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Post by swansong on Aug 14, 2024 3:59:06 GMT -5
 Action Comics #503 Story: "A Save in Time!" Writer: Cary Bates Penciler: Curt Swan Inker: Frank Chiaramonte It's a space tin cuttlefish that saves our future! We're back with a story by the legendary Cary Bates, who, despite possibly having written the most Superman stories, is largely forgotten today, especially in the context of pre-Crisis Superman. It's worth pondering how little of what he and Maggin contributed has truly stuck in the mythos. The story kicks off with Superman encountering a mysterious comet in space. His X-ray vision fails, so he does what any hero would—flies straight into it! This causes the comet to head directly toward Earth (Metropolis, of course). Suddenly, a strange metallic creature, resembling a cuttlefish or vacuum cleaner, appears and disintegrates the comet. Superman barely notices it. Back on Earth, Superman stops a car from hitting a pedestrian, inadvertently causing a limousine full of gangsters to crash. Naturally, he brings them to justice. Meanwhile, the metallic entity observes him, revealing that it was sent by a future species that dumps its waste into the distant past. When these accidents threaten history, the entity steps in to fix them. Superman's earlier intervention has caused a dangerous time flux. Lana Lang, visiting a shady psychic named Kolzer, quickly realizes his "prophecies" are based on hidden cameras. She leaves, but Kolzer predicts a future connection between them. Later, Superman learns that Kolzer had stolen an anti-gravity device from STAR Labs, and after a confrontation, Kolzer dies of a heart attack. The entity reappears, explaining that by saving Lana, Superman has averted a catastrophe—Lana was destined to play a crucial role in the future. In summary, this Bronze Age tale is whacky and fun, albeit not one of Bates' best works. It's more of a sci-fi story with a twist than a deep character piece. The heavy reliance on exposition is typical of the era, which can be both helpful and a reason these comics often get a bad rap. Curt Swan's art, because of being paired with Chiaramonte's inking, doesn’t shine as brightly as it could. Rating: 3/5 |
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Post by codystarbuck on Aug 14, 2024 11:01:40 GMT -5
Bates & Maggin were my primary Superman writers; but, they also had to work within the established framework, as dictated to them by Julie Schwartz. Both did some great stuff with characters and concepts established in the Silver Age and added new layers to them. With the revamp jettisoning so much of the Silver Age concepts, their material couldn't easily be revisited, though Morrison's All-Star Superman read very "Maggin," to me. As far as I am concerned, Maggin wrote the best mad scientist Lex Luthor in the business. Lot more depth, in his hands.
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Post by swansong on Aug 15, 2024 3:12:33 GMT -5
 DC Comics Presents #17 Story: "The Ice Slaves of Killer Frost" Writer: Gerry Conway Pencils: José Luis García-López Inks: Steve Mitchell Guest Star: Firestorm That title sounds more appropriate for a Conan story! For the first time in this thread, Superman teams up with someone else—Firestorm. Superman is invited to STAR Labs, where they have the villainess Killer Frost on ice. Yes, she’s an ice-based creature trapped in ice! Apparently, she’s a man-hater who wants to enslave the male sex. A middle-aged scientist bursts in, warning them not to thaw her—that’s why STAR Labs invited Superman. He’s supposed to use his heat vision to free her body for study. The scientist is thrown out, and without thinking twice, Superman uses his heat vision. Hilariously, the ice shatters, and Superman has to protect everyone else in the room. Surprise—Killer Frost isn’t dead! She enslaves Superman and tries to build a gigantic refrigerator to take over the world. The scientist who tried to warn them? He’s actually part of the superhero Firestorm. The other part is a young athlete playing in a basketball game when the scientist suddenly decides to fuse them into Firestorm. After explaining the situation, Firestorm attacks Killer Frost (whose real name is Crystal Frost—seriously, that’s so DC!). She’s using Superman to build her world-enslaving ice machine. As Firestorm attacks, he actually says he "forgot" about Superman protecting her. Yeah, that’s seriously a detail to gloss over! Firestorm and Superman slug it out. Firestorm drills into the Earth to use the heat of the lava down there to break the spell on Superman! It works. They both attack Killer Frost (who has now enslaved the scientist to build her world domination machine) and trick her with a Superman decoy carved out of ice (apparently, only Firestorm and Superman together can construct that with their combined power). In the end, they win, and Firestorm might join the Justice League. Okay, in the last story I reviewed, I mentioned that it wasn’t a slugfest. This is. This is nothing but fighting and action. The concept of Firestorm could be creepy—this older man decides to just "fuse" with the younger one—but this isn’t elaborated on. Also, there isn’t much depth to Killer Frost—why is she the way she is? And there’s not much about Superman either, except that, like in the last issue where he just flew into the mysterious comet, here he just uses his heat vision to free the villain without even thinking for five minutes! It’s not a bad story, but quite generic. Of course, there’s José Luis García-López! He’s obviously a great artist and the natural successor to Curt Swan. But that never materializes! Was this ever an option? Or was he too slow to draw a monthly series? His style here seems to still be closer to the "house" style heralded by Curt Swan (which Swan took from Wayne Boring but modified). Later, García-López’s Superman will be leaner in contrast to the stockier, barrel-chested Superman of Boring/Swan. José Luis García-López is far from being a showy artist. His artistry is marked by a more realistic approach, with precisely posed figures and clean lines. 2.5/5 |
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Post by Icctrombone on Aug 15, 2024 4:21:56 GMT -5
DC Comics Presents #17 Story: "The Ice Slaves of Killer Frost" Writer: Gerry Conway Pencils: José Luis García-López Inks: Steve Mitchell Guest Star: Firestorm That title sounds more appropriate for a Conan story! For the first time in this series, Superman teams up with someone else—Firestorm. Superman is invited to STAR Labs, where they have the villainess Killer Frost on ice. Yes, she’s an ice-based creature trapped in ice! Apparently, she’s a man-hater who wants to enslave the male sex. A middle-aged scientist bursts in, warning them not to thaw her—that’s why STAR Labs invited Superman. He’s supposed to use his heat vision to free her body for study. The scientist is thrown out, and without thinking twice, Superman uses his heat vision. Hilariously, the ice shatters, and Superman has to protect everyone else in the room. Surprise—Killer Frost isn’t dead! She enslaves Superman and tries to build a gigantic refrigerator to take over the world. The scientist who tried to warn them? He’s actually part of the superhero Firestorm. The other part is a young athlete playing in a basketball game when the scientist suddenly decides to fuse them into Firestorm. After explaining the situation, Firestorm attacks Killer Frost (whose real name is Crystal Frost—seriously, that’s so DC!). She’s using Superman to build her world-enslaving ice machine. As Firestorm attacks, he actually says he "forgot" about Superman protecting her. Yeah, that’s seriously a detail to gloss over! Firestorm and Superman slug it out. Firestorm drills into the Earth to use the heat of the lava down there to break the spell on Superman! It works. They both attack Killer Frost (who has now enslaved the scientist to build her world domination machine) and trick her with a Superman decoy carved out of ice (apparently, only Firestorm and Superman together can construct that with their combined power). In the end, they win, and Firestorm might join the Justice League. Okay, in the last story I reviewed, I mentioned that it wasn’t a slugfest. This is. This is nothing but fighting and action. The concept of Firestorm could be creepy—this older man decides to just "fuse" with the younger one—but this isn’t elaborated on. Also, there isn’t much depth to Killer Frost—why is she the way she is? And there’s not much about Superman either, except that, like in the last issue where he just flew into the mysterious comet, here he just uses his heat vision to free the villain without even thinking for five minutes! It’s not a bad story, but quite generic. Of course, there’s José Luis García-López! He’s obviously a great artist and the natural successor to Curt Swan. But that never materializes! Was this ever an option? Or was he too slow to draw a monthly series? His style here seems to still be closer to the "house" style heralded by Curt Swan (which Swan took from Wayne Boring but modified). Later, García-López’s Superman will be leaner in contrast to the stockier, barrel-chested Superman of Boring/Swan. José Luis García-López is far from being a showy artist. His artistry is marked by a more realistic approach, with precisely posed figures and clean lines. 2.5/5 I don't understand what you mean by "For the first time in this series, Superman teams up with someone else." This series is a team up book.Or are you referring to this thread ? Jose Garcia Lopez is far and above Curt Swan. He's considered one of the top illustrators in all of comics for the last 40 years or so. And yes, he is slow. Maybe you have to look at some of his other work. He's primarily a DC artist. Killer frost was introduced in the Firestorm series and her motivations are covered there. I don't remember what I've read about her. It's possible that this is a generic story because Conway had been known to hack out a few in his day. |
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Post by swansong on Aug 15, 2024 4:42:58 GMT -5
DC Comics Presents #17 Story: "The Ice Slaves of Killer Frost" Writer: Gerry Conway Pencils: José Luis García-López Inks: Steve Mitchell Guest Star: Firestorm That title sounds more appropriate for a Conan story! For the first time in this series, Superman teams up with someone else—Firestorm. Superman is invited to STAR Labs, where they have the villainess Killer Frost on ice. Yes, she’s an ice-based creature trapped in ice! Apparently, she’s a man-hater who wants to enslave the male sex. A middle-aged scientist bursts in, warning them not to thaw her—that’s why STAR Labs invited Superman. He’s supposed to use his heat vision to free her body for study. The scientist is thrown out, and without thinking twice, Superman uses his heat vision. Hilariously, the ice shatters, and Superman has to protect everyone else in the room. Surprise—Killer Frost isn’t dead! She enslaves Superman and tries to build a gigantic refrigerator to take over the world. The scientist who tried to warn them? He’s actually part of the superhero Firestorm. The other part is a young athlete playing in a basketball game when the scientist suddenly decides to fuse them into Firestorm. After explaining the situation, Firestorm attacks Killer Frost (whose real name is Crystal Frost—seriously, that’s so DC!). She’s using Superman to build her world-enslaving ice machine. As Firestorm attacks, he actually says he "forgot" about Superman protecting her. Yeah, that’s seriously a detail to gloss over! Firestorm and Superman slug it out. Firestorm drills into the Earth to use the heat of the lava down there to break the spell on Superman! It works. They both attack Killer Frost (who has now enslaved the scientist to build her world domination machine) and trick her with a Superman decoy carved out of ice (apparently, only Firestorm and Superman together can construct that with their combined power). In the end, they win, and Firestorm might join the Justice League. Okay, in the last story I reviewed, I mentioned that it wasn’t a slugfest. This is. This is nothing but fighting and action. The concept of Firestorm could be creepy—this older man decides to just "fuse" with the younger one—but this isn’t elaborated on. Also, there isn’t much depth to Killer Frost—why is she the way she is? And there’s not much about Superman either, except that, like in the last issue where he just flew into the mysterious comet, here he just uses his heat vision to free the villain without even thinking for five minutes! It’s not a bad story, but quite generic. Of course, there’s José Luis García-López! He’s obviously a great artist and the natural successor to Curt Swan. But that never materializes! Was this ever an option? Or was he too slow to draw a monthly series? His style here seems to still be closer to the "house" style heralded by Curt Swan (which Swan took from Wayne Boring but modified). Later, García-López’s Superman will be leaner in contrast to the stockier, barrel-chested Superman of Boring/Swan. José Luis García-López is far from being a showy artist. His artistry is marked by a more realistic approach, with precisely posed figures and clean lines. 2.5/5 I don't understand what you mean by "For the first time in this series, Superman teams up with someone else." This series is a team up book.Or are you referring to this thread ? Review series! |
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Post by nairb73 on Aug 15, 2024 5:19:44 GMT -5
Welcome back, swansong!
ACTION COMICS 503 is, IMO, too typical of Bates' Superman work. He was capable of memorable stories(# 500 was masterful, and 502 wasn't too shabby, either), but here, yet again, Bates is almost compelled to introduce an odd 'Asimov by way of 'Star Trek' alien character, part of some race that will never appear again, and make us sit through that wonderful exposition you mentioned...at an even slower pace than usual!
And this time, it's combined with a 'weird guy attracted to Lana' plot.
No real payoff, other than Lana luvving to live...oops...living to 'Luv' another day!
At least, it isn't quite as big a 'waste' as the 'faux comet' was!
Moving on to DCCP 17:
My first issue of this title since # 4(I had 'Whitman' editions of the first 4 issues), and my introduction to Firestorm and his icy adversary.
Conway had a knack for moving stories along, especially the 17-pagers of that era, and, after doing some yawning through the ironically-titled ACTION 503, I appreciated the faster pace here, even though some more background on Firestorm might have helped.
Conway was re-introducing his creation here,since 'Stormy' hadn't been seen since the 'Implosion' in 1978. Throwing him up against 'Frosted Supes'("Part of a complete breakfast!"), and having him improv a quick trip to the Earth's core for the 'deFrosting', showed that Ronnie wasn't nearly as rusty as he thought!
Five months after this story, in JUSTICE LEAGUE # 179, we found out Ronnie's answer to Supes's invitation. It helped make JLA my co-favorite DC title...along with DCCP, of course!
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Post by swansong on Aug 15, 2024 5:28:03 GMT -5
Welcome back, swansong! ACTION COMICS 503 is, IMO, too typical of Bates' Superman work. He was capable of memorable stories(# 500 was masterful, and 502 wasn't too shabby, either), but here, yet again, Bates is almost compelled to introduce an odd 'Asimov by way of 'Star Trek' alien character, part of some race that will never appear again, and make us sit through that wonderful exposition you mentioned...at an even slower pace than usual! And this time, it's combined with a 'weird guy attracted to Lana' plot. No real payoff, other than Lana luvving to live...oops...living to 'Luv' another day! At least, it isn't quite as big a 'waste' as the 'faux comet' was! Fully agreed here—we'll see as I progress and read more of Bates' stories. But since I've just started, it's hard to put everything into a wider perspective. And yes, "too typical of Batess Superman work" - but this is what I was yearning for at this moment! Perhaps it will get annyoing at some point  |
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Post by nairb73 on Aug 15, 2024 5:30:34 GMT -5
DC Comics Presents #17 Story: "The Ice Slaves of Killer Frost" Writer: Gerry Conway Pencils: José Luis García-López Inks: Steve Mitchell Guest Star: Firestorm That title sounds more appropriate for a Conan story! For the first time in this series, Superman teams up with someone else—Firestorm. Superman is invited to STAR Labs, where they have the villainess Killer Frost on ice. Yes, she’s an ice-based creature trapped in ice! Apparently, she’s a man-hater who wants to enslave the male sex. A middle-aged scientist bursts in, warning them not to thaw her—that’s why STAR Labs invited Superman. He’s supposed to use his heat vision to free her body for study. The scientist is thrown out, and without thinking twice, Superman uses his heat vision. Hilariously, the ice shatters, and Superman has to protect everyone else in the room. Surprise—Killer Frost isn’t dead! She enslaves Superman and tries to build a gigantic refrigerator to take over the world. The scientist who tried to warn them? He’s actually part of the superhero Firestorm. The other part is a young athlete playing in a basketball game when the scientist suddenly decides to fuse them into Firestorm. After explaining the situation, Firestorm attacks Killer Frost (whose real name is Crystal Frost—seriously, that’s so DC!). She’s using Superman to build her world-enslaving ice machine. As Firestorm attacks, he actually says he "forgot" about Superman protecting her. Yeah, that’s seriously a detail to gloss over! Firestorm and Superman slug it out. Firestorm drills into the Earth to use the heat of the lava down there to break the spell on Superman! It works. They both attack Killer Frost (who has now enslaved the scientist to build her world domination machine) and trick her with a Superman decoy carved out of ice (apparently, only Firestorm and Superman together can construct that with their combined power). In the end, they win, and Firestorm might join the Justice League. Okay, in the last story I reviewed, I mentioned that it wasn’t a slugfest. This is. This is nothing but fighting and action. The concept of Firestorm could be creepy—this older man decides to just "fuse" with the younger one—but this isn’t elaborated on. Also, there isn’t much depth to Killer Frost—why is she the way she is? And there’s not much about Superman either, except that, like in the last issue where he just flew into the mysterious comet, here he just uses his heat vision to free the villain without even thinking for five minutes! It’s not a bad story, but quite generic. Of course, there’s José Luis García-López! He’s obviously a great artist and the natural successor to Curt Swan. But that never materializes! Was this ever an option? Or was he too slow to draw a monthly series? His style here seems to still be closer to the "house" style heralded by Curt Swan (which Swan took from Wayne Boring but modified). Later, García-López’s Superman will be leaner in contrast to the stockier, barrel-chested Superman of Boring/Swan. José Luis García-López is far from being a showy artist. His artistry is marked by a more realistic approach, with precisely posed figures and clean lines. 2.5/5 I don't understand what you mean by "For the first time in this series, Superman teams up with someone else." This series is a team up book.Or are you referring to this thread ? Jose Garcia Lopez is far and above Curt Swan. He's considered one of the top illustrators in all of comics for the last 40 years or so. And yes, he is slow. Maybe you have to look at some of his other work. He's primarily a DC artist. Killer frost was introduced in the Firestorm series and her motivations are covered there. I don't remember what I've read about her. It's possible that this is a generic story because Conway had been known to hack out a few in his day. Conway and DC were testing the waters for interest in Firestorm. That not-too casual 'Ya know, kid, you really kicked my frozen Super-butt, and since the JLAers have also had to do that now and then, you might as well join 'em...whaddya say?' left it up to the fans(or at least the letter-writers) to decide the course of Firestorm's future. The fans chose wisely. |
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Post by nairb73 on Aug 15, 2024 5:34:44 GMT -5
Welcome back, swansong! ACTION COMICS 503 is, IMO, too typical of Bates' Superman work. He was capable of memorable stories(# 500 was masterful, and 502 wasn't too shabby, either), but here, yet again, Bates is almost compelled to introduce an odd 'Asimov by way of 'Star Trek' alien character, part of some race that will never appear again, and make us sit through that wonderful exposition you mentioned...at an even slower pace than usual! And this time, it's combined with a 'weird guy attracted to Lana' plot. No real payoff, other than Lana luvving to live...oops...living to 'Luv' another day! At least, it isn't quite as big a 'waste' as the 'faux comet' was! Fully agreed here—we'll see as I progress and read more of Bates' stories. But since I've just started, it's hard to put everything into a wider perspective. And yes, "too typical of Batess Superman work" - but this is what I was yearning for at this moment! Perhaps it will get annyoing at some point Well, recalling how you didn't care for that Steve Lombard scene in SUPERMAN 343(and Bates didn't even write that issue!)...you can expect more of that. Thankfully, not in every issue...but a lot. |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Aug 15, 2024 8:19:36 GMT -5
That sounds fun.. early Firestorm stories are usually pretty great. I don't think the dynamic between Ronnie and Prof. Stein was ever meant to be creepy... If anything, Prof. Stein got the raw end of the deal.
I do thing that set up of having an advisor in the superheroes ear started there, and of course now is extremely popular (just with a radio now)
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Post by Icctrombone on Aug 15, 2024 8:54:20 GMT -5
I never heard anyone refer to the Firestorm relationship as creepy. Until today.
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Post by Chris on Aug 15, 2024 18:15:21 GMT -5
The concept of Firestorm could be creepy—this older man decides to just "fuse" with the younger one—but this isn’t elaborated on. If you aren't familiar with the character of Firestorm, he can be confusing. To clarify, Stein did not decide to fuse with Ronnie, he was utterly terrified for his life and triggered the fusion unconsciously. At this point, Stein didn't even know he was part of Firestorm. As for creepy, well yes, but creepy in the other direction. Because not only did Stein not know, Ronnie wouldn't tell him. They both attack Killer Frost (who has now enslaved the scientist to build her world domination machine) and trick her with a Superman decoy carved out of ice (apparently, only Firestorm and Superman together can construct that with their combined power). It's actually a power of Firestorm's, but the story didn't have space to explain how it works in detail. Another reason Firestorm is confusing. Also, there isn’t much depth to Killer Frost—why is she the way she is? As the kids say today, "it's complicated." Her backstory was explained in an issue of Firestorm's own series, but in short, she had a LOT of bad luck with men, she blames a man (specifically Stein) for turning her into an ice woman, and now she hates men. here he just uses his heat vision to free the villain without even thinking for five minutes! He expected something to happen, even says so at the top of page 4. Of course, there’s José Luis García-López! He’s obviously a great artist and the natural successor to Curt Swan. But that never materializes! Was this ever an option? Or was he too slow to draw a monthly series? His style here seems to still be closer to the "house" style heralded by Curt Swan (which Swan took from Wayne Boring but modified). Garcia-Lopez was indeed too slow to draw a monthly series. Thing is, he was originally assigned as the regular artist on DC Comics Presents, and drew the first 4 issues, but that's because the book was scheduled as a bi-monthly. When it got changed to monthly, that's when the rotating artists started. Editor Julius Schwartz still wanted Garcia-Lopez to be a regular Superman artist and take over for Swan when he retired, and he got Garcia-Lopez to draw as many Superman stories as possible, but then the DC Production Department hired Garcia-Lopez full time, and that was the end of that. As for looking like Swan's work, he obviously had to keep "on model," but his version usually didn't look quite as much like Swan. I think Steve Mitchell's heavy-handed inking was similar to Frank Chiaramonte's heavy-handed inking of Swan around this time. Both inkers used a lot of black shadowing made people look bulkier than normal. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Aug 15, 2024 18:30:16 GMT -5
If you google the name Crystal Frost, you will find articles about DC's Killer Frost, a fantasy author by that name, the lead character in a teen prose series, and a fetish model, among others. So, a supervillain with that name isn't the most bizarre thing out there.  |
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Post by nairb73 on Aug 15, 2024 20:57:24 GMT -5
One last thing about Martin Stein: It's eventually clarified that he retains memory of Firestorm while he and Ronnie are fused(share and share alike), but,in the earliest stories, once they separate, Martin remembers nothing.
Ronnie explains the situation to him, repeatedly(sort of like a weirdly specific version of Adam Sandler and Drew Barrymore in '50 First Dates'), and,eventually, Martin retains more and more. After the first year or so of 'Fury of Firestorm'(1982-83), Stein's pretty well up to speed.
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Post by chadwilliam on Aug 16, 2024 0:51:44 GMT -5
Action Comics #503 Superman has a brief exchange with a pedestrian whom he saves from getting run over by a pair of crooks in their getaway car.  He goes on to advise the fellow "in the future, cross at the green -- not in between!". I get that the sequence is meant to be tongue in cheek, but, man, I feel like we're at a turning point turning downwards here for the character what with a little too much of the dorky Clark Kent faux persona starting to seep into Superman's real personality. The Christopher Reeve movie (only a couple of years old at this point) had that too what with stuff like "Statistically speaking, it's still the safest way to travel" peppered throughout and it's making me wonder if perhaps that's where the "Superman is an uncool boy scout" trope first took root. I have to say, it isn't one of the finer cornerstones of its legacy. |
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