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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2023 14:46:08 GMT -5
Also in the category of "what were they thinking"...beloved classic Legion of Super-Heroes writer Paul Levitz returns in 2010. Much excitement...can he work his magic again?
No. He immediately shows Mon-El and Shadow Lass as broken up (for some unexplainable reason), and he promptly has Shadow Lass fall into a very "mature themes" depicted relationship with some dork named "Earth-Man".
It's almost like Paul was going, "I may be older, but I can still be cool! This is what today's readers want, yeah". I still love his old material, but this stuff was just sad. In NO shape or form do I consider it canon either.
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Post by k7p5v on Oct 10, 2023 14:54:06 GMT -5
I thought Len Kaminski was going to fix it in the early 90s, but it didn't quite happen. Nowadays we just get Tony paired with the writers favorite female Marvel character out of the blue for no reason... Slott had him with Janet Van Dyne.. Cantwell Patsy Walker, now there's the whole Emma Frost thing. Well, there's precedent for Stark and Janet in Avengers #224 - they had a one-issue fling, with pretty much all of the other Avengers none too happy with it (a feeling I shared). I know, right?! Here's proof...
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 10, 2023 15:28:07 GMT -5
I was going to post Colossus and Kitty as well, hated that break-up. They should never have been a couple in the first place. A 19-year-old boy and a 13-year-old girl? Inappropriate at best, downright creepy at worst.
Cei-U! I summon the Claremontian faux pas!
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Post by wildfire2099 on Oct 10, 2023 16:42:53 GMT -5
Ages are fluid though.... I mean, they didn't start dating until Kitty had been around a while.... she was well on her way to catching up
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Post by rberman on Oct 10, 2023 17:08:00 GMT -5
Ages are fluid though.... I mean, they didn't start dating until Kitty had been around a while.... she was well on her way to catching up Certainly Claremont never wrote her like a 13 year old girl. He wouldn't have known how!
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Post by Batflunkie on Oct 10, 2023 17:21:06 GMT -5
I think the one that messed with me the most was Steve and Bernie, it's one of the reasons why I don't particularly care for Gruenwald's run on the character
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 10, 2023 17:46:15 GMT -5
I think the one that messed with me the most was Steve and Bernie, it's one of the reasons why I don't particularly care for Gruenwald's run on the character Agreed. I really liked Bernie and the rest of the Brooklyn-based supporting cast that Stern created and DeMatteis developed. Gruenwald writing them out and making Cap a nomadic loner again felt like a huge step backward.
Cei-U! I summon the let-down!
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Oct 10, 2023 17:49:34 GMT -5
I think the one that messed with me the most was Steve and Bernie, it's one of the reasons why I don't particularly care for Gruenwald's run on the character Agreed. I really liked Bernie and the rest of the Brooklyn-based supporting cast that Stern created and DeMatteis developed. Gruenwald writing them out and making Cap a nomadic loner again felt like a huge step backward.
Cei-U! I summon the let-down!
This seems like a classic example of "I'm going to write the book the way it was when I was a fan." And there have been a lot of writers who have followed his lead, i.e. Geoff Johns.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2023 18:07:47 GMT -5
I was going to post Colossus and Kitty as well, hated that break-up. They should never have been a couple in the first place. A 19-year-old boy and a 13-year-old girl? Inappropriate at best, downright creepy at worst.
Cei-U! I summon the Claremontian faux pas!
Those were supposed to be the ages?! Say what?! Dang, couldn’t agree more.
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Post by Rob Allen on Oct 10, 2023 18:15:14 GMT -5
I recently read that at one time it was considered ideal for a male college freshman (usually age 18) to date a female high school freshman (usually age 14). After their respective graduations, he'd be ready to be a breadwinner and she'd have enough home ec classes to be a housewife, at the ages of 21 and 17 or so.
Some people call that "the good old days".
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Post by DubipR on Oct 10, 2023 18:40:08 GMT -5
Nightwing and Starfire. I know he was destined to be with Babs but I really liked Dick and Kory together. Honestly its his best relationship, aside schtupping pretty much most of the DCU's female population.
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Post by Batflunkie on Oct 10, 2023 18:53:06 GMT -5
Agreed. I really liked Bernie and the rest of the Brooklyn-based supporting cast that Stern created and DeMatteis developed. Gruenwald writing them out and making Cap a nomadic loner again felt like a huge step backward.
Cei-U! I summon the let-down!
This seems like a classic example of "I'm going to write the book the way it was when I was a fan." And there have been a lot of writers who have followed his lead, i.e. Geoff Johns. Besides Bernie and Jack leaving, the biggest problem I had with Gruenwald's tenure (not that I'm trying to derail the thread here) was that Steve really didn't have an identity of his own outside of Cap. IDK, felt like it was kind of betraying the very basis of what made the character so relatable in the first place
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 10, 2023 19:46:06 GMT -5
Nightwing and Starfire. I know he was destined to be with Babs but I really liked Dick and Kory together. Honestly its his best relationship, aside schtupping pretty much most of the DCU's female population. Dick and Barbara is another couple I had problems with. When first introduced, Babs was a PhD with several years' worth of work experience and Dick was still in high school. That kind of age difference doesn't matter much with older adults (my sister was 15 years older than her last husband) but seems pretty creepy when one partner is still in their teens. And who says they were destined to be together?
Cei-U! I summon the bat-cougar!
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Oct 10, 2023 19:48:34 GMT -5
This seems like a classic example of "I'm going to write the book the way it was when I was a fan." And there have been a lot of writers who have followed his lead, i.e. Geoff Johns. Besides Bernie and Jack leaving, the biggest problem I had with Gruenwald's tenure (not that I'm trying to derail the thread here) was that Steve really didn't have an identity of his own outside of Cap. IDK, felt like it was kind of betraying the very basis of what made the character so relatable in the first place I've read next to nothing that Gruenwald wrote. I had pretty much left Marvel completely behind by the time he became a regular writer except for very very select titles that hit my sweet spot. It seems that way to me because what's the point of re-treading ground that's already been trod upon a number of times.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Oct 10, 2023 20:10:40 GMT -5
I agree 100% about Dick and Kori.. I just didn't post it again here because I have a bunch of times elsewhere. I THINK in the current timeline Dick and Barbara closer to the same age.. but during the silver age, definitely not. Never mind the creepiness of a Dick-Barbara-Bruce love triangle.
I agree Cap having a supporting cast is better... he has one again in the last run, though that could certainly be short-lived with the books changing hands again. It was pretty good though.
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