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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2023 11:07:15 GMT -5
By verified, I mean it has something like a COA or other certification to add some 'authenticity' to it.
For example, I recently got this book (my 4th copy of this rare 1:100 variant of USM #1) There are some who won't like this signed book simply because it doesn't have a yellow-label verification by CGC. But I don't care if it has a COA by a source I'm reasonably comfortable with. Midtown Comics has been doing signings for years, so has Dynamic Forces.
However, if it didn't have the COA I would admit I would have reservations about it.
I also know there are some who do not care if they personally witness a book being signed and no one else's opinion matters if they don't plan to part with the book.
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Post by codystarbuck on Apr 15, 2023 12:03:51 GMT -5
By verified, I mean it has something like a COA or other certification to add some 'authenticity' to it.
For example, I recently got this book (my 4th copy of this rare 1:100 variant of USM #1) There are some who won't like this signed book simply because it doesn't have a yellow-label verification by CGC. But I don't care if it has a COA by a source I'm reasonably comfortable with. Midtown Comics has been doing signings for years, so has Dynamic Forces.
However, if it didn't have the COA I would admit I would have reservations about it.
I also know there are some who do not care if they personally witness a book being signed and no one else's opinion matters if they don't plan to part with the book.
The only thing I care about is the interaction while the person signs it, in front of me. For me, a signature is a souvenir of a personal interaction with someone whose work means something to me. I ended up with a couple of signed comics, where I wasn't present, and a couple of books, bought second-hand. Those are nice and there is nothing to suggest fraud; but, then are just names, to me, since I didn't meet the person. So, a signature isn't going to get me to fork over money; the story and/or art will. As far as a certificate of validation, who validated the credentials of the issuer? It's an infinite progression. The creator signs, then someone has to validate that they signed? Then someone has to validate that that person is legit and so on, ad infinitum. A Certificate of Authenticity is no more authoritative than the actual signature. You can forge the signature but not the Certificate? Cobra Kai said it perfectly.... Seriously, though; it all depends on the faith you put into the situation or "validation," (which, is actually how currency works, but that's another topic). It ends up being psychological, anyway, as someone who desperately wants an item can rationalize away any warning sign or hesitation. Just look at the number of people who got burned in ponzi schemes, with pitches that wouldn't have fooled a dim 5 year-old? If you want the signature to be authentic, you will believe, with or without validation. As you say above, you have had good dealings with Midtown and DF; but, if the comics didn't come from them, would the certificate still have the same authenticity? Would you trust that a seller didn't forge it, knowing that people put trust in it? Working for a print company, I wouldn't, because I know how easy it is to reproduce such things, with the right source images and decent printing equipment (available at your local corporate print shop). I'm a cheap SOB, anyway, so I am always more interested in paying as little as possible; so, condition and signatures/variants, whatever have little meaning to me, if I want to read the story and see the artwork. As long as the price feels reasonable for what it is. That's why I don't get slabbing and such. If you just want to look at the cover, in perpetuity, why not just buy a cheaper reproduction, of just a loose cover, for a fraction of what someone is going to charge with their "CGC grading?" If you're not going to read the story or look over the interior art, does it matter what condition the guts are, or if they are even present? Me, I'm going to put my money in tulip bulb futures. |
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Post by Cei-U! on Apr 15, 2023 13:41:23 GMT -5
I don't need any kind of verification because, much like cody, all my signed books represent my meeting an admired creator and are usually personalized. I don't care about their resale value because A) the memories associated with them are priceless and B) I have no intention of selling them. What my heirs do with them after I'm gone is not my problem.
Cei-U!
I summon the treasured relics of a lifetime of collecting!
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Post by MDG on Apr 15, 2023 14:22:27 GMT -5
I think I only have two or three signed books where they weren't signed in front of my face, and I didn't know those were signed until I got home and took them out of the bag, so I wasn't paying a premium for a signature. (Not counting signed editions of books/bookplates which I assume are on the up and up.)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2023 14:49:12 GMT -5
As you say above, you have had good dealings with Midtown and DF; but, if the comics didn't come from them, would the certificate still have the same authenticity? Would you trust that a seller didn't forge it, knowing that people put trust in it? Working for a print company, I wouldn't, because I know how easy it is to reproduce such things, with the right source images and decent printing equipment (available at your local corporate print shop).
Depends on the seller. If it's a fairly established comic retailer and I've never heard reports about forged COAs, I'd be interested. The COAs below were done by one of England's top retailers from my hometown of Hertfordshire and both comic creators were at London Super Comic Con 2013. The comic signed was the store's exclusive variant.
I'm sure the retailer can also vouch for its COAs of the period as well. The Midtown COA looked like that back in 1999-2000 too.
Personally, I don't like the hassle of getting to a venue and having to line up to meet anyone so my own chances of meet-the-creators are quite slim.
Fortunately I didn't have to pay premiums for any of these signed books, the differences between signed and unsigned NM copies were negligible which made it a bit of a bonus imo.....
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Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2023 17:36:07 GMT -5
I'm with others in that the only signed books I have that matter are those I had signed when meeting a creator. I have a few books that are signed that were signed when I got them, but those were happy accidents, not planned purchases. I don't care if a signed book is authenticated or not because I am not paying a premium for a signed book either way. If it's marked up for a signature, I'm not buying it, so authentication is irrelevant to me.
