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Post by driver1980 on Nov 21, 2023 12:52:09 GMT -5
Saw another Vince Russo clip again last night. Can a person’s IQ drop into negative figures (his, not mine)?
Once again, he seemed to be saying something along the lines of, “There’s too much wrestling on a wrestling show.” What?! Now, I know he’s pathetic. He even had a rather nasty dig at Tony Khan, specifically Khan liking action figures (didn’t we all?) and E-feds. Yes, Russo says that despite broadcasting his nonsense from a room filled with merchandise and which looks like a shrine.
He has to repeat words and the like, he thinks saying “I will never, ever, ever…” makes his point stronger. He mentions 1,000% on occasion (can’t we all just say that 100% of folks agree on this or that, why 1,000%?).
I imagine if he’d written for CSI or something, he’d be saying how no-one is interested in the plots, only the characters. Well, we’re interested in both. I just know if Russo could be given the opportunity to book just one episode of Raw next month, he’d probably have about 10 minutes of wrestling time. I think it’s idiotic to not want wrestling on a wrestling show, and I am disappointed at how personal he gets about the likes of Tony Khan.
He also keeps saying, “I am not looking for a job…” Methinks doth protest too much, Russo.
Let’s face it, and this is just my view, the man achieved nothing on his own merits. I suspect any WWF successes were collaborative. WCW was a mess, and I don’t blame Russo for its death, but his free hand in WCW proved how non-talented he was and is.
He’s all over the place. There’s no consistency or continuity in what he did in wrestling. He would probably think it’s a good idea to have a Martian character show up on a wrestling show and plunge the arena into darkness - but he’d have no ability to follow up on that. He’d just tell you how entertaining it was, to hell with title belts and meaningful victories.
I really have such disdain for the guy.
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 22, 2023 8:28:15 GMT -5
I won’t be offended if anyone buys this for me: powerslammagazine.comI’m not sure if Power Slam was ever sold outside the UK. Did anyone here buy it? Running from 1994 until 2014 (although it had a prior incarnation as Superstars of Wrestling from 1992-94), it was an interesting publication, and a “gateway drug” to me becoming a fan of the insider stuff. The likes of WWF publications, Apter mags and Starlog mags, to name a few, were almost entirely kayfabe, although they’d break it if necessary, e.g. if something was too big to be ignored. Fun as they were, we got stories such as “What’s in the Undertaker’s urn?” or rivals exchanging insults over the phone. Except for rare occasions, the interviews were kayfabe. I’m not even sure whether the likes of Jesse Ventura and Bobby Heenan wrote their own columns, or whether a staffer “wrote with their voice”. I did enjoy “investigative reports” looking into whether Jack Tunney had been bribed by Ted DiBiase, or the search for the missing Undertaker in 1994. Of course, various newsletters were totally insider, as were some publications. I know you all know that. The reason I mention it is because Power Slam occupied a peculiar place in between, at least early on it its existence. It wasn’t totally insider, but it wasn’t totally kayfabe either. It’d treat events and storylines as real (as real as any wrestling can be reported) while not being afraid to mention wrestlers’ real names, suspensions, movements, etc. Of course, once the Montreal Screwjob happened, all pretence was gone. In a nutshell, Power Slam maintained the illusion of wrestling as far as was possible, while not insulting people’s intelligence. On a related note, WCW Magazine had different incarnations, one of which was published between 1991 and 1994. Missy Hyatt recently tweeted how one of her columns was written by Jim Ross. In that publication, there were columns by Jim Ross, Tony Schiavone and Gordon Solie, to name a few (Solie’s covered the history of wrestling). I wonder, were these columns written by Ross, Schiavone and Solie? If anyone could write their own columns, it’d be those men (hard to imagine anyone “writing in Solie’s style” to cover classic wrestling). Does anyone know for sure?
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Post by Rags on Nov 22, 2023 10:22:45 GMT -5
Who thinks Punk will appear at Survivor series? Rumours are he'll eventually take over Judgement Day if he does.
Hope Carlos spits apple on Escobar...
I expect Gunther to retain of course, and it's only a matter of time before he challenges Seth.
Reins is a POS....absent yet again....
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 22, 2023 10:44:47 GMT -5
Really, the Undisputed Champion should be at one of the Big Four PPVs.
As for Punk, I’ll only believe it when I see it…
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Post by dbutler69 on Nov 22, 2023 11:52:01 GMT -5
I just watched Summerslam 1992
They called this “The Summerslam you never thought you’d see” and I have to agree, since in the booking they ignored every single feud they’d been building the past few months. More on that later.
We get Vince McMahon and Bobby Heenan on commentary, with McMahon mentioning a crowd of over 80,000. We start with 6 trumpeters performing a song. I noticed a surprising number of American flags in the crowd.
First match is the Legion of Doom vs. Money Inc. The Legion of Doom come out in motorcycles! How Cool! Oh, wait a minute, Rocco (the dummy they adopted a few months ago in case you’ve forgotten) is with Paul Ellering. Rocco just negated all the cool points that the motorcycle entrance had earned them. Speaking of motorcycles, I read that Hawk quit the company the day after this and joined the Hell’s Angels in England. I could never understand the Rocco thing. Did McMahon think that this would make LOD more accessible and kid friendly, or was he just trying to make them look stupid? I suspect it’s the latter. Also, you’ve got the Beverly Brothers mocking LOD for months calling them sissies, and the LOD respond by…adopting a wooden dummy?!?! I don’t get it either because, as far as I could tell, they were still the most popular tag team in the WWF (which was a pretty weak division at this point) even if they weren’t quite as popular as they once were.
Anyway, Ted DiBiase comes out in all white instead of all black and it looks really nice. LOD also come out with black and gold spiked shoulderpads instead of their usual black and red. These costume changes also make this event feel more special.
As far as the match itself, LOD get the early advantage, then Hawk plays babyface in peril for quite a while while Money Inc pull out all the usual heel tricks to keep the advantage. Anilam cleans house after the hot tag and gets the pin fairly quickly after that. This was a decent tag team match, overall. Nothing epic, but fairly enjoyable.
As far as ignoring rivalries, LOD had been feuding with the Beverly Brothers and Money Inc had been feuding with the Natural Disasters (whom they’d recently dropped the tag team belts to) but we don’t get either of those matchups here.
We get an interview with Ric Flair (who’s in ring gear even though he’s not scheduled to wrestle) as Mean Gene Okerlund is trying to find out from Flair who Mr Perfect (who is Flair’s “executive consultant”) will be managing in the WWF title match between Macho Man Randy Savage and the Ultimate Warrior. The idea is that Flair and Perfect have been claiming that both guys have been negotiating with Perfect to be their manager, and the generally accepted idea is that whoever has Perfect in his corner is virtually guaranteed victory. Flair is evasive, as he and Perfect have been for weeks on this topic.
Next match is Nailz vs. Virgil. What a terrible match. The only move Nailz has is chocking. When Virgil has to carry the match, you know you’re in trouble. This match sucked but at least it was short. Nailz of course with the win, as they’re building his feud with Big Bosssman (another feud we don’t get to see here) and making him look like a dangerous monster.
Next match is the Model Rick Martel vs. Shawn Michaels. This is one of the matches I was looking forward to the most. Two great workers (though I don’t think Martel is as good of a worker since he took on the Model gimmick) and great all-around wrestlers. Again, this matchup ignores Martel’s feud with Tatanka and Michaels’s feud with Bret Hart for the Intercontinental belt. I sure hope those two meet sooner or later.
This match had a “no hitting in the face” clause, which was engineered by Shawn’s manager Sensational Sherri, as she was smitten with both men and didn’t want those good looks ruined! They actually honored that agreement for most of the match, though eventually Michaels did break it outside the ring. Overall, the match was good (though not as good as it could have been considering the participants) but what I enjoyed most was the storytelling. The two heels tying heelish tricks on each other while also trying to not hit each other in he face, and Sherri’s antics, as we wondered whether she’d stick with Shawn or leave with Rick Martel. Unfortunately, the match ended in a lame double countout. I had expected Michaels to win. It’s not like Martel hasn’t been doing any jobs lately or anything. Anyway, what caused the end of the match was Sherri fainting because she was so worried that they’d hit each other in the face. Michaels wen out to check on her, then Martel came out and shoved Michaels away and did CPR on Sherri. Thus, a fight erupts outside the ring and both men are counted out. The fight over the prostrate Sherri continues all the long way back to the dressing room, with Sherri being dropped or set down several times. Finally, Shawn is carrying her (still out cold, or pretending to be) and Rick Martel comes out with a bucket of water, plays to the crowd a but, and dumps the water on Sherri. This wakes her up. Shawn ignores Sherri and chases after Martel. Some really funny and entertaining moments there. I did like the overall story here, even if the wrestling wasn’t historic.
Next up is the Natural Disasters defending their tag team title against the Beverly Brothers. The two teams here were actually feuding with the two teams in the first matchup of the evening, but we got this matchup. For some reason I can’t fathom, they made the Natural Disasters faces earlier in the year. They were good as heels but I never bought them as babyfaces. Too big, not good at looking really in trouble, and they didn’t really play to the crowd. Plus they continued some heelish ways (not that they’re alone in that regard). I like the Beverly Brothers but I don’t think they were well utilized in the WWF.
Typhoon plays the face in peril (as usual) throughout most of this match, then Earthquake gets the hot tag and gets the squash for the pin shortly thereafter. Oh, and the Genius gets dumped afterwards for good measure. Anyway, this was a mediocre at best match.
We get an interview with the Bushwhackers to kill some time. Ugh. Where’s the fast forward button?
Also, we’ve had some interviews as Lord Alfred Hayes has been trying to figure out whose corner Mr Perfect will be in, to no avail.
Next up is Crush vs. Repo Man. This was never acknowledged, of course, but these guys were tag team partners in Demolition, as Repo Man used to be Smash. They repackaged Crush as a babyface after the dissolution of Demolition and never acknowledged that it was the same guy as from Demolition. He’s got a nice, bright color scheme with the purple and yellow. However, he’s got new tights for this match and I don’t like them as much. An orange top and purple legs. I think Crush has shown impressive athleticism in his squash matches prior to this (I think he’s only been involved in squashes and hasn’t had a feud yet) but his finisher, where he squeezes the guy’s head into submission, is kinda lame. Not as bad as when Sgt. Slaughter was using a noogie as a finisher, but still not good, though some in the crowds do seem to like it. As to the match, it wasn’t very good and was basically a squash for Crush, as he wins with his finisher.
Next up is Macho Man Randy Savage vs. the Ultimate Warrior for the WWF Championship!! This was a very good match, with a lot of back and forth. It went pretty long, too. They called this the featured match, yet it appears a little more than halfway through the match. The Intercontinental title match is really the featured match.
Warrior’s got on some really weird tights that are like an anatomical drawing of muscles. Kinda like Giant Gonzalez’s tights. It’s a really terrible look. Please go back to your other look, Warrior. He also wore a jacket with the Union Jack on it on his way to the ring. Playing up to the crowd, I guess. Both guys had bright pink in their wrestling outfits, by the way. Kinda cool.
Oh, and apparently Perfect wasn’t in anybody’s corner. He and Ric Flai came out and caused havoc to both Savage and Warrior. At one point, Savage is on the top rope (Warrior is laying out of it on the mat due to a cheap shot by Flair/Perfect) and Savage has to decide whether to jump off the top rope onto Warrior (thouh he didn’t see it, he realizes that Warrior is out because of Perfect’s doing, not his own) which would almost certainly get him the win, or jump on Flair, who is on the floor. He goes honorable and jumps on Flair. Flair hits Savage on the knee on the way down (which I guess the ref somehow missed) and Savage, laying on the ground in pain outside the ring, is counted out, giving Warrior the win but Savage retains the belt. Flair and Perfect then gang up on Savage, but Warrior gets up and comes to the rescue. Warrior then hands Savage the belt and helps the hobbled champion off to the locker room. Perhaps not quite as good as their Wrestlemania VII match, but very, very close. I didn’t like the countout ending, though. Too many copout endings at this PPV. Also, the ending here, where Savage had a chance to take advantage of a fallen foe to win the match but made the honorable choice, reminds me of the end of another recent babyface title match, Piper-Hart, where Piper had the bell and decided not to clobber Hart with it.
This match had good drama, though I wonder how there was no DQ after the Warrior was hit by a chair within view of the ref. By the way, McMahon’s habit of constantly prematurely calling the three count when it’s only two on a pinfall attempt is really annoying. By the way, at the end, when Warrio chases Flair & Perfect down the aisle, he throws a chair at them while on the run. That looked dangerous, if that thing hadn’t gone where he wanted, he could have clobbered a fan. I hope he practiced that beforehand.
In the ignoring current feuds department, Savage had been feuding with Flair (though that thing had passed its expiration date but the WWF is to low on top-of-the-card heels at this point that it dragged on for months after Wrestlemania VIII) and Ultimate Warrior had been feuding with Papa Shango.
Flair and Perfect in an interview afterwards say that that was Plan B and Flair will get the title back (which he will, by the way).
Next Match is the Undertaker vs. Kamala. Ugh, do I really have to watch this? Okay, I did. It was lousy, and had another lame DQ finish as the Undertaker gets the win. By the way, Undertake had been feuding with the Berserker (who tried to run him through with his sword) prior to this and I don’t think Kamala had a feud going. However, I did like the Undertaker’s entrance in a hearse, and I also liked the terrified look in Kamala’s face when the Undertake got up after Kamala’s top rope splash and chased (very slowly) Kamala & co. down the aisle.
Now we get to the real feature match. Bret Hart vs. the British Bulldog for the Intercontinental belt! Both guys cut pretty good promos earlier in the show. We get another great match here. They showed Bulldog’s wife (and Hart’s sister) Diana a lot to show how this match is tearing the family apart. She looks a lot like Meredith Baxter-Birney. Anyway, we get another great match, as Bulldog wins the title in his home country! Hart tried a sunset flip, but Bulldog dropped to his knees, hooked Bret’s arms, and rolled forward. This was probably the best match of the Summerslam. Also, I’ve heard that Bulldog was either exhausted, or maybe stoned or whatever, and forgot the moves that he and Bret had worked out, so Bret had to help him along. You could see that during the (frequent) rest holds like chinlocks, that Bret was indeed talking to Davey Boy. The end was cool, where Bulldog took the belt, then tried to shake Hart’s hand, and Hart started walking out of the ring (to a loud chorus of boos) then Hart changed his mind and came back in and shook hands then hugger, then Diana came into the ring with both of them. Anyway, still a fantastic match and Bret would move on to even bigger and better things.
Oh, and in the ignored rivalries department, Bret Hart had the aforementioned feud with Shawn Michaels and Bulldog had a feud with Reop Man. I don’t think that really went anyway, at least not on TV, even though Repo Man had basically hung Bulldog!
Bobby Heenan has been great on commentary, by the way. I’ll miss him when I make it up to 1993 in my chronological trip through the WWF/WWE.
Just some general comments. I don’t understand why Ric Flair didn’t wrestle here. Maybe he had an undisclosed injury? Also, note that all 3 belts were in babyface hands both at the beginning and the end of Summerslam. Heck, two title matches were face-face! That, plus the one heel-heel match and all of the ignored rivalries we got made this a very unusual – but overall quite good – Summerslam. Also, I have to say, the top-of-the-card heels are really weak at this point in time. Maybe that’s whe they had Savage wrestle another babyface for Summerslam, since the only top heel they’ve really got (with Ted DiBiase now being a tag team wrestler, due to injury, I think, and Shawn Michaels not yet at that level) was Ric Flair and that feud had already played out and lost steam. I think it may have been a mistake to turn some guys like the Undertaker and Natural Disasters babyface, since it really thinned out the heel side. Oh well.
All in all, three really good matches, and the rest were overall mediocre, but the Wembly Stadium atmosphere and crowd made this Summerslam feel extra special
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 22, 2023 12:38:27 GMT -5
Another great review, love your context and detail. Before I get into things, let me state that there was a Blu-ray release of this in the UK recently, which includes the “dark matches”: Jim Duggan & The Bushwhackers VS The Mountie & The Nasty Boys, El Matador VS Papa Shango, and Tatanka VS The Berzerker. I don’t believe these aired on PPV in the UK or US, but home video and Blu-ray releases included them. Whether you think those matches are worth owning the Blu-ray for, I do not know. (It’s nice that even in the age of the WWF/WWE Network, there can still be home video exclusives) As your review shows, so much change occurred in 1992, some of it unwise, e.g. your mention of thinning out the heel side. I believe Hogan, Piper and Jake leaving, not to mention the likes of Barbarian, Warlord and Sid Justice, left a hole. I’m not saying Macho Man would have defended his world title against Barbarian or Warlord, but perhaps against Sid Justice? I don’t know. I must correct you, my friend: you missed Hulk Hogan’s match. As did I. In his work of fiction…erm, I mean autobiography, he talked about wrestling at Wembley Stadium in 1992. And he mentioned his lies…erm, I mean anecdotes again when the usual media sycophants interviewed him recently. Oddly, he never mentions who his opponent was, just that he wrestled at Wembley Stadium in front of 80,000+ fans. Perhaps we’re wrong, though. Maybe he had a dark match against Skinner or Jim Powers after the Bret/Bulldog match went off the air. Or maybe the Hogan who shares anecdotes today is a Hogan from an alternate Earth who did wrestle at Wembley. One of life’s mysteries. Sorry for the rant. Briefly, about changes, I did read at the time that there was talk of Hogan vs. Papa Shango at the event. And then talk of Warrior vs. Papa Shango. And then Texas Tornado vs. Papa Shango. Well, poor Papa Shango got his match in the end, even if the PPV audience didn’t see it. Okay, since I *always* struggle with the quote function here, I’ll put your comments in italics, dbutler69 I could never understand the Rocco thing. Did McMahon think that this would make LOD more accessible and kid friendly, or was he just trying to make them look stupid? I suspect it’s the latter.I agree. Stupid for me, even as a kid. I remember WWF Magazine mentioning how Hawk and Animal had found Rocco among the ruins of their childhood home in Chicago. What?! Even by the cartoony nature of the WWF back then, that’s weird. It added nothing. And what a miracle: those guys were in their thirties in 1992, it’s amazing a dummy had survived among the ruins for 30+ years. Don’t demolition crews do clean-ups? And I ain’t on about the WWF’s Demolition. As far as ignoring rivalries, LOD had been feuding with the Beverly Brothers and Money Inc had been feuding with the Natural Disasters (whom they’d recently dropped the tag team belts to) but we don’t get either of those matchups here.Bizarre, eh? I remember many publications detailing how the LOD would get their shot at the tag belts. Even wrestling must follow logic. Surely under the kayfabe illusion, President Jack Tunney could have sanctioned an LOD/Disasters match. I’m sure if an opponent really wanted a shot at Tyson Fury’s belts, but Fury lost them, then one of boxing’s alphabet groups would book the would-be challenger to face the guy who dethroned Fury. (You made many valid points about this PPV ignoring prior feuds, so I won’t just copy your words; I do agree) Nailz versus Virgil is as you describe. I liked the novelty of Michaels/Martel because occasional heel versus heel bouts are fun, something we rarely saw back then; I’m still wondering whose corner Johnny Polo was in when his team The Quebecers took on Adam Bomb & Bam Bam Bigelow, given Polo was Bomb’s manager. So I like Michaels/Martel for the novelty and the hitting faces thing. For some reason I can’t fathom, they made the Natural Disasters faces earlier in the year. They were good as heels but I never bought them as babyfaces. Too big, not good at looking really in trouble, and they didn’t really play to the crowd. Plus they continued some heelish ways (not that they’re alone in that regard). Looking back, even as a Natural Disasters fan, that is a valid point. Ted DiBiase made a similar point on his podcast. Jake Roberts never really changed his style as a face or heel. Same Jake on either side. Yet, well, as heels, the Disasters were dominant and only really challenged if opponents were strong or cheating, but as babyfaces, they spent a lot of time subjected to rest holds and the like. I did enjoy the Macho Man/Warrior match, but I enjoyed their WM VII bout more. You know, many SummerSlam PPVs had odd exclusions and random matches at times. You and I discussed how the 1991 event didn’t even feature an Undertaker match, nor a Rockers match, but gave us Greg Valentine VS IRS. I like both men, but why were they fighting? Well, in 1992, why on earth was Ric Flair not in a match? Or Razor Ramon? I think Ramon had debuted around May 1992. Hated seeing Flair “demoted” to being ringside. No card can fit everyone on. This was a pretty loaded card. Other than Jim Powers, I can’t think of a babyface that Ramon could have faced. Or Flair. Owen Hart, maybe? Just seems wrong neither man had a match. Right, Bret vs Bulldog. Loved it. I had read the same about Davey Boy being stoned. I actually prefer their In Your House V match in 1995, although the dynamics were different due to Smith being a heel, so it’s an apples and orange comparison. They did good. It was odd to see a PPV main event in England, and with the main event being for a secondary title, but kudos to both men for what they did. Of course, the crowd were great. I wish I could have been there, but watching it on Sky Sports was good enough. Finally, the main event of Hulk Hogan vs. The Invisible Man. Don’t remember much about it, or how it was received after an intense Bret/Bulldog match, but since Hogan would never lie to us - right? - I will say that I hope it satisfied the crowd. Without getting too ahead of myself, you and I discussed the changes between WM VIII and this card. Well, it’s bizarre to think about the changes between this card and Survivor Series 1992. By the time that PPV aired, Warrior, Bulldog and the LOD were gone. The British Bulldog was set to defend the Intercontinental Championship against The Mountie, and Warrior was set to team with Randy Savage against Ric Flair and Razor Ramon. Yet by the time November arrives, Shawn is the Intercontinental champion, Mr. Perfect is back so he can replace Warrior, Davey Boy and LOD are gone, and Bret Hart is the world champion. How exhausting!
