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Post by rberman on Jun 15, 2018 18:33:59 GMT -5
#9 “Dangerous” 3/6 (March 2005)
The Story: Kitty Pryde (hero moment!) is inside the Danger Room with over a hundred students looking at an environment based on the rubble-strewn land of Genosha, complete with a giant Magneto sculpture. The Room taunts and threatens her through an image of the re-animated corpse of Wing. If she leaves, he’ll kill the students, though that seems to be a likely outcome regardless. The Room also keeps talking about its “father,” but we don’t know who that is. Emma Frost feels that the Danger Room is sentient and angry; she proposes that its new form should be counted as a mutation. Seems like a wonky analogy, but OK. The X-Men dither around outside the Danger Room door for a while, cope with a remote-controlled Blackbird, break into the ceiling, and smash the Danger Room’s control module. This allows the computer consciousness that runs the Danger Room to manifest in the form of an android who will be known as “ Danger,” which explains the title of this story arc. My Two Cents: I have to confess, this issue is pretty skimpy on plot. There’s a talky Kitty half in the Danger Room in which she unsuccessfully bargains with Danger (through Wing’s grisly corpse) to stand down. And there’s an action X-Men half right outside the door where they end up freeing Danger from the room rather than actually damaging Danger. (She? It? I guess if Jocasta is a “she” then so is Danger.) With some smaller panels, the story of this issue could easily have been combined with the previous issue, and there’s not a lot of brilliant characterization to make up the scarcity of the plot either. We could really have used a subplot where some of the kids in the Danger Room did something besides cower. Or maybe the Cuckoos awaken outside and do something clever and spooky. Let’s take advantage of this pause in story momentum to consider Kitty and Peter’s romance. When she joined the X-Men as the geeky girlfriend that every junior high boy wanted to have, Peter was the quiet, supportive guy that every junior high wanted to be—or at least, to be perceived as. But the age difference between the characters, much more on the minds of the X-Men creators (especially Editor-in-Chief Jim Shooter) than on the minds of the readers, led to a mandated break-up. Colossus was given an ill-fated romance with an alien healer during the original Secret Wars. He broke up with Kitty when he got home, and they had their respective recoveries. Kitty went on to relationships with Peter Wisdom and Peter Quill. But in a 2016 interview on the podcast “ Jay and Miles X-Plain the X-Men," Chris Claremont x-plained that his plan for decades had been that “the love of Kitty’s life” was… Rachel Summers? This was not at all evident from the Rachel/Kitty evident in X-Men up through 1986-7 when I stopped reading; they seemed to be close comrades-in-arms, but not more than that. There was a later sequence in Excalibur in which Kitty was seduced by the femme fatale Saturnyne, though. When Claremont put Kitty and Karma together in the 2003 Mekanix mini-series, at one point he had Karma fiddling with Kitty’s hair, and then later they had one of those “fell on top of each other, averted kiss” scenes commonly used to build sexual tension in cinema: Then in 2004 when Claremont was writing X-Treme X-Men, he brought both Kitty and Rachel into an already crowded roster and carved out plenty of space for them. Also, Kitty is constantly shown as drinking water. What is that about? An Ecstasy addiction? Some sexual innuendo? Something else? Whedon is pushing back against all this to make room for a renewed Kitty/Peter romance. Whedon’s vision has prevailed over Claremont’s, at least for now. As of 2018, Kitty and Peter are getting married. Fun fact: Can you see Charlie Brown here in the Danger Room? He just can't catch a break! <iframe width="13" height="12.840000000000032" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 12.84px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 5px; top: 157px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_23850993" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="13" height="12.840000000000032" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 12.84px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 591px; top: 157px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_87491475" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="13" height="12.840000000000032" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 12.84px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 5px; top: 737px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_8921021" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="13" height="12.840000000000032" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 12.84px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 591px; top: 737px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_51533225" scrolling="no"></iframe>
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jun 15, 2018 19:26:22 GMT -5
Ah, yes.. Danger.. one of the worst X-ideas ever, IMO.
