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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 20:22:10 GMT -5
Yeah, what was the timeline on this? I assumed it was in response to Watergate (as was Steve Englehart's Secret Empire storyline in Captain America) but it looks like these comics came out before Watergate was really a thing. Honestly, this whole issue strikes me as 100% goof, and I'm fine with that. I suspect that Adams drew the president as an 8 year old girl because he thought it would be funny to draw the president as an eight year old girl. (I STILL think it is pretty funny!) GL/GA 1970-72.
Captain America Secret Empire 1973-74.
Watergate Scandal 1972-74.
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Post by Chris on Feb 11, 2019 1:09:58 GMT -5
The appearances of Sybil and Grandy are based on Richard Nixon and Spiro Agnew. Why? Just because Adams disliked them. Yeah, what was the timeline on this? I assumed it was in response to Watergate (as was Steve Englehart's Secret Empire storyline in Captain America) but it looks like these comics came out before Watergate was really a thing. Honestly, this whole issue strikes me as 100% goof, and I'm fine with that. I suspect that Adams drew the president as an 8 year old girl because he thought it would be funny to draw the president as an eight year old girl. (I STILL think it is pretty funny!) From Back Issue magazine #45 -
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Post by Prince Hal on Feb 11, 2019 17:54:16 GMT -5
Using Agnew and Nixon as the villains was no casual throwaway by O'Neil and Adams, md62. I distinctly remember buying this comic after an exhaustive search of candy stores and newsstands, in March, 1971, a week, maybe two, after it hit the stands. That was 14 months before the break-in at the Watergate Hotel. In October 1973, Agnew resigned in disgrace after kickback and bribery scandals surfaced. he pleaded nolo contendre to tax evasion. Got off easy, IYAM or anyone else who had to listen to his sanctimonious blather. And Nixon, as you know, resigned in August 1974. The references to Agnew and Nixon rang very true with me and many others, as Agnew had been criticizing the media for months in the wake of the coverage of the illegal invasion of Cambodia, the ensuing protests and killings at Kent State and Jackson State, and the increasingly hostility by the Nixon administration for anyone who spoke out against it. You may recall, in addition to Agnew's assault on the freedom of the press (fueled by the purple-prose toxins of the young Patrick Buchanan), Nixon's "Enemies List," and the cancellation of the Smothers Brothers TV show in 1969 because of its criticism of the Vietnam War, for starters. (Check out Pete Seeger singing "Waist Deep in the Big Muddy" in February '68 and and you'll get the picture.) O'Neil and Adams weren't just doing this because they thought it would be cute.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2019 18:04:58 GMT -5
Prince Hal thanks once again for the context. I was too young to remember (or care) about politics when this was written. Nixon resigning was probably my first "political" moment that impacted me. The only stuff I really cared about in the late 60's/early 70's that was national news was the moon landings...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2019 18:17:23 GMT -5
Using Agnew and Nixon as the villains was no casual throwaway by O'Neil and Adams, md62. I distinctly remember buying this comic after an exhaustive search of candy stores and newsstands, in March, 1971, a week, maybe two, after it hit the stands. That was 14 months before the break-in at the Watergate Hotel. In October 1973, Agnew resigned in disgrace after kickback and bribery scandals surfaced. he pleaded nolo contendre to tax evasion. Got off easy, IYAM or anyone else who had to listen to his sanctimonious blather. And Nixon, as you know, resigned in August 1974. The references to Agnew and Nixon rang very true with me and many others, as Agnew had been criticizing the media for months in the wake of the coverage of the illegal invasion of Cambodia, the ensuing protests and killings at Kent State and Jackson State, and the increasingly hostility by the Nixon administration for anyone who spoke out against it. You may recall, in addition to Agnew's assault on the freedom of the press (fueled by the purple-prose toxins of the young Patrick Buchanan), Nixon's "Enemies List," and the cancellation of the Smothers Brothers TV show in 1969 because of its criticism of the Vietnam War, for starters. (Check out Pete Seeger singing "Waist Deep in the Big Muddy" in February '68 and and you'll get the picture.) O'Neil and Adams weren't just doing this because they thought it would be cute. Good Analysis and you got your points ... right on the money and those years were the "darkest" in American History and I had to ask my Parents what really happen and I was a teenager back then and I wanted to understand what was going on there and I felt that both the President and the Vice President lost a tremendous amount of integrity that led to their resignations and that shamed them and embarrassed the Republican Party in the 70's. By the way, excellent write-up here ... I wished that I could write like that.
