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Post by Cei-U! on Apr 6, 2022 4:47:48 GMT -5
Day Ten ChoicesSome always have G.I. Joe on their minds, maybe especially the animated series. Today I’m asking if any of these writers or artists who worked even a day on the OG cartoon are on your top 10 list: Steve Gerber, Russ Heath, Bruce Timm, Paul Dini, Gerry Conway, Denny O’Neil, Roy Thomas, or Marv Wolfman. Didn’t know they worked on it? Well now you do! Nobody known just for writing or art is going to make my list, period. To be in my Top Ten, they have to be the complete package (like Barks, Beto, or Kirby).
Cei-U! I summon the line drawn in the sand!
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Post by tarkintino on Apr 6, 2022 5:59:39 GMT -5
Day Ten ChoicesSome always have G.I. Joe on their minds, maybe especially the animated series. Today I’m asking if any of these writers or artists who worked even a day on the OG cartoon are on your top 10 list: Steve Gerber, Russ Heath, Bruce Timm, Paul Dini, Gerry Conway, Denny O’Neil, Roy Thomas, or Marv Wolfman. Didn’t know they worked on it? Well now you do! Gerber: no, despite being responsible for many fun stories.
Heath: no, but he's very likely in my top 40.
Timm: no, and as time has moved forward, I found him to be highly overrated, with his TV work being far less appealing than it used to be.
Dini: no.
Conway: Just outside of the top ten, but his contributions were grand, with one shaking the industry unlike anything before it, and everyone has been chasing that creative comet ever since.
In the "Resounding Yes" category:
O'Neil: Unlike Conway's single industry-shaking work, O'Neil produced more of them, forever altering / revolutionizing the way several major characters would be considered, and used as the template all other creator's work would be compared to (with two characters in particular).
Thomas: One the greatest examples of a fan knowing how to successfully create for the medium (which is rare). He was natural the heir-apparent to Stan Lee, and earned that title with one incredible run or invention after another. His re-shaping / maturing The Avengers stands as one of the jewels in the team book crown.
Wolfman: Where to start--Tomb of Dracula, Teen Titans, The New Teen Titans, Crisis on Infinite Earths, Green Lantern, and on and on. The next evolutionary step after Lee and Thomas, who was so adept at handling everything from personal stories to epics.
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 6, 2022 7:00:41 GMT -5
Day Ten ChoicesSome always have G.I. Joe on their minds, maybe especially the animated series. Today I’m asking if any of these writers or artists who worked even a day on the OG cartoon are on your top 10 list: Steve Gerber, Russ Heath, Bruce Timm, Paul Dini, Gerry Conway, Denny O’Neil, Roy Thomas, or Marv Wolfman. Didn’t know they worked on it? Well now you do! Nobody known just for writing or art is going to make my list, period. To be in my Top Ten, they have to be the complete package (like Barks, Beto, or Kirby).
Cei-U! I summon the line drawn in the sand!
Well, I see your point but many of the names you use never wrote something as good as Moore or Thomas or Wolfman.
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Post by Cei-U! on Apr 6, 2022 7:17:17 GMT -5
Nobody known just for writing or art is going to make my list, period. To be in my Top Ten, they have to be the complete package (like Barks, Beto, or Kirby).
Cei-U! I summon the line drawn in the sand!
Well, I see your point but many of the names you use never wrote something as good as Moore or Thomas or Wolfman. Sure they did (well, maybe not Kirby if we're looking strictly at his scripting, but nobody can beat him for sheer imagination). Moore is as elegant a wordsmith as anyone who ever worked in the medium, but I consider Barks his equal, if not his superior, at story construction and pacing. And any one of Beto's Palomar stories is better than everything Marv Wolfman ever wrote combined (and I say this as a HUGE fan of Tomb of Dracula and New Teen Titans).
Cei-U! I summon one man's opinion!
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Post by MDG on Apr 6, 2022 8:36:03 GMT -5
Day Ten ChoicesSome always have G.I. Joe on their minds, maybe especially the animated series. Today I’m asking if any of these writers or artists who worked even a day on the OG cartoon are on your top 10 list: Steve Gerber, Russ Heath, Bruce Timm, Paul Dini, Gerry Conway, Denny O’Neil, Roy Thomas, or Marv Wolfman. Didn’t know they worked on it? Well now you do! Nobody known just for writing or art is going to make my list, period. To be in my Top Ten, they have to be the complete package (like Barks, Beto, or Kirby).
Cei-U! I summon the line drawn in the sand!
Bingo! (Except in may case, I have one person who is solely a writer and another who is best known as an artist-for-hire, but has written several stories.)
Also, my list is not people who made "good comic book stories" but made good comics.
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Post by commond on Apr 6, 2022 8:46:06 GMT -5
Thomas: One the greatest examples of a fan knowing how to successfully create for the medium (which is rare). How is this rare? Almost everyone who followed Thomas was a fan of the medium.