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Post by rberman on Jun 16, 2018 6:37:07 GMT -5
#10 “Dangerous” 4/6 (May 2005)
The Story: Combat time! Most of this issue is one big fight. Danger is the last one standing, with dying X-Men all around. Puzzlingly, Emma Frost willingly surrenders to Danger, lest Danger reveal “the truth” about her. And what truth would that be? Two other scenes intercut the combat. One is Special Agent Brand, working with a team of S.W.O.R.D. agents trying to figure out what’s happening inside the mansion. I love the antagonistic banter between Brand and her alien advisor Sydren. The second is a telepathic conversation between Charles Xavier and Danger. So now we know who Danger considers “father,” and apparently Xavier has been dreading this day for a long time. Xavier is eventually revealed to be in the ruins of Genosha, watching Danger approach in the Blackbird. As Danger proclaims his doom, Xavier points out that Danger’s advantage will be substantially diminished against him: He never trained in the Danger Room himself, and thus his capabilities are unknown to her. Note that Danger chose to manifest as "her," making her the fourth strong female character Whedon has introduced so far. My Two Cents: It’s a very straightforward issue, heavy on action and light on characterization. We get the deepening mystery of what secret would be so important to Emma that she would risk getting murdered to protect it. The X-Men appear to be in pretty bad shape; look at the caliber of the spike that pierces Peter and Kitty. It’s like a telephone pole! I can’t imagine they would survive more than seconds like that. Cassaday overdid the peril on that particular panel. Danger has a combat advantage on the X-Men, having fought them many times in simulations over the years. Almost the entire issue is a single combat sequence. At Kitty’s suggestion (hero moment!), the mutants use each other’s strategies instead of their own usual attacks. This helps for a few minutes, but they still lose the fight badly and are left for dead. We also see that Ord of the Breakworld is Brand’s prisoner, but his holding cell looks more like a throne room. Obviously Brand is walking a tightrope with him, trying to keep him out of action while keeping up the pretense that he’s an honored guest. Even in this arc about Danger, the Brand/Ord element is more interesting, because Danger's apparent motive is just “I will get my revenge and I cannot be reasoned with.” Whereas Ord may be nasty, but he sees himself as a champion protecting his people. One can believe there might be a set of circumstances in which he finds common cause with the X-Men against some other foe. Most of the Astonishing covers are at least fine as pin-ups, but this one is just bad all around, consisting of a B&W shot of the top part of Xavier’s head, which I suppose is supposed to make us think of his big brain inside. Again a missed opportunity to depict the exciting life-and-death battle actually portrayed inside the issue. In the 80s, we would have had a cover with Danger standing amidst fallen X-Men. (Though they would have no apparent wounds, because of the Comics Code.) For instance, here's a reproduction of Michael Golden's unpublished cover proposal for Avengers Annual #10, in which Rogue and other evil mutants fought the Avengers. I know which of these two covers makes me more inclined to check out the interior! But I can also understand why an artist working on deadline for the interior doesn't always have time to make an awesome cover too, which is an argument for letting someone else do the cover. <iframe width="13" height="10.400000000000034" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 10.4px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 5px; top: 195px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_72228260" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="13" height="10.400000000000034" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 10.4px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 591px; top: 195px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_61438190" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="13" height="10.400000000000034" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 10.4px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 5px; top: 656px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_81494928" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="13" height="10.400000000000034" style="position: absolute; width: 13px; height: 10.4px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 591px; top: 656px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_55064825" scrolling="no"></iframe>
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Post by badwolf on Jun 16, 2018 10:10:14 GMT -5
I believe that Golden Avengers cover was a commission he did years later. But it does look great!
I didn't like the idea of Danger. I've read countless issues of X-Men involving the Danger Room and (though it's possible I missed something during the bad years) I never once got the impression that it was remotely sentient. It's a tool run by computer programs, but I don't recall any A.I. Plus, it seems like yet another attempt to vilify Xavier by saying that he's...what...been keeping "her" as a slave all these years?
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Post by rberman on Jun 16, 2018 11:24:15 GMT -5
I believe that Golden Avengers cover was a commission he did years later. But it does look great! Correct on both counts. Apparently Golden did a mock-up of this as the proposed cover, but it was nixed, probably for not having the X-Men on it, so instead we got this Silver Age-looking multi-panel thingie, which I find not nearly as compelling, even without the annoying banner ad at the top:
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Post by rberman on Jun 17, 2018 8:14:06 GMT -5
#11 “Dangerous” 5/6 (July 2005)
The Story: On the island of Genosha, Charles Xavier fools Danger with a decoy corpse in his wheelchair, then plows into her with a semi truck, knocking her into a electrical substation. I didn’t realize anything as big as a semi, a functional power station, or a an electrical substation survived the extinction event, but here they are. Maybe this is the other side of the island from where the Sentinel landed? Also, don’t semi trucks have foot pedals to operate when you’re driving? Also, wasn't Genosha radioactive when we saw it a few years ago in Grant Morrison's run as X-writer? Anyway. Back at the X-Men mansion, the student healer Elixir has saved the lives of the X-Men before himself passing out on the floor. A revived Kitty Pryde realizes (hero moment!) that Danger must be on the way to kill Xavier, and that Xavier (hero moment!) must be in the ruins of Genosha, because Genosha was scenario that Danger activated in the Danger Room. Hitching a ride in the Fantastic Four’s pogojet, the X-Men find Xavier on Genosha just in time to witness Danger activating the dormant Mega-Sentinel currently resting on the sea floor near Genosha. The giant machine looms over our heroes… My Two Cents: Emma Frost claims that there were no student “casualties” from Danger’s actions, but she means that there were casualties, but no fatalities. There’s a difference! (A similar error occured in an earlier issue.) This issue is all about Xavier’s battle with Danger. The X-Men do essentially nothing themselves; they wake up, figure out they should go to Genosha, and arrive at Genosha. However, we do get some character movement. Peter, knowing that Kitty’s father died in Genosha, tries to dissuade her from going there, which makes her mad. They have a tense moment and then make up. Whedon continues to show that he knows how to write actual people working through realistic problems, misunderstandings, and tantrums. I’m a bit confused by the appearance of the Mega-Sentinel. The way it looks, I mean, not the fact that it appears. Whedon portrays its location as a mystery now revealed. But we previously saw it sitting dormant on the island of Genosha, where Toad and his buddies were re-fashioning the middle of its three heads into a tribute to Magneto. Remember this scene with Polaris? The three-headed Sentinel doesn’t look like that in this issue, which I guess is a plot hole. Speaking of Magneto: Xavier appears to be implying in the panel below that Magneto is (1) still alive and (2) still an ally of Xavier. This would require retconning away the entire “ Xorn is Magneto gone evil again” that was the entire underlying premise of Grant Morrison’s years writing X-Men. Does that reflect immediate negative feedback that Marvel received on the Xorn storyline’s “Planet X” conclusion?
