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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 11, 2019 18:23:04 GMT -5
Also, the person that was hunting them was called the Seeker and he was taking and treating the Royal family like dirt. I understand that he was following Maximius' orders but he was too into the job. Plus , they were terrified of him although their powers were more formidable than his armies. The introduction of Gorgon was also a mess, as he was sadistically staking Medusa. It all seems out of place when you read the outcome of the story.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Jun 11, 2019 19:10:45 GMT -5
And then Black Bolt comes back to his kingdom and Maximus is all "Okay, I guess you're king now. I didn't plan on you coming back to the place where you live! Who could have ever forseen that!"
(I think both Black Bolt (JUST Black Bolt) and Medusa are pretty great names, though!)
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 11, 2019 19:15:48 GMT -5
You like the name Boltigon?
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Post by Farrar on Jun 11, 2019 22:57:02 GMT -5
I've been reading the Fantastic Four from issue 39 to 62 . How did Medusa go from being a murderess B***h to a loving doting member of the Inhumans and why did she even join the Frightful Four? I'm guessing Lee and Kirby had no plan and were just making it up as they went along.I agree. For one thing the story seemed to be going in the direction of a Medusa-Johnny romance*** in #43 (when he lets her escape at the end) and then when they meet up again in #44. But that direction is dropped once the other Inhumans (with Crystal) are introduced. Also, fwiw Medusa's backstory, with the amnesia, being recruited by the Wizard and joining the Frightful Four, yadda yadda yadda, is related in a 1990 Inhumans King-Size Special called (what else? ) The Inhumans: The Untold Saga #1. Here's a link to a summary of the events in that issue: www.supermegamonkey.net/chronocomic/entries/inhumans_the_untold_saga_1_inh.shtmlThe story may have been sitting on the shelf for a while before its publication in 1990. ETA: ***And yes, I am aware that many decades later Medusa and Johnny do hook up (for a short time)
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Post by Farrar on Jun 12, 2019 8:52:35 GMT -5
There's an issue of Marvel Super-Heroes (#16, I think) that (if I remember correctly) goes into this a bit. Something like "The Inhumans want to find out about the outside world so Medusa goes out into the world and falls in with a bad crowd who convince her that the FF are bad guys." It has some wonderful Gene Colan art and some wacky Marvel Golden Age reprints! I think I'll drag it out of the longboxes and read it before I get back to Avengers # 1 to #10. And don't forget the Vince Colletta inking! His delicate inking perfectly suits Colan's pencils here IMO. I don't think any art team has ever depicted her hair so well. Medusa looks strong and beautiful and the Frightful Four look suitably swarmy. MSH #15 was one of my cherished comics from back then; I bought it as a back issue some months after it was published (along with ASM #62, which also featured Medusa. She's always been one of my favorite Marvel characters). Fwiw you'll see when you "drag it out of the longboxes" that it involves Medusa braving the outside world in the hopes of finding a cure for Black Bolt's inability to speak. The Wizard promises to help if she will rejoin the Frightful Four and so she reluctantly re-teams with them.
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Post by Hoosier X on Jun 12, 2019 10:13:05 GMT -5
There's an issue of Marvel Super-Heroes (#16, I think) that (if I remember correctly) goes into this a bit. Something like "The Inhumans want to find out about the outside world so Medusa goes out into the world and falls in with a bad crowd who convince her that the FF are bad guys." It has some wonderful Gene Colan art and some wacky Marvel Golden Age reprints! I think I'll drag it out of the longboxes and read it before I get back to Avengers # 1 to #10. And don't forget the Vince Colletta inking! His delicate inking perfectly suits Colan's pencils here IMO. I don't think any art team has ever depicted her hair so well. Medusa looks strong and beautiful and the Frightful Four look suitably swarmy. MSH #15 was one of my cherished comics from back then; I bought it as a back issue some months after it was published (along with ASM #62, which also featured Medusa. She's always been one of my favorite Marvel characters). Fwiw you'll see when you "drag it out of the longboxes" that it involves Medusa braving the outside world in the hopes of finding a cure for Black Bolt's inability to speak. The Wizard promises to help if she will rejoin the Frightful Four and so she reluctantly re-teams with them. Colletta did some great work in his career! Of course, he also did some not-so-great work. And even in his prime he did things like erase Kirby's pencils. And then there's that one infamous panel (in Loki's origin, no less!) where he erased Laufey's head, leaving Laufey at quite a disadvantage in an important battle with Odin! I pulled out Marvel Super-Heroes #16 this morning and flipped through it, admiring the art, but I haven't had time to read it yet.
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Post by Hoosier X on Jun 12, 2019 10:27:56 GMT -5
Have you been reading that series on CBR where Brian Cronin and Eileen Gonzalez are reviewing the Avengers issues, starting form #1 (currently on #15)? I read a few of their reviews and they are spot-on, commenting on some of the same things I've mentioned (like how lame the Master of Evil are). I would be defending the Wasp if I was in the conversation. Probably not particularly effectively, but I would give it the old college try! I haven't yet read the commentary on #7. I hope they mention my favorite segment, that bit where the Enchantress is dressed very mod in green striped Capri pants and she lures Thor to her fancy balcony apartment and puts a whammy on him so he thinks the Avengers are EVIL! I love her outfit! I want to say "Hey! Laura Petrie wants her wardrobe back!" but the joke doesn't quite work because I can't imagine any of Laura Petrie's outfits in color. I've been thinking about the membership of the Masters of Evil and how it could have been a little better based on characters from the mid-1964 Marvel Universe. And you start to see the problem when you work on it a bit. For Thor, his rogues gallery was Loki and some really lame roustabouts like the Carbon Copy Man and the fake Merlin and Demon Duplicates. Maybe the Cobra and/or Mr. Hyde could have worked, but at the time Avengers #6 was published, they had just started their famous partnership and were appearing in a two-part story in JIM #105 and #106. For Iron Man, you have a great villain like the Mandarin, but he's not suitable as a lackey for Zemo. The Crimson Dynamo would have been a good choice if he hadn't died. TWICE, if you think about it. The other Iron Man villains are guys like Jack Frost, Mister Doll and the Scarecrow. (And I love the Scarecrow! A contortionist with trained crows! He's hilarious! But way out of his league here!) It's the same with Giant-Man, whose villains include the Porcupine and the Human Top. The latter would become Whirlwind, with a costume upgrade that would make him a much better candidate for the Masters of Evil. As the Human Top, he looked too much like the Human Turnip. I can see why they went with the Black Knight. (He also developed an unhealthy obsession for the Wasp, and I'm glad later writers managed to resist the temptation to have the Wasp say something like "Whirlwind would be very attractive is he wasn't infatuated with me and stalking me and drugging me and always planning on abducting me.")
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Jun 12, 2019 11:00:38 GMT -5
There's an issue of Marvel Super-Heroes (#16, I think) that (if I remember correctly) goes into this a bit. Something like "The Inhumans want to find out about the outside world so Medusa goes out into the world and falls in with a bad crowd who convince her that the FF are bad guys." It has some wonderful Gene Colan art and some wacky Marvel Golden Age reprints! I think I'll drag it out of the longboxes and read it before I get back to Avengers # 1 to #10. And don't forget the Vince Colletta inking! His delicate inking perfectly suits Colan's pencils here IMO. I don't think any art team has ever depicted her hair so well. Medusa looks strong and beautiful and the Frightful Four look suitably swarmy. MSH #15 was one of my cherished comics from back then; I bought it as a back issue some months after it was published (along with ASM #62, which also featured Medusa. She's always been one of my favorite Marvel characters). Fwiw you'll see when you "drag it out of the longboxes" that it involves Medusa braving the outside world in the hopes of finding a cure for Black Bolt's inability to speak. The Wizard promises to help if she will rejoin the Frightful Four and so she reluctantly re-teams with them. Seconded. Colletta was just amazing there. I've see Colan/Colletta collaborations that were less credible (canny?) but that Medusa story is just jaw-dropping.
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Post by brutalis on Jun 12, 2019 11:37:20 GMT -5
EGADS! