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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 7:42:40 GMT -5
Hypothetical match-up between the teams in their classic 80's incarnations (they fight for whatever reason), who would take it do you think?
You've got brains and brawn on both teams, and power levels overall seem like a decent match-up. In picking the lineup on each side, I'm trying to keep a bit of balance. I'm taking Karma out of the equation since she was off the team early on and for a good stretch, though she might have been interesting against Jericho (who I did not include either)!
So in the Titans corner, I present the following:
Robin
Starfire
Cyborg
Wonder Girl
Changeling
Raven
Kid Flash
Terra
And in the New Mutants corner:
Cannonball
Magma
Mirage
Wolfsbane
Magik
Sunspot
Cypher
Warlock
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Post by impulse on Sept 26, 2023 9:09:31 GMT -5
Oh, that's interesting. See, I was a big time X-guy when I was collecting, so I'd want to root for Xavier's pals, but DC tends to just dominate on power levels of their heroes. I'm not overly familiar with the Titans, though, and at a glance those don't seem extravagantly powered. This is a tough one.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 26, 2023 9:37:28 GMT -5
at the power levels from the 80s? Titans, no question. I suspect Flash and Wonder Girl could take out the whole team by themselves. If you go by today's power levels.. it would be closer, but still the Titans I think, assuming raven could get them out of Limbo whem Magik tosses them there.
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Post by jester on Sept 26, 2023 10:12:37 GMT -5
I'm not overly familiar with the New Mutants, but I also have a tough time seeing them dealing with Kid Flash on top of everything else the Titans offer.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 10:38:10 GMT -5
Dani might be the key to taking Kid Flash down if she can act in time. I wouldn't count Magik out either. When you've got a psionic AND a teleporter on the team, I think it makes things kind of interesting (though the Titans can claim the same with Raven).
Warlock and Sunspot are going to be formidable against Wonder Girl and Cyborg. Cannonball against Starfire (Cannonball has more defense, Starfire has more offense). Magma versus Terra. Raven and Magik. Changeling and Wolfsbane. Combination of Dani and Doug against Robin maybe (Doug will need Warlock in actual battle though).
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Post by impulse on Sept 26, 2023 10:59:33 GMT -5
Do Kid Flash and Wonder Girl have equivalent power levels to their namesake? If so, I'm afraid I'd have to say the New Mutants get stomped.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 11:00:09 GMT -5
I'm thinking the more powerful members might give each a run for their money (again, if Kid Flash is taken out early which is possible but not easy), and it might come down to more smart leadership thinking on the parts of Robin and Dani. At this point, Robin is more tenured and his experience might give the edge. If there's a little deus ex machina power move to wrap things up, my money's on Raven or Magik pulling the trump card somehow.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 11:07:29 GMT -5
Do Kid Flash and Wonder Girl have equivalent power levels to their namesake? If so, I'm afraid I'd have to say the New Mutants get stomped. They are pretty up there I think. I was thinking Sunspot would have to deal with Wonder Girl, but he might be out-classed. Again, you aren't going to get Kid Flash on pure offensive power capabilities, I agree with that fully. |
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Post by Cei-U! on Sept 26, 2023 11:14:59 GMT -5
The Titans, easily, if for no other reason than Robin, Kid Flash, Wonder Girl and Changeling are all seasoned veterans of the super-hero game whereas all of the New Mutants are untrained rookies. Might as well put your high school's varsity basketball team up against the Lakers.
Cei-U!
Experience counts!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 11:29:46 GMT -5
Ok, I'll write my final version of this...
They get into a misunderstanding outside the mall in the parking lot (because they're teens).
Magma and Terra immediately go ballistic at each other, and their destructive battle meanders away from the main fray. Kid Flash is like, "I'll handle this" but Mirage throws up a horrifying illusion that stops him in his tracks and Sunspot uses the opportunity for a cheap shot and knocks him out cold.