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 17, 2018 9:14:59 GMT -5
If memory serves, the “Xorn is Magneto” plot was retconned away almost immediately, with the familiar and reformed Mags appearing in the new Excalibur mag written by Chris Claremont. Magneto protested his innocence and was even shocked that people could still think him able to perform acts of wanton destruction. I don’t think there was any explanation for the Xorn-Magneto thing yet, though. (“Let someone else handle that mess”, Chris might have said).
Since all of that happened around the time of Avengers Disassembled, give or take a few years, I was happy to see the Xorneto plot as an effect of the Scarlet Witch tempering with reality. Marvel didn’t go that way, though.
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Post by Cheswick on Jun 17, 2018 10:10:35 GMT -5
If memory serves, the “Xorn is Magneto” plot was retconned away almost immediately, with the familiar and reformed Mags appearing in the new Excalibur mag written by Chris Claremont. Magneto protested his innocence and was even shocked that people could still think him able to perform acts of wanton destruction. I don’t think there was any explanation for the Xorn-Magneto thing yet, though. (“Let someone else handle that mess”, Chris might have said). Since all of that happened around the time of Avengers Disassembled, give or take a few years, I was happy to see the Xorneto plot as an effect of the Scarlet Witch tempering with reality. Marvel didn’t go that way, though. 1. You are correct. They literally retconned it two months after Morrison's run ended but, in modern Marvel fashion, didn't bother giving an explanation. 2. Even if Xorn wasn't Magneto, his shock seemed odd to me considering, directly before Morrison's run, Magneto was in full villain-mode (He Kidnapped Professor X, was actively preparing for war against humanity, and nearly killed a few of Jean Grey's temporary X-Men). The continuity post-Morrison really did become a mess.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 17, 2018 11:27:18 GMT -5
If memory serves, the “Xorn is Magneto” plot was retconned away almost immediately, with the familiar and reformed Mags appearing in the new Excalibur mag written by Chris Claremont. Magneto protested his innocence and was even shocked that people could still think him able to perform acts of wanton destruction. I don’t think there was any explanation for the Xorn-Magneto thing yet, though. (“Let someone else handle that mess”, Chris might have said). Since all of that happened around the time of Avengers Disassembled, give or take a few years, I was happy to see the Xorneto plot as an effect of the Scarlet Witch tempering with reality. Marvel didn’t go that way, though. 1. You are correct. They literally retconned it two months after Morrison's run ended but, in modern Marvel fashion, didn't bother giving an explanation. 2. Even if Xorn wasn't Magneto, his shock seemed odd to me considering, directly before Morrison's run, Magneto was in full villain-mode (He Kidnapped Professor X, was actively preparing for war against humanity, and nearly killed a few of Jean Grey's temporary X-Men). The continuity post-Morrison really did become a mess.
My guess is that Chris Claremont wanted to do “his” Magneto, the one who had reformed to a certain extent, and simply brushed aside later interpretations. There was a time where I would have objected to such disregard for continuity, but by then so few writers cared to retain the Marvel Universe consistency that I couldn’t blame Chris at all if it is what actually happened.
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Post by rberman on Jun 17, 2018 13:22:48 GMT -5
1. You are correct. They literally retconned it two months after Morrison's run ended but, in modern Marvel fashion, didn't bother giving an explanation. 2. Even if Xorn wasn't Magneto, his shock seemed odd to me considering, directly before Morrison's run, Magneto was in full villain-mode (He Kidnapped Professor X, was actively preparing for war against humanity, and nearly killed a few of Jean Grey's temporary X-Men). The continuity post-Morrison really did become a mess.
