|
Post by MWGallaher on Oct 14, 2023 8:30:39 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history.
And he wouldn't have wanted a rival publisher snapping up the rights for cheap.
|
|
|
Post by Cei-U! on Oct 14, 2023 9:50:24 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history. And he wouldn't have wanted a rival publisher snapping up the rights for cheap. Yeah, this.
Cei-U! I summon the brilliant backstopping!
|
|
|
Post by zaku on Oct 14, 2023 9:59:33 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history. And he wouldn't have wanted a rival publisher snapping up the rights for cheap. It was a thing in the early 80s? Buying characters from defunct publishers and relaunch them?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2023 10:13:55 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history. And he wouldn't have wanted a rival publisher snapping up the rights for cheap. It was a thing in the early 80s? Buying characters from defunct publishers and relaunch them? Sure, like First Comics aquiring publishing rights for E-Man from Charlton (who were near their end) and relaunching it in 1983.
|
|
|
Post by Cei-U! on Oct 14, 2023 10:15:40 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history. And he wouldn't have wanted a rival publisher snapping up the rights for cheap. It was a thing in the early 80s? Buying characters from defunct publishers and relaunch them? Oh, yeah. DC's attempts to monetize the Fawcett and Quality characters inspired loads of imitators. Two different publishers, for example, launched lines using the Tower characters and Americomics' whole shtick was reviving defunct Golden Age heroes, frequently renamed to avoid legal hassles with the Big Two who had characters with the same name (i.e., Lev Gleason's Daredevil became Red Devil).
Cei-U! I summon the precedent!
|
|
|
Post by MDG on Oct 14, 2023 10:53:22 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history. Karl Kesel told me at a con that when he was inking some book w/ Sarge Steel in it (Suicide Squad?), when he received the pages, the Steel character was already inked by Giordano.
|
|
|
Post by MWGallaher on Oct 14, 2023 11:42:53 GMT -5
As I recall, Giordano had a sentimental attachment to the Charlton Action Heroes, particularly to Sarge Steel, which he had drawn, since as editor he had spearheaded this stretch of Charlton's publishing history. Karl Kesel told me at a con that when he was inking some book w/ Sarge Steel in it (Suicide Squad?), when he received the pages, the Steel character was already inked by Giordano. Giordano also laid a similar claim to the Human Target, doing the penciling or inking on every solo story up to 1991's HUMAN TARGET SPECIAL. He must have been jealous of his babies.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2023 12:01:34 GMT -5
On a somewhat related note, I was trying to remember how the Airboy relauch thing worked for Eclipse and looked it up. If I'm reading this correctly, they made the connection around 1982 that the older copyright was going to expire in 1986 and stayed quiet hoping nobody else would figure it out. And when nobody else did, they launched the 1986 title.
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Oct 14, 2023 17:32:49 GMT -5
It was a thing in the early 80s? Buying characters from defunct publishers and relaunch them? Oh, yeah. DC's attempts to monetize the Fawcett and Quality characters inspired loads of imitators. Two different publishers, for example, launched lines using the Tower characters and Americomics' whole shtick was reviving defunct Golden Age heroes, frequently renamed to avoid legal hassles with the Big Two who had characters with the same name (i.e., Lev Gleason's Daredevil became Red Devil).
Cei-U! I summon the precedent!
Americomics did briefly license the rights to the Charlton 'Action Heroes' in 1983 just before DC bought them outright. The published a Blue Beetle/Question team-up that had originally been intended for Charlton Bullseye, and did a one-shot of a team called the Sentinels of Justice consisting of Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, the Question and Nightshade. After they lost the rights, they kept the Sentinels name and created a new team to fill it, although Scarlet Scorpion was Blue Beetle with the serial numbers filed off.
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Oct 14, 2023 18:37:24 GMT -5
On a somewhat related note, I was trying to remember how the Airboy relauch thing worked for Eclipse and looked it up. If I'm reading this correctly, they made the connection around 1982 that the older copyright was going to expire in 1986 and stayed quiet hoping nobody else would figure it out. And when nobody else did, they launched the 1986 title. More or less, yeah. It was in the public domain and, quite frankly, no one was likely to want it, as it seemed very 1940s. Had Tim Truman not been involved, I doubt they would have gotten as much mileage out of it, as they did. However, Eclipse could not own the character, once it entered the public domain; only their version of it. Others could use the characters. The problem would be the trademark on the Airboy title, which Eclipse filed, which would prevent anyone else from calling their book Airboy, but not prevent them from featuring him. For clarification, look at The Black Terror. Eclipse published a title with that character and featured him in Total Eclipse; but, Tom Artis also self-published a Black Terror comic, just calling him the Terror. Later, Alan Moore included the Nedor characters in Tom Strong, and then their own minis, using The Black Terror (just called The Terror) and sidekick Tim. Dynamite's Super Powers series also used that character and other Nedor and similar defunct characters. There were a lot of old characters brought back. DC acquired the Quality Comics characters and titles early on, then later revived Captain Marvel; first licensing him and then buying him outright. They acquired the Charlton Action Heroes when they came up for sale; but, not Thunderbolt, who was owned by Pete Morisi. He licensed the character to DC; but, he was seen only in Crisis, until near the end of their option, when they put out that 12 issue series and Alex Ross used him in Kingdom Come. Then, it reverted back to Morisi. Eclipse used the Hillman characters, for Airboy and Nedor's Black Terror, once they were all in the public domain. They also reprinted some public domain horror and exploitation comics. AC did their revivals, including reprinting a bunch of Magazine Enterprise western comics, including Best of the West and Bob Benson. They also reprinted some Nyoka and used the character in Femforce. Dynamite's Super Powers uses characters from Nedor and several other Golden Age publishers. Catman has been published by AC and Dynamite. E-Man was not acquired by First, it was published by them, but the copyright was owned by Nicola Cuti and Joe Staton and Staton brought it to Frist, where he was also the Art Director, for a bit. He then took ti to Comico and then Alpha, with Cuti reuniting with him on those projects. Marty Pasko did the First stories, for the most part. Charlton basically sold off original art and titles. DC got most of the Action Heroes, except Thunderbolt, though they found that Charlton may not have owned Blue Beetle, leading to the later change, there, so they had clear ownership of a Blue Beetle character. Ditko, through Robin Snyder, reacquired a lot of his art and individual stories, other than the Action Hero stuff. Roger Broughton bought the lion's share of the remaining material, which he used for reprint comics, via his Avalon and ACG imprints. He also acquired some of the old ACG properties, like Nemesis, Magicman and Herbie. He also published one issue of Sam Glanzman's Tales of Sherwood, but not more, despite having the artwork, from Glanzman. Will Franz did an ending for Willy Schultz, from Fightin' Army; but, Broughton never published it, nor did Glanzman get a chance to draw it. Dark Horse finally did publish it, with Wayne Vansant illustrating the final story, since Sam had passed away
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Oct 14, 2023 18:55:45 GMT -5
Oh, yeah. DC's attempts to monetize the Fawcett and Quality characters inspired loads of imitators. Two different publishers, for example, launched lines using the Tower characters and Americomics' whole shtick was reviving defunct Golden Age heroes, frequently renamed to avoid legal hassles with the Big Two who had characters with the same name (i.e., Lev Gleason's Daredevil became Red Devil).
Cei-U! I summon the precedent!
Americomics did briefly license the rights to the Charlton 'Action Heroes' in 1983 just before DC bought them outright. The published a Blue Beetle/Question team-up that had originally been intended for Charlton Bullseye, and did a one-shot of a team called the Sentinels of Justice consisting of Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, the Question and Nightshade. After they lost the rights, they kept the Sentinels name and created a new team to fill it, although Scarlet Scorpion was Blue Beetle with the serial numbers filed off. Slight correction here; Charlton did publish the Blue Beetle & Question team-up, in Charlton Bullseye #1 (comic book version, not the fanzine version). The Americomics Special #1, featuring Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, The Question and Nightshade, as the Sentinels of Justice was published with unused material from Charlton Bullseye (they had an inventory of material, when Charlton cancelled the title); and, Americomics #3 was published with two Blue Beetle stories, the lead story featuring the Ted Kord version battling the Dan Garrett version, who turns out to be a robot. The Question did not appear in that comic. By that point, DC had finalized their purchase. Americomics was also supposed to publish an unused Atomic mouse story, as well as more Blue Beetle and Captain Atom. However, with the sale to DC, their agreements with Charlton were out the window, as revealed int he Americomics special. Here are editorial explanations, from those comics: Americomics #3, featuring Blue Beetle..... From the end of the Sentinels of Justice story, in the Americomics Special #1
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2023 19:15:11 GMT -5
E-Man was not acquired by First, it was published by them, but the copyright was owned by Nicola Cuti and Joe Staton and Staton brought it to Frist, where he was also the Art Director, for a bit. He then took ti to Comico and then Alpha, with Cuti reuniting with him on those projects. Marty Pasko did the First stories, for the most part. My understand was that First actually did acquire it from Charlton and then part of the deal to bring Staton over was that he would eventually get the rights by repaying First, though Joe shared in this interview how it went down: "The deal with E-Man was that I had an arrangement with First Comics so that they bought the rights to E-Man from Charlton, and then I was to repay First all their expense out of my royalties. The rights to E-Man were then supposed to revert to me completely. But some of us needed more lawyers than we knew, and the end result of how it stands, as I understand it, is that I have the right to do any new E-Man stories I want to, and I have the right to license any new E-Man material I want. Ken Levin, the lawyer for First, controls the rights to what First published. To keep the rights unified, Ken and I decided he would represent the whole E-Man package. ... [W]hatever I get in, Nick [Cuti] gets 50%, but so far, it's been nothing." On Airboy, that's right, they couldn't own the character outright, I think the point was just being the first to relaunch and yeah, Truman was definitely a driver in that success. I'm not sure if there would have been a total lack of interest by others, but maybe. A lot of other 40s stuff was getting revived in the Bronze Age though (like DC bringing the aforementioned Quality stuff back in the 70's).
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Oct 14, 2023 19:57:17 GMT -5
E-Man was not acquired by First, it was published by them, but the copyright was owned by Nicola Cuti and Joe Staton and Staton brought it to Frist, where he was also the Art Director, for a bit. He then took ti to Comico and then Alpha, with Cuti reuniting with him on those projects. Marty Pasko did the First stories, for the most part. My understand was that First actually did acquire it from Charlton and then part of the deal to bring Staton over was that he would eventually get the rights by repaying First, though Joe shared in this interview how it went down: "The deal with E-Man was that I had an arrangement with First Comics so that they bought the rights to E-Man from Charlton, and then I was to repay First all their expense out of my royalties. The rights to E-Man were then supposed to revert to me completely. But some of us needed more lawyers than we knew, and the end result of how it stands, as I understand it, is that I have the right to do any new E-Man stories I want to, and I have the right to license any new E-Man material I want. Ken Levin, the lawyer for First, controls the rights to what First published. To keep the rights unified, Ken and I decided he would represent the whole E-Man package. ... [W]hatever I get in, Nick [Cuti] gets 50%, but so far, it's been nothing." On Airboy, that's right, they couldn't own the character outright, I think the point was just being the first to relaunch and yeah, Truman was definitely a driver in that success. I'm not sure if there would have been a total lack of interest by others, but maybe. A lot of other 40s stuff was getting revived in the Bronze Age though (like DC bringing the aforementioned Quality stuff back in the 70's). What is the source of the Staton quotes? Not questioning it; just I don't recall ever coming across that one. The biggest discussion I ever saw was the Comic Book Artist two issue look at Charlton, which Staton took part in (Cuti, too, I think, but wouldn't swear to). If it is that, then I just didn't recall them saying that. I do recall that type of circumstance in Baron & Rude regaining Nexus, via Dark Horse. The latter part of the Staton quotes sounds familiar, like the CBA articles. If it was CBA, then I must of overlooked that statement, while staring at a Staton drawing of Nova or one of his other Charlton ladies (he drew his women.....healthy, in those days).