Donna is immediately on it, and says, "you want a cheap shot, little man, how about this?" and sends Roberto flying. Cannonball engages in some aerial ballet with Starfire and says in his Southern drawl, "now ah don't want to hurt uh lady..." to which Starfire replies "I am NO lady, but you are kind of cute" and starts chasing him and blasting away.
Changeling tries to flirt/fight with Wolfsbane which drives her nuts and she attacks savagely. He turns "tail" (literally) and is like "what am I supposed to do, I don't want to hurt her, she's just a kid like me!"
Raven tells Magik she senses evil in her, to which Magik says "tell me something I don't know" and the Soulsword comes out. They end up doing some teleporting, end up in Limbo at some point, they bounce back to reality, and Magik says "don't play with me witch!".
Warlock quickly shuts down Cyborg (somehow overloading his circuitry) and then goes to try to help Sunspot, but Donna starts cleaning up the floor with both of them.
Robin and Dani don't fight but start arguing who's fault this is, with Doug standing by saying "uh, guys, this is getting out of hand". Dani sees Donna beating the team and runs to help and Robin tries to stop her. Dani attempts to use her powers on Robin but he's too quick and takes her out quickly. Starfire returns carring a knocked out Cannonball, Donna has taken care of her two folks, Changeling has become a giant snake and has Wolfsbane contained. Raven then casts a powerful spell that knocks everyone back and she declares the fight ended.
The New Mutants still escape as Magik is able to do a desperate teleport to get them out of there, but the Titans have won. Except everyone forgot about Terra and Magma. They somehow ended up in Jersey and do untold levels of damage before they both collapse.
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Post by rberman on Sept 26, 2023 11:40:28 GMT -5
Supercat has the right idea. As always, either team can win, depending on what the author wants. So outcome is irrelevant; the character interactions along the way are more important. Therefore, the tactical ability of a speedster to win almost any fight in a millisecond must be ignored, in favor of him doing one memorable thing and then patiently waiting his turn until everyone else has had a chance to respond.
I may or may not steal this idea for a future commission from an artist.
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Post by Cei-U! on Sept 26, 2023 12:02:27 GMT -5
...the tactical ability of a speedster to win almost any fight in a millisecond must be ignored... This is why I don't like characters with super-speed. My suspension of disbelief is strong, but not limitless.
Cei-U! I summon the brakes!
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Post by Dizzy D on Sept 26, 2023 16:39:57 GMT -5
I think the Mutants also lack the raw power to deal with the Titans. The only real powerhouses are Warlock, who is very much not agressive and looks to others to guide him when it comes to conflict, Magma, whose power is as much a threat to her own time as her opponents if she really lets loose, and Magik, whose magical powers seem very limited when she is on Earth and not in her home dimension.
Mirage and Illyana are also the only one who seem to have any fighting experience before joining their teams while the Titans have several well-trained fighters at this point.
The Mutants do have one big advantage: Terra is a traitor who does not have the Titans best interest at heart, but I see no reason why she would break her cover at this point. Though Mirage could reveal some interesting things about her to her own team.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 17:02:22 GMT -5
...the tactical ability of a speedster to win almost any fight in a millisecond must be ignored... This is why I don't like characters with super-speed. My suspension of disbelief is strong, but not limitless.
Cei-U! I summon the brakes!
I totally get it. I mean, yes, on paper Kid Flash should have a crazy advantage level, but if the regular Flash can genuinely be threatened by a guy who throws boomerangs, I don't feel like the New Mutants should get the short end of that argument. They've got better than boomerangs is all I'm saying  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2023 17:11:58 GMT -5
Mirage and Illyana are also the only one who seem to have any fighting experience before joining their teams while the Titans have several well-trained fighters at this point. I really like this argument, similar to what Cei-U! was saying as well. Not dismissing the power levels of course, but how many times have we seen Captain America do amazing things above his supposed "power level" just because his experience, tactical know-how etc. is just off the charts. The Titans really do have the clear advantage when it comes to experience...I mean, Robin leads the team for a reason, it's certainly not his power level. But I do hear folks on the power level part as well, Titans definitely have some serious horsepower, no doubt. |
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