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Post by dbutler69 on Nov 22, 2023 16:06:11 GMT -5
Another great review, love your context and detail. Before I get into things, let me state that there was a Blu-ray release of this in the UK recently, which includes the “dark matches”: Jim Duggan & The Buswhackers VS The Mountie & The Nasty Boys, El Matador VS Papa Shango, and Tatanka VS The Berzerker. I don’t believe these aired on PPV in the UK or US, but home video and Blu-ray releases included them. Whether you think those matches are worth owning the Blu-ray for, I do not know. (It’s nice that even in the age of the WWF/WWE Network, there can still be home video exclusives) As your review shows, so much change occurred in 1992, some of it unwise, e.g. your mention of thinning out the heel side. I believe Hogan, Piper and Jake leaving, not to mention the likes of Barbarian, Warlord and Sid Justice, left a hole. I’m not saying Macho Man would have defended his world title against Barbarian or Warlord, but perhaps against Sid Justice? I don’t know. I must correct you, my friend: you missed Hulk Hogan’s match. As did I. In his work of fiction…erm, I mean autobiography, he talked about wrestling at Wembley Stadium in 1992. And he mentioned his lies…erm, I mean anecdotes again when the usual media sycophants interviewed him recently. Oddly, he never mentions who his opponent was, just that he wrestled at Wembley Stadium in front of 80,000+ fans. Perhaps we’re wrong, though. Maybe he had a dark match against Skinner or Jim Powers after the Bret/Bulldog match went off the air. Or maybe the Hogan who shares anecdotes today is a Hogan from an alternate Earth who did wrestle at Wembley. One of life’s mysteries. Sorry for the rant. Briefly, about changes, I did read at the time that there was talk of Hogan vs. Papa Shango at the event. And then talk of Warrior vs. Papa Shango. And then Texas Tornado vs. Papa Shango. Well, poor Papa Shango got his match in the end, even if the PPV audience didn’t see it. Okay, since I *always* struggle with the quote function here, I’ll put your comments in italics, dbutler69 I could never understand the Rocco thing. Did McMahon think that this would make LOD more accessible and kid friendly, or was he just trying to make them look stupid? I suspect it’s the latter.I agree. Stupid for me, even as a kid. I remember WWF Magazine mentioning how Hawk and Animal had found Rocco among the ruins of their childhood home in Chicago. What?! Even by the cartoony nature of the WWF back then, that’s weird. It added nothing. And what a miracle: those guys were in their thirties in 1992, it’s amazing a dummy had survived among the ruins for 30+ years. Don’t demolition crews do clean-ups? And I ain’t on about the WWF’s Demolition. As far as ignoring rivalries, LOD had been feuding with the Beverly Brothers and Money Inc had been feuding with the Natural Disasters (whom they’d recently dropped the tag team belts to) but we don’t get either of those matchups here.Bizarre, eh? I remember many publications detailing how the LOD would get their shot at the tag belts. Even wrestling must follow logic. Surely under the kayfabe illusion, President Jack Tunney could have sanctioned an LOD/Disasters match. I’m sure if an opponent really wanted a shot at Tyson Fury’s belts, but Fury lost them, then one of boxing’s alphabet groups would book the would-be challenger to face the guy who dethroned Fury. (You made many valid points about this PPV ignoring prior feuds, so I won’t just copy your words; I do agree) Nailz versus Virgil is as you describe. I liked the novelty of Michaels/Martel because occasional heel versus heel bouts are fun, something we rarely saw back then; I’m still wondering whose corner Johnny Polo was in when his team The Quebecers took on Adam Bomb & Bam Bam Bigelow, given Polo was Bomb’s manager. So I like Michaels/Martel for the novelty and the hitting faces thing. For some reason I can’t fathom, they made the Natural Disasters faces earlier in the year. They were good as heels but I never bought them as babyfaces. Too big, not good at looking really in trouble, and they didn’t really play to the crowd. Plus they continued some heelish ways (not that they’re alone in that regard). Looking back, even as a Natural Disasters fan, that is a valid point. Ted DiBiase made a similar point on his podcast. Jake Roberts never really changed his style as a face or heel. Same Jake on either side. Yet, well, as heels, the Disasters were dominant and only really challenged if opponents were strong or cheating, but as babyfaces, they spent a lot of time subjected to rest holds and the like. I did enjoy the Macho Man/Warrior match, but I enjoyed their WM VII bout more. You know, many SummerSlam PPVs had odd exclusions and random matches at times. You and I discussed how the 1991 event didn’t even feature an Undertaker match, nor a Rockers match, but gave us Greg Valentine VS IRS. I like both men, but why were they fighting? Well, in 1992, why on earth was Ric Flair not in a match? Or Razor Ramon? I think Ramon had debuted around May 1992. Hated seeing Flair “demoted” to being ringside. No card can fit everyone on. This was a pretty loaded card. Other than Jim Powers, I can’t think of a babyface that Ramon could have faced. Or Flair. Owen Hart, maybe? Just seems wrong neither man had a match. Right, Bret vs Bulldog. Loved it. I had read the same about Davey Boy being stoned. I actually prefer their In Your House V match in 1995, although the dynamics were different due to Smith being a heel, so it’s an apples and orange comparison. They did good. It was odd to see a PPV main event in England, and with the main event being for a secondary title, but kudos to both men for what they did. Of course, the crowd were great. I wish I could have been there, but watching it on Sky Sports was good enough. Finally, the main event of Hulk Hogan vs. The Invisible Man. Don’t remember much about it, or how it was received after an intense Bret/Bulldog match, but since Hogan would never lie to us - right? - I will say that I hope it satisfied the crowd. Without getting too ahead of myself, you and I discussed the changes between WM VIII and this card. Well, it’s bizarre to think about the changes between this card and Survivor Series 1992. By the time that PPV aired, Warrior, Bulldog and the LOD were gone. The British Bulldog was set to defend the Intercontinental Championship against The Mountie, and Warrior was set to team with Randy Savage against Ric Flair and Razor Ramon. Yet by the time November arrives, Shawn is the Intercontinental champion, Mr. Perfect is back so he can replace Warrior, Davey Boy and LOD are gone, and Bret Hart is the world champion. How exhausting! Thanks for the info about the dark matches. I was wondering why the Mountie, El Matador, and Tatanka hadn't been shown. Like you said, they can't show everybody. Still, Tatanka had been getting a really good push at this point so it's surprising that they didn't show his match. You're right about all those people leaving creating a hole. The early 90's were a time of big change in the WWF. A lot of talent left. Some joined also, sure, but not enough to fill that gap. I should really try to compile a list of who came and went during that time. And yeah, Savage vs. Sid Justice would have been a very noteworthy match. I guess either Hogan wrestled a dark match (probably a handicap match against 3 guys that he won/ of course) or it's the earth 2 Hogan who got transported here. Oh, I agree that the novelty of the Martel-Michaels match was fun. While I love the face vs. heel dynamic, it's nice to see a change every once in a while. Heel vs. heel matchups seem particularly rare, at least at this time. And I also agree that the Savage-Warrior match from WM VII was better, especially with the Elizabeth stuff at the end, but this one was still really good. And as far as Razor Ramon appearing here, he'd only made his in-ring televised WWF a few weeks earlier, so maybe they felt it was too soon to have him in a major PPV? Still, he's one of the best things the WWF have going at this point. I'd have lover to see a Razor Ramon vs. Owen Hart match, though!! Yup, more big changes on the way before my next PPV! I'm looking forward to the ride.
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 22, 2023 16:35:33 GMT -5
Good idea. I can remember years, but need to double-check dates. I mean, by the time of SummerSlam 1992, I’m pretty sure Colonel Mustafa and the Orient Express would have left the WWF. Yokozuna debuted probably a few days after PPV in an untelevised match, but I believe his on-screen debut was October 1992. Had he debuted a couple of months earlier, we’d have possibly seen him at Wembley.
I was thinking about Bob Backlund, but I think he probably returned to the WWF around December 1992 (or late November), so would have not had the opportunity to be at Wembley.
Overlap is an interesting topic. For example, Yokozuna debuted at a time when Ultimate Warrior was still with the WWF. I’m guessing there’d have been about 2 and a half or 3 weeks between Yokozuna arriving and Warrior leaving, but had Warrior stayed, I’m sure he’d have battled Yokozuna. And, of course, earlier in 1992, Warrior returned to the WWF at WM VIII at a time when Sid Justice was still there; while they probably had 2 house show matches or something, Sid was gone about 3 weeks after Warrior returned.
It’s interesting to think about all the times there was such overlap. Perhaps if Sid had stayed, he might have wrestled Warrior at Wembley.
They certainly were. Michaels/Martel aside, these are the only ones I remember as far as televised encounters are concerned:
Jake vs Savage (1986) Haku vs Harley Race (1989) Power & Glory vs The Orient Express (1991) Barbarian vs Berzerker (1991) Hercules vs The Warlord (1992, I guess) Repo Man vs Papa Shango (1992 or 1993) Rick Martel VS Bastion Booger (1993) The Quebecers vs Adam Bomb & Bam Bam Bigelow (1993 or 1994) Yokozuna vs King Mabel (1995)
There must be others, surely? On house shows. I think there could have been some great ones, I’d have liked to have seen Ted DiBiase vs. Mr Perfect, Rick Rude vs Haku, etc. It’s why I liked the Royal Rumble, that was one place to see heel vs heel.
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Post by commond on Nov 22, 2023 17:09:51 GMT -5
We had Power Slam on the newsstands in New Zealand.
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 22, 2023 17:17:36 GMT -5
We had Power Slam on the newsstands in New Zealand. Did you ever send a letter to the magazine?
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Post by commond on Nov 22, 2023 18:01:10 GMT -5
We had Power Slam on the newsstands in New Zealand. Did you ever send a letter to the magazine? Nah, I just flicked through it on the racks. At that stage, we had the internet at home so I was already reading all the news sites.
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Post by codystarbuck on Nov 22, 2023 20:59:09 GMT -5
I won’t be offended if anyone buys this for me: powerslammagazine.comI’m not sure if Power Slam was ever sold outside the UK. Did anyone here buy it? Running from 1994 until 2014 (although it had a prior incarnation as Superstars of Wrestling from 1992-94), it was an interesting publication, and a “gateway drug” to me becoming a fan of the insider stuff. The likes of WWF publications, Apter mags and Starlog mags, to name a few, were almost entirely kayfabe, although they’d break it if necessary, e.g. if something was too big to be ignored. Fun as they were, we got stories such as “What’s in the Undertaker’s urn?” or rivals exchanging insults over the phone. Except for rare occasions, the interviews were kayfabe. I’m not even sure whether the likes of Jesse Ventura and Bobby Heenan wrote their own columns, or whether a staffer “wrote with their voice”. I did enjoy “investigative reports” looking into whether Jack Tunney had been bribed by Ted DiBiase, or the search for the missing Undertaker in 1994. Of course, various newsletters were totally insider, as were some publications. I know you all know that. The reason I mention it is because Power Slam occupied a peculiar place in between, at least early on it its existence. It wasn’t totally insider, but it wasn’t totally kayfabe either. It’d treat events and storylines as real (as real as any wrestling can be reported) while not being afraid to mention wrestlers’ real names, suspensions, movements, etc. Of course, once the Montreal Screwjob happened, all pretence was gone. In a nutshell, Power Slam maintained the illusion of wrestling as far as was possible, while not insulting people’s intelligence. On a related note, WCW Magazine had different incarnations, one of which was published between 1991 and 1994. Missy Hyatt recently tweeted how one of her columns was written by Jim Ross. In that publication, there were columns by Jim Ross, Tony Schiavone and Gordon Solie, to name a few (Solie’s covered the history of wrestling). I wonder, were these columns written by Ross, Schiavone and Solie? If anyone could write their own columns, it’d be those men (hard to imagine anyone “writing in Solie’s style” to cover classic wrestling). Does anyone know for sure? Definitely not in the US, unless someone imported it. Most US Wrestling magazines, aside from the Apter magazines and the official ones were either dead or slowly dying. Last one I recall buying more than one issue was New Wave Wrestling, which was non-Kayfabe (more or less).
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 23, 2023 6:26:49 GMT -5
I like New Wave Wrestling. Like Power Slam, it seemed to straddle between maintaining the fun/illusion of kayfabe and respecting the intelligence of readers. I also liked that it had a worldwide section, I remember reading about wrestling in Africa and the like. Well, that gives me an excuse to share a pic of that publication’s first issue cover: ![](https://i.imgur.com/nB4yzS2.jpg)
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 23, 2023 7:43:30 GMT -5
Good luck: ![](https://i.imgur.com/WJ0vNMF.jpg)
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Post by driver1980 on Nov 24, 2023 6:36:25 GMT -5
Thirty years ago today, Survivor Series 1993 aired on PPV, taking place at the Boston Garden: ![](https://i.imgur.com/v3k4GT2.jpg) Of course, Undertaker replaced Tatanka, but I can’t find a poster with Undertaker on. I thought this was a solid PPV. Better than 1992, but not as good as the 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990 and 1991 events. At least this PPV returned to traditional elimination matches after the nonsense of 1992 (I hate the 1992 version). It’s interesting to think about how all four elimination matches resulted in babyface wins. This was a first. I quite enjoyed the All-Americans vs Foreign Fanatics. Looking back, though, I always felt it was odd how Ludvig Borga was a villain, given he was Finnish. I know wrestling had often presented Germans and Japanese as heels, long after WWII ended, and wrestling could be known for stereotypes, but Finland didn’t, to my knowledge, have any issues with the United States. Team Razor VS Team IRS was a fun bout, especially given the dissension between the heels. I was sad to see Mr. Perfect absent, but Randy Savage was a good replacement. The Hart Family VS Shawn Michaels & The Knights was decent - and it advanced the Bret/Owen story - but, really, Shawn Michaels had no storyline reason to be there, given the Bret/Lawler feud. I did quite enjoy The Four Doinks VS Bam Bam Bigelow. Doink not even showing up to his own match was a very “Doink thing” to do. Wrestling needs its humorous moments. I did also enjoy the commentary, Bobby Heenan could make almost anything work. When Booger is in the ring, Heenan says rather loudly, “What’s that smell?!” As for The Rock ‘n’ Roll Express VS The Heavenly Bodies, it was a decent bout, but I’m not sure the Boston crowd cared too much about it. I believe this PPV was the lowest buyrate for a Survivor Series at that point. Had the elimination concept worn thin? Were fans’ expectations that the event should feature more singles matches? I’m a Survivor Series puritan, I feel each event should SOLELY be elimination matches.
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