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2023 20:02:27 GMT -5
My understand was that First actually did acquire it from Charlton and then part of the deal to bring Staton over was that he would eventually get the rights by repaying First, though Joe shared in this interview how it went down: "The deal with E-Man was that I had an arrangement with First Comics so that they bought the rights to E-Man from Charlton, and then I was to repay First all their expense out of my royalties. The rights to E-Man were then supposed to revert to me completely. But some of us needed more lawyers than we knew, and the end result of how it stands, as I understand it, is that I have the right to do any new E-Man stories I want to, and I have the right to license any new E-Man material I want. Ken Levin, the lawyer for First, controls the rights to what First published. To keep the rights unified, Ken and I decided he would represent the whole E-Man package. ... [W]hatever I get in, Nick [Cuti] gets 50%, but so far, it's been nothing." On Airboy, that's right, they couldn't own the character outright, I think the point was just being the first to relaunch and yeah, Truman was definitely a driver in that success. I'm not sure if there would have been a total lack of interest by others, but maybe. A lot of other 40s stuff was getting revived in the Bronze Age though (like DC bringing the aforementioned Quality stuff back in the 70's). What is the source of the Staton quotes? Not questioning it; just I don't recall ever coming across that one. The biggest discussion I ever saw was the Comic Book Artist two issue look at Charlton, which Staton took part in (Cuti, too, I think, but wouldn't swear to). If it is that, then I just didn't recall them saying that. I do recall that type of circumstance in Baron & Rude regaining Nexus, via Dark Horse. The latter part of the Staton quotes sounds familiar, like the CBA articles. If it was CBA, then I must of overlooked that statement, while staring at a Staton drawing of Nova or one of his other Charlton ladies (he drew his women.....healthy, in those days). Comic Book Artist #12, and here's a link to the excerpted interview, it's down a bit: twomorrows.com/comicbookartist/articles/12staton.html
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Oct 14, 2023 20:58:23 GMT -5
Americomics did briefly license the rights to the Charlton 'Action Heroes' in 1983 just before DC bought them outright. The published a Blue Beetle/Question team-up that had originally been intended for Charlton Bullseye, and did a one-shot of a team called the Sentinels of Justice consisting of Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, the Question and Nightshade. After they lost the rights, they kept the Sentinels name and created a new team to fill it, although Scarlet Scorpion was Blue Beetle with the serial numbers filed off. Slight correction here; Charlton did publish the Blue Beetle & Question team-up, in Charlton Bullseye #1 (comic book version, not the fanzine version). The Americomics Special #1, featuring Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, The Question and Nightshade, as the Sentinels of Justice was published with unused material from Charlton Bullseye (they had an inventory of material, when Charlton cancelled the title); and, Americomics #3 was published with two Blue Beetle stories, the lead story featuring the Ted Kord version battling the Dan Garrett version, who turns out to be a robot. The Question did not appear in that comic. By that point, DC had finalized their purchase. Americomics was also supposed to publish an unused Atomic mouse story, as well as more Blue Beetle and Captain Atom. However, with the sale to DC, their agreements with Charlton were out the window, as revealed int he Americomics special. Thanks for the correction. I was relying on my notoriously faulty memory, bolstered by a quick visit to Wikipedia.
Bur at least I can take comfort that I didn't imagine AC publishing the Charlton characters.
|
|