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Post by The Captain on Nov 23, 2017 9:42:59 GMT -5
I really only had one choice this week...  A lovely John Cassaday/Laura Martin cover |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Nov 23, 2017 10:41:52 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2017 10:54:43 GMT -5
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Post by tarkintino on Nov 23, 2017 11:33:57 GMT -5
You get what you pay for with assembly line comics. It's a double edged sword, sometimes it produces great stuff, but (more often) it also involves decisions like this where the commercial product takes precedence over any artistic integrity and a middle management decision has more influence than the creator's intent or vision. Whether it's Romita changing a face or Colletta erasing lines or what have you, it's all part of the package with assembly line books. -M In this case, its easy to see why Starlin's thin, stressed Captain Marvel face was replaced, considering the period where the Romita look had become the house style, whether it was on superheroes or even horror titles. |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Nov 23, 2017 11:42:45 GMT -5
You get what you pay for with assembly line comics. It's a double edged sword, sometimes it produces great stuff, but (more often) it also involves decisions like this where the commercial product takes precedence over any artistic integrity and a middle management decision has more influence than the creator's intent or vision. Whether it's Romita changing a face or Colletta erasing lines or what have you, it's all part of the package with assembly line books. -M In this case, its easy to see why Starlin's thin, stressed Captain Marvel face was replaced, considering the period where the Romita look had become the house style, whether it was on superheroes or even horror titles. My first impression of Starlin's art was always that his characters (outside the bad guy which were like video game huge bosses) were always thin and gangly. I guess since then I've grown accustom to it. But that was my first impression from reading Warlock. |
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 23, 2017 13:15:36 GMT -5
Was a reason ever given as to why Romita's face was published? To me, this cover never fit with the rest from the run because it wasn't done by Starlin.
In addition to other reasons mentioned, CM's head in Starlin's version seems a little too small for his body. This reminds me of what DC did to Jack Kirby's Superman faces when he arrived at DC:    They did it to Alex Toth, too!   And Mike Sekowsky as well (That's a Wayne Boring Superman face front and center):  |
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Post by Icctrombone on Nov 23, 2017 13:51:41 GMT -5
Nice catch P Hal, I wasn't aware of those art corrections.
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 23, 2017 14:24:20 GMT -5
Nice catch P Hal, I wasn't aware of those art corrections. Thanks. DC was very persnickety about Superman. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Nov 23, 2017 14:56:37 GMT -5
Nice catch P Hal, I wasn't aware of those art corrections. Thanks. DC was very persnickety about Superman. I don't think Superman ever looked better than when Murphy Anderson inked him. |
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Post by tarkintino on Nov 23, 2017 16:17:39 GMT -5
Thanks. DC was very persnickety about Superman. I don't think Superman ever looked better than when Murphy Anderson inked him. True, even in on the occasion of inking Neal Adams. Anderson was one the great inkers, just by looking at his 60s work with Infantino. |
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Post by Hoosier X on Nov 24, 2017 1:24:21 GMT -5
I so much prefer the Jack Kirby faces on Superman. Not that there's anything wrong with Curt Swan faces ... on Curt Swan drawings.
Kirby should have said "Screw you!" and quit using Superman.
I've long wondered if there was some personal animosity involved on the part of somebody at DC who wanted to undermine or humiliate Kirby with this petty "re-drawing the faces" crap. Because there is NOTHING wrong with those Kirby faces.
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Post by tarkintino on Nov 24, 2017 8:33:22 GMT -5
I so much prefer the Jack Kirby faces on Superman. Not that there's anything wrong with Curt Swan faces ... on Curt Swan drawings. Kirby should have said "Screw you!" and quit using Superman. I've long wondered if there was some personal animosity involved on the part of somebody at DC who wanted to undermine or humiliate Kirby with this petty "re-drawing the faces" crap. Because there is NOTHING wrong with those Kirby faces. It was not about humiliating Kirby. DC and Marvel often had faces redrawn to fit the established brand look of a character. It was not only an artistic decision, but one of marketing, as their flagship characters were also heavily merchandised, so a consistent look--their most appealing / popular look--was an understandable priority. This is the reason even the damn near flawless Neal Adams (before his own work became licensing art) had some of his Superman and other faces altered to fit the Swan model. The same applies to Marvel, where Romita's great style was applied to the work of other artists (Kirby, Ross Andru, Rich Buckler, Sal Buscema, Frank Robbins, and others), when their work did not meet Marvel's house style, or for a time, the Romita style. |
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Post by kirby101 on Nov 24, 2017 9:03:41 GMT -5
At DC, Kirby was not suppose to do DC characters. He was creating his own (the Fourth World) But when he first went there they wanted him on a book. Kirby hated taking work from others, so he asked what is there worst selling book, the one that is going to be cancelled? They told him Jimmy Olsen and that is why it is his first DC work from that period. I don't think they disliked Kirby's art for Superman, they just felt it was too different from the Superman books. The changes made to Kirby's work has been controversial for a long time. www.tcj.com/infantino-raises-questions-about-cbg-letters-policy-following-kirby-controversy-flare-up-by-greg-stump/ |
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Post by MWGallaher on Nov 24, 2017 9:41:44 GMT -5
I so much prefer the Jack Kirby faces on Superman. Not that there's anything wrong with Curt Swan faces ... on Curt Swan drawings. Kirby should have said "Screw you!" and quit using Superman. I've long wondered if there was some personal animosity involved on the part of somebody at DC who wanted to undermine or humiliate Kirby with this petty "re-drawing the faces" crap. Because there is NOTHING wrong with those Kirby faces. For a few issues of Jimmy Olsen, you'll see that he used a lot more shots of Superman and Jimmy from behind. |
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Post by tarkintino on Nov 24, 2017 10:00:54 GMT -5
Interesting from that link...
No humiliation in that. It happened to Adams, and a host of other artists working for companies with an established brand / look to their characters.
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