Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2022 7:38:20 GMT -5
I re-read 1981’s Batman vs. The Incredible Hulk recently. I consider the best DC/Marvel crossover to be 1981’s Superman and Spider-Man. Batman vs. The Incredible Hulk is, in my opinion, solid at least, although it doesn’t impress me like other DC/Marvel collaborations.
Everyone knows the story, but a recap never hurts: the Shaper of Worlds manipulates the Joker into stealing the Gamma-Gun, Bats clashes with the Hulk after the Joker confuses the Green Goliath, Bats and Joker form an uneasy alliance after the Clown Prince of Crime gets in over his head, Batman and Hulk eventually team up to battle Joker, who is now omnipotent after the Shaper’s influence, the heroes win, etc, etc. There’s more to it than that, but that’s the potted version.
I wonder, is this the best story we could have seen? As a kid, the Shaper of Worlds seemed a peculiar choice for an opponent. I know he had debuted in the Hulk’s comic, but he and the Joker seemed strange bedfellows. Perhaps a more ordinary villain (relatively speaking), and a less cosmic plot, might have worked, but that’s just my view. I do wish Robin had appeared in the story, too.
There’s a lot to enjoy, particularly the art. I like the Batman/Hulk scraps. I like how Banner is taken in by Bruce Wayne. I like how Joker tells Hulk that they are friends due to having the same hair colour. The finale is okay-ish. But it does feel less than it could be. I mean, we see the rogues galleries of Batman and the Hulk, but only as physical manifestations, so those scraps don’t feel “real” to me. Hulk reducing Scarecrow to straw with one punch is fun, but as he and Bats are only fighting physical manifestations, it feels a bit of a cheat, like watching a dream wrestling match which is actually a virtual reality bout, e.g. if someone put Roman Reigns up against Lou Thesz via a computer screen.
I think an alliance such as Abomination/Joker or Leader/Joker, with less of a cosmic plot, would have been preferable. You can still keep the Gamma-Gun angle, the Bats/Hulk fight remains, but we have something more solid. And the finale could have had the likes of Hulk vs. Scarecrow, and Batman vs. Leader as real, actual scraps and not all part of some reality-warping shenanigans.
Perhaps I mix in different circles, but in all the time I’ve been a comic fan, as a kid and adult, I can’t say anyone has ever brought up or mentioned the Shaper of Worlds, but plenty of people have brought up the likes of Abomination and Leader whenever the topic has been the Hulk. I’ve never seen Shaper of Worlds figures, nor do I recall seeing him in cartoons. I am not aware of Kevin Feige mentioning any plans for him. Please correct me if I am wrong, but his appearances seem sporadic, and he seems like either a forgotten villain or a B-list one. So I find it bewildering that he was chosen to be part of the Batman/Hulk crossover.
I stand by my view: you could have had the same story of the Gamma-Gun and Bats vs Hulk without the need for the Shaper of Worlds. Yes, you’d have not needed/used the omnipotent Joker angle, but how necessary was that, really? Joker and Abomination (or Leader) scrapping against Bats and the Hulk in New Mexico would have been more compelling.
That is my humble opinion. What do you think? I am definitely willing to read and think about anyone who feels that the Shaper of World’s inclusion was the right decision.
Everyone knows the story, but a recap never hurts: the Shaper of Worlds manipulates the Joker into stealing the Gamma-Gun, Bats clashes with the Hulk after the Joker confuses the Green Goliath, Bats and Joker form an uneasy alliance after the Clown Prince of Crime gets in over his head, Batman and Hulk eventually team up to battle Joker, who is now omnipotent after the Shaper’s influence, the heroes win, etc, etc. There’s more to it than that, but that’s the potted version.
I wonder, is this the best story we could have seen? As a kid, the Shaper of Worlds seemed a peculiar choice for an opponent. I know he had debuted in the Hulk’s comic, but he and the Joker seemed strange bedfellows. Perhaps a more ordinary villain (relatively speaking), and a less cosmic plot, might have worked, but that’s just my view. I do wish Robin had appeared in the story, too.
There’s a lot to enjoy, particularly the art. I like the Batman/Hulk scraps. I like how Banner is taken in by Bruce Wayne. I like how Joker tells Hulk that they are friends due to having the same hair colour. The finale is okay-ish. But it does feel less than it could be. I mean, we see the rogues galleries of Batman and the Hulk, but only as physical manifestations, so those scraps don’t feel “real” to me. Hulk reducing Scarecrow to straw with one punch is fun, but as he and Bats are only fighting physical manifestations, it feels a bit of a cheat, like watching a dream wrestling match which is actually a virtual reality bout, e.g. if someone put Roman Reigns up against Lou Thesz via a computer screen.
I think an alliance such as Abomination/Joker or Leader/Joker, with less of a cosmic plot, would have been preferable. You can still keep the Gamma-Gun angle, the Bats/Hulk fight remains, but we have something more solid. And the finale could have had the likes of Hulk vs. Scarecrow, and Batman vs. Leader as real, actual scraps and not all part of some reality-warping shenanigans.
Perhaps I mix in different circles, but in all the time I’ve been a comic fan, as a kid and adult, I can’t say anyone has ever brought up or mentioned the Shaper of Worlds, but plenty of people have brought up the likes of Abomination and Leader whenever the topic has been the Hulk. I’ve never seen Shaper of Worlds figures, nor do I recall seeing him in cartoons. I am not aware of Kevin Feige mentioning any plans for him. Please correct me if I am wrong, but his appearances seem sporadic, and he seems like either a forgotten villain or a B-list one. So I find it bewildering that he was chosen to be part of the Batman/Hulk crossover.
I stand by my view: you could have had the same story of the Gamma-Gun and Bats vs Hulk without the need for the Shaper of Worlds. Yes, you’d have not needed/used the omnipotent Joker angle, but how necessary was that, really? Joker and Abomination (or Leader) scrapping against Bats and the Hulk in New Mexico would have been more compelling.
That is my humble opinion. What do you think? I am definitely willing to read and think about anyone who feels that the Shaper of World’s inclusion was the right decision.
