of damage were inflicted to the country. His trial never went anywhere because he coveniently “died”, and when he came back everything was forgotten. As long as you’re a popular character and someone wants to use you in a story, it seems, you never have to realistically face the consequences of your actions. |
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Post by Outrajs on Oct 26, 2017 13:10:42 GMT -5
That’s correct, or the repercussions are minor and the event is brushed under the carpet because no writer wants to follow through on someone else’s awful plotting decision. Cyclops had to pay a much higher price for killing Xavier while possessed by the Phoenix than for abandoning his family, even if it’s easily argued that he had very mitigating circumstances in the first case and not in the second. But it’s just not him, naturally. Over the years we’ve seen a popular fellow like Wolverine stab Rachel Summers through the heart because he disagreed with her philosophically (according to him, believe it or not, “X-Men don’t kill!”) He never had to answer for that. Years later he tried to murder the innocent Hope Summers just to be safe, because she might become a new Phoenix. No consequence. Captain America defied the government over a regulation issue, and in the following Civil War among costumed heroes people died and gazillions of dollars of damage were inflicted to the country. His trial never went anywhere because he coveniently “died”, and when he came back everything was forgotten. As long as you’re a popular character and someone wants to use you in a story, it seems, you never have to realistically face the consequences of your actions. To be fair, most people don't read comic books for rational thinking and reality. They red them for suspension of disbelief...but to me, a LITTLE reality makes it easier to lose myself in the book. Also, if you proclaim to be for the people and to protect them and serve them and blah blah blah...well there should be consequences if you expect the bad guy to face them! |
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