My guess is that Chris Claremont wanted to do “his” Magneto, the one who had reformed to a certain extent, and simply brushed aside later interpretations. There was a time where I would have objected to such disregard for continuity, but by then so few writers cared to retain the Marvel Universe consistency that I couldn’t blame Chris at all if it is what actually happened. I didn't like how byzantine Claremont became by the late 80s, but I did and do have high respect for his understanding of his own internal X-Men continuity. I was listening to this podcast from two weeks ago where Claremont argued that it was bad news that Kitty and Peter are about to get married, and his number one reason was that it was a big step toward the reality of the "Days of Future Past" storyline in which Peter and Kitty were married. The lack of continuity from about 2000 onward could have at least three causes, all of which pertain to editorial staff rather than the individual writers: 1) A deliberate choice to de-emphasize continuity, focusing instead of the good of the individual arc; 2) A lack of familiarity with the continuity (perhaps due to musical chairs at the editorial level) so that the editor simply doesn't know enough to tell the writer, "Um, Grant Morrison, Sebastian Shaw is not a telepath." 3) A lack of attention to such details, coupled with a lack of vision for where the story ought to go in a big picture way. Claremont for instance was great at "This year we'll do this, which will set up THIS in the following year and THAT five years from now."
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Post by badwolf on Jun 17, 2018 16:43:03 GMT -5
Didn't it kill Wing though? Or did that turn out to be a hoax? I don't remember.
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Post by rberman on Jun 17, 2018 16:53:11 GMT -5
Didn't it kill Wing though? Or did that turn out to be a hoax? I don't remember. The Danger Room did goad Wing to die and provide an environment in which that could happen, and Wing’s death was the catalyst for Danger’s further evolution. I guess this is different from actively killing people? But honestly, that giant spike should have killed Kitty and Peter long before Elixir arrived, and Scott had already stopped breathing moments before, so the survival of those three characters at least can only be explained through narrative trickery. However, Claremont was no stranger to such cheap tricks himself. Remember how the end of #133 lead into the beginning of #134?
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Post by badwolf on Jun 17, 2018 20:18:12 GMT -5
Nightcrawler is a drama queen.
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Post by rberman on Jun 17, 2018 21:00:32 GMT -5
Nightcrawler is a drama queen. Also, how did those manacles keep him from teleporting away?
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Post by rberman on Jun 18, 2018 5:24:40 GMT -5
#12 “Dangerous” 6/6 (August 2005)
The Story: As the Mega-Sentinel fires its death ray at the X-Men, Kitty Pryde (hero moment!) saves the team by making them all intangible for the duration of the attack. The next wave is a horde of tiny sentinel robots similar to those portrayed in Ecuador during Grant Morrison’s tenure as writer. Colossus gives two “fastball specials.” One is the usual “hurling Wolverine into the fray.” The second is to hurl Kitty up into the Mega-Sentinel, where she (hero moment!) can disrupt its electronics and reprogram it via a computer terminal located conveniently inside. Kitty gets the Sentinel to remember its annihilation of 16 million people on Genosha. In between its act of genocide and now, the Sentinel has become sentient. Wracked with guilt by its previous actions, it breaks off the attack on the X-Men and flies away to think. Meanwhile, Beast is trying to get Xavier away from the pursuing Danger. Beast tears Danger to shreds but then starts acting all weird and feral. When the dust settles, Xavier admits that he’s known for a long time that Danger was a sentient AI enslaved to run the Shi’ar-upgraded Danger Room. Emma walks away from the battle for a moment to confer with a shadowy figure who says ominous, conspiratorial things and then watches from the shadows. The final splash page reveals a gloomy and motley quartet: Cassandra Nova, Sebastian Shaw, Negasonic Teenage Warhead, and… somebody in a hooded cloak. My Two Cents: This time the cover captures the theme of the issue perfectly, as the X-Men turn away from Xavier, who hangs his head in shame. Xavier has often been depicted doing questionable things, and writers often look for reasons to estrange the team from him. Do I believe that he would enslave a sentient being? Do I believe that in this mansion brimming with telepaths, no one ever noticed? Ehh…. Maybe…. Emma’s defense of Xavier’s ruthlessness puts her at odds with Scott, while Kitty’s encounter with the Sentinel that murdered her father gives her a sense of closure that removes one more obstacle to emotional intimacy with Peter. Obviously the foreboding notion that Emma is a traitor will lead us into the next story arc. The central idea of this arc is interesting enough: The Danger Room’s AI becomes sentient, attacks the X-Men, and proves a formidable adversary due to years of practice. A two parter, OK. A three parter, maybe. But stretched out to six issues, without another concurrent plot (or two) of equal weight, and it’s just not enough story for the space.
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