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Post by Prince Hal on Feb 11, 2019 19:39:17 GMT -5
Prince Hal thanks once again for the context. I was too young to remember (or care) about politics when this was written. Nixon resigning was probably my first "political" moment that impacted me. The only stuff I really cared about in the late 60's/early 70's that was national news was the moon landings... My pleasure. The moon landing was the same week as Chappaquiddick, btw. Ford's swearing-in and speech at noon the day after Nixon resigned, which I listened to standing in the office at the gas station where I worked hoping no car would drive in for gas for a minute or two, was one of a few times that I have felt very proud of our country. Of course, a month or so later, I slammed the wheel of my girlfriend (now wife)'s VW when we heard his speech pardoning Nixon. I was just as angry at Ford then as I had been proud of him when he took the oath.
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Post by tarkintino on Feb 11, 2019 20:38:38 GMT -5
Good Analysis and you got your points ... right on the money and those years were the "darkest" in American HistoryAre you talking about the Watergate period? If so, I would say hardly. The previous decade--the 1960s--saw --the U.S. and the Soviet Union on the edge of war (including Operation Northwoods, a proposed terror/false flag plan against Americans to con them into thinking it was the work of Castro's Cuba, thus the expected outrage would also support a full scale war against Cuba--all the plans of a number of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff & the Department of Defense --racial conflict pushing the nation to the point where both the government (specifically the F.B.I., C.I.A. and N.S.A.) and people on the street thought a second civil war was possible. --the highest rate of domestic assassinations in U.S. history (and that includes civil rights activists, members of the clergy, etc. --the F.B.I.'s COINTELPRO initiative which targeted innocent Americans (e.g. civil rights activists, any sort of black empowerment group, entertainers of the ideological Left, et al), worked with local law enforcement to orchestrate murders of alleged dissidents, etc. --Vietnam more for what America was actually doing over there than the sold, packaged story, etc. That's just scratching the surface as the list of terrible, era-defining events is quite endless, and despite some in the media and among Baby Boomers who paint the 60s as The Beatles, a lot of (largely bad) TV, the so-called "Summer of Love" the moon landing and Woodstock, the true decade was incredibly dark and its impact forever altered the course of the nation (and in a few cases, the world) in ways that all things Nixon could not by any stretch of the imagination.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2019 20:46:11 GMT -5
tarkintino ... I was talking about the resignations of both Vice President in 73 and a year later, Nixon left office. I wasn't thinking about Watergate and all that. I just pointing out the dark days of the Republican Party and having both of them out in consecutive years and all that. You are right about the 60's ... and you get CREDIT for that and thanks for reminding that.
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Post by codystarbuck on Feb 12, 2019 0:31:43 GMT -5
Prince Hal thanks once again for the context. I was too young to remember (or care) about politics when this was written. Nixon resigning was probably my first "political" moment that impacted me. The only stuff I really cared about in the late 60's/early 70's that was national news was the moon landings... My pleasure. The moon landing was the same week as Chappaquiddick, btw. Ford's swearing-in and speech at noon the dat after Nixon resigned, which I listened to standing in the office at the gas station where I worked hoping no car would drive in for gas for a minute or two, was one of a few times that I have felt very proud of our country. Of course, a month or so later, I slammed the wheel of my girlfriend (now wife)'s VW when we heard his speech pardoning Nixon. I was just as angry at Ford then as I had been proud of him when he took the oath. I was in the hospital, coming out of anesthesia, after an operation to repair a hernia. My parents had Ford's speech on the tv, when I woke up. I asked what was going on, then fell back to sleep not to long after. The pardon didn't really shock me, as I was young enough to not really understand all of the consequences; but, following that up with the lunacy of the Ford presidency (more surrounding him, his administration and the country, rather than the man, himself) and the constant lampooning on SNL and even in things like The Pink Panther Strikes Again was all quite memorable and I knew things were a complete mess.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 12, 2019 0:54:44 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know it was that serious.
"I miss the old days when comics weren't so political" says every youtube generation comics reviewer.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2019 10:46:53 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know it was that serious. "I miss the old days when comics weren't so political" says every youtube generation comics reviewer. Overall comics weren't political. Aside from a few runs like this one. Although you could argue during WW II a lot of comics were...
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Post by MDG on Feb 12, 2019 11:10:17 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know it was that serious. "I miss the old days when comics weren't so political" says every youtube generation comics reviewer. Overall comics weren't political. Aside from a few runs like this one. Although you could argue during WW II a lot of comics were...
Everything has the potential to be a political statement, whether overt or not. It's just closer to the surface at some times than others. We may be living in one of those times.
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Post by tarkintino on Feb 12, 2019 12:01:37 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know it was that serious. "I miss the old days when comics weren't so political" says every youtube generation comics reviewer. Overall comics weren't political. Aside from a few runs like this one. Although you could argue during WW II a lot of comics were...
True, but in that period, being "political"--particularly as an American--was not so polarizing a mindset as it would become in the conflicted 1960s (and 70s to a lesser degree). Innumerable Americans felt unified and justified in embracing a proud, political ideology tied to fighting a global evil / the survival of mankind. That's why few can honestly criticize WWII era comics as being "one-sided", since most were on the same train of thought.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 12, 2019 12:13:28 GMT -5
Wow, I didn't know it was that serious. "I miss the old days when comics weren't so political" says every youtube generation comics reviewer. Overall comics weren't political. Aside from a few runs like this one. Although you could argue during WW II a lot of comics were...
I would disagree. Let's look at every comic review thread featuring comics from the late 1960s to mid 1970s. JLA in the 1970s:"Instantly the JLA have a Bronze Era sensibility, debating societal issues and philosophy instead of just punching space monsters." Swamp Thing: Issue by IssueThe whole plot fo Swamp Thing # 1 is about corporate control of intellectual property rights. Bad Tidings: Super-Villain Team-UpThe main characters are two heads of state, so it's inherently political by nature. A later issue has Henry Kissinger as a "surprise guest star." Teen Titans from the Beginning
Ok, so. I read the first Teen Titans story from Brave and the Bold 54 as being about native American treaty rights. Even if you don't buy it, the story is about an organised political youth movement. Later on, the Mister Jupiter/giving up the costumes plot-line is motivated by a protest and ends up being about pacifism and the idea of the conscientious objector. The Batman Family: 1975-1980
Batgirl is literally a congresswoman. So I can find an example from every series reviewed from the first couple issues of every front page review thread. (Other recent review threads: The Guardians of the Galaxy (about the political process of revolution), the Fourth World (Blatant Vietnam allegory) and the Defenders ("Women's iib" is the theme of every Valkyrie story, also written by Steve Englehart and Steve Gerber, so.....) I think a lot of bronze age comics don't seem political if read by an eight year old, but if you look at them with adult eyes they're written by politically active adults reflecting a highly politicized culture. And this is doubly true of comics written in the 1969-1975 period.
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 12, 2019 12:24:17 GMT -5
All comic books are about conflict, usually between good and evil. Along came the 60's and the 70's and the lines were blurred a bit. The entire origin of the Watcher centered around not interfering with the natural events of worlds. The heroes we read about interfere quite a bit and that makes for discussions about what these stories are really about. It's in the eye of the beholder in some cases.
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