-M
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Post by codystarbuck on Apr 15, 2023 19:00:30 GMT -5
As you say above, you have had good dealings with Midtown and DF; but, if the comics didn't come from them, would the certificate still have the same authenticity? Would you trust that a seller didn't forge it, knowing that people put trust in it? Working for a print company, I wouldn't, because I know how easy it is to reproduce such things, with the right source images and decent printing equipment (available at your local corporate print shop).
Depends on the seller. If it's a fairly established comic retailer and I've never heard reports about forged COAs, I'd be interested. The COAs below were done by one of England's top retailers from my hometown of Hertfordshire and both comic creators were at London Super Comic Con 2013. The comic signed was the store's exclusive variant.
I'm sure the retailer can also vouch for its COAs of the period as well. The Midtown COA looked like that back in 1999-2000 too.
Personally, I don't like the hassle of getting to a venue and having to line up to meet anyone so my own chances of meet-the-creators are quite slim.
Fortunately I didn't have to pay premiums for any of these signed books, the differences between signed and unsigned NM copies were negligible which made it a bit of a bonus imo.....
I'm not big on lines, either, unless it is someone I really want to meet. I have stood in line twice for signatures; once for Peter David and once for Marc Singer, the actor. The former was at Gencon and I did it with friends, who were fans of his Trek novels. I didn't care; but, since they wanted to get stuff signed, I brought along the first issue of Sachs and Violens, to get his signature and ask about a bunch of easter eggs, in a couple of panels, to see whether it was his idea or whether it was George Perez (It was pretty much Perez, as the extras in question came from his own interests). Because Gencon was an overlapping con of gamers, sci-fi and comics, there was a big crowd; so, we didn't get much time to do anything but say hello and get a signature. We were in line early and near the front; so, it was a short wait. With Marc Singer, I was at my first large convention and just buying stuff from my want list. I did get a copy of E-Man #1 signed by Joe Staton, and a sketch of Captain Marvel (the real one) from him; but, that was at his table, without lines. Singer appeared there, promoting Beastmaster 2. I stopped in to hear his Q&A and was entertained by his stories of V and Beastmaster. Then, they had a signing. My sister was a big fan of Beast master, lusting after Singer in his furry undies. So, as a gag gift, I bought a publicity phot of him in the costume, from a dealer, and stood in line for about 20 minutes to have him sign Happy Birthday to her. I then surprised her with it. The only signature I have that wasn't done in my presence or happened to be on a used copy I bought was a copy of the novel Thud!, signed by Terry Pratchett, at the Barnes & Noble store managers conference. When the company was in great shape, they flew in all the store managers for a pre-holiday planning conference, where publishers showed their titles they were promoting during the season and they got to meet prominent authors and get swag signed, to ship back to the stores. Pratchett was there and my boss knew I was a fan and had him sign a copy to me. This was just before he started having trouble and was diagnosed with a rare form of alzheimers, which affected his ability to tell his hands what to write. He had to switch to dictating his later books and could only sign his name, not personalized messages. Then, he deteriorated until he couldn't even do that. I adore his writing, both for their humor and their wisdom, as he slips a lot of philosophy and original thought in, with the jokes. So, it is a very precious item for me. However, I know it is a real signature, since my boss obtained it. I did pass on a chance to have a phot taken with former President Clinton, at a book signing in St Louis, but was too tired and wanted to get home. The event was at one of the larger of our St Louis stores and was limited to a 1000 tickets, which were issued in the morning. the signing was in the afternoon, after the store closed so that Secret Service agents could sweep the building. Then, only the ticket holders were admitted (through security screening) to have a copy of his memoirs signed. He took a group photo with the staff, which would then have copies distributed among them. I was a volunteer and came down from Springfield, IL, to assist overnight, to manage the crowd, while they assembled for the morning issuance of the event tickets. I helped answer questions and keep things orderly, as the crowd assembled, working all through the night, with a few other volunteers and support staff from the store. I was there until they issued the tickets, in the morning and then drove back home. The district manager offered to get me a hotel room, to get some sleep and come back to take the photo; but, I was tired and wanted to get home in daylight, after getting some caffeine, for the 2+ hour drive. I voted for Clinton and liked some things he accomplished and disliked other things, not to mention the messes he created for himself; but, it wasn't important enough to want to stick around another 8 hours. I wasn't going to get to actually meet him and shake hands or get a signed copy; so, I figured just being involved was enough. I knew I had been there. As it was, he was hospitalized for an emergency bypass operation, a few days later. That's what a 1000 signatures in one day will do to you! |
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Post by badwolf on Apr 17, 2023 12:00:33 GMT -5
I wouldn't pay more for a signature, but I don't believe that forged comic creator signatures is a booming business so as long as it looks genuine I am prepared to accept that it is genuine.
If we are talking about books that we got signed ourselves, then no I don't need proof. I was there!
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Post by james on Apr 17, 2023 12:28:26 GMT -5
Like many others if I got it signed by a creator I don't need a COA. The one or 2 that I have sold via Ebay I have always made it known there is no COA and that I was present when comic was signed. It has never stopped a fellow collector from buying from me.
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Post by Ozymandias on Apr 17, 2023 14:01:16 GMT -5
I wouldn't choose a signed comic over an unsigned one, even at the same price point. The grading is lowered.
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