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Post by commond on Apr 6, 2022 8:47:27 GMT -5
Well, I see your point but many of the names you use never wrote something as good as Moore or Thomas or Wolfman. Sure they did (well, maybe not Kirby if we're looking strictly at his scripting, but nobody can beat him for sheer imagination). Moore is as elegant a wordsmith as anyone who ever worked in the medium, but I consider Barks his equal, if not his superior, at story construction and pacing. And any one of Beto's Palomar stories is better than everything Marv Wolfman ever wrote combined (and I say this as a HUGE fan of Tomb of Dracula and New Teen Titans).
Cei-U! I summon one man's opinion!
Now I'm going to lie awake wondering whether any of the Palomar stories is better than everything Wolfman ever wrote combined. Not a bad thing to wonder about, all things considered.
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Post by badwolf on Apr 6, 2022 8:55:33 GMT -5
Maybe O'Neil and Wolfman.
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Post by Trevor on Apr 6, 2022 9:04:11 GMT -5
I’ll be out of town the next few days, but should be able to make the daily posts. Apologies in advance if the schedule gets a bit off.
Speaking of thread mechanics/maintenance issues, the inspiration for this thread is on day 23 or so and still going strong. The picks are getting a bit more ‘indy’, but still some heavy hitters most days. That group is probably way more geared to the esoteric and random than this group. I’m sensing a lot of ‘never even heard of thems’ in our future.
I don’t want to wear out the welcome of this topic. I guess I should not get ahead of ourselves and just see how things play out. The original place is about 10 days ahead of us here. But any thoughts on a maximum length of this thing? I was thinking of maybe combining some days/creators to speed it up a bit if people think we’re wearing out. Also, I have no idea where the original guy plans to go with this thing, perhaps we have interesting twists in store.
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Post by tarkintino on Apr 6, 2022 9:17:41 GMT -5
Thomas: One the greatest examples of a fan knowing how to successfully create for the medium (which is rare). How is this rare? Almost everyone who followed Thomas was a fan of the medium. Meaning its rare for fans who entered that field to be great. Most, by my estimation, are not.
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Post by arfetto on Apr 6, 2022 9:27:54 GMT -5
Speaking of thread mechanics/maintenance issues, the inspiration for this thread is on day 23 or so and still going strong. The picks are getting a bit more ‘indy’, but still some heavy hitters most days. That group is probably way more geared to the esoteric and random than this group. I’m sensing a lot of ‘never even heard of thems’ in our future. I would personally enjoy reading about the more esoteric comic picks, as it would give me more books to seek out haha.
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Post by MDG on Apr 6, 2022 9:29:24 GMT -5
How is this rare? Almost everyone who followed Thomas was a fan of the medium. Meaning its rare for fans who entered that field to be great. Most, by my estimation, are not. I think anyone who enters comics is a fan, considering the effort/reward ratio to make a living at it. The problem are the fans who get into comics and want to "fix things."
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Post by MDG on Apr 6, 2022 9:30:37 GMT -5
Speaking of thread mechanics/maintenance issues, the inspiration for this thread is on day 23 or so and still going strong. The picks are getting a bit more ‘indy’, but still some heavy hitters most days. That group is probably way more geared to the esoteric and random than this group. I’m sensing a lot of ‘never even heard of thems’ in our future. I would personally enjoy reading about the more esoteric comic picks, as it would give me more books to seek out haha. Esoteric, but also historical options.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Apr 6, 2022 9:46:15 GMT -5
Day Ten ChoicesSome always have G.I. Joe on their minds, maybe especially the animated series. Today I’m asking if any of these writers or artists who worked even a day on the OG cartoon are on your top 10 list: Steve Gerber, Russ Heath, Bruce Timm, Paul Dini, Gerry Conway, Denny O’Neil, Roy Thomas, or Marv Wolfman. Didn’t know they worked on it? Well now you do! Steve Gerber - I haven't read any of his work in years, but no, even though I'm a big fan of Howard the Duck. Russ Heath - Probably the highest on this list, but still not close to top 20 much less top ten. Bruce Timm - I love this artwork, but to me he's an animation guy. I love BTAS, but he's not in any way someone I think of as primarily a comic book guy. Paul Dini - See Timm, but with writing. Gerry Conway - Nah! When he's good he's good. But he hacked out a ton of bad stuff over the years. Denny O'Neil - No. Again, at one point in the past, but by and large his writing hasn't aged well for me. The Question is a definite exception to that rule. Roy Thomas - Once upon a time maybe, but those books barely hold up for me as nostalgia at this point. Marv Wolfman - Oh Lawd's no! I've come to pretty much actively dislike Wolfman's writing. I fear to re-read Tomb of Dracula because I used to love it and I don't want to find out it's as bad as the rest of his work.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2022 10:22:23 GMT -5
None of the listed creators today would even come close to cracking top 10. Russ Heath would be closest to cracking the top tier, as would Dini and Timm if I considered their work in animation in addition to their comic work, but on comic work alone, no.
I respect Gerber but his stuff doesn't resonate with me much.
Conway, O'Neil, Thomas and Wolfman have produced some good comics. But they have also produced a metric sh*t ton of pablum as well, and if you take their oeuvres as a whole there's probably more bad than good. The good really stands out, but it's islands in a sea of drek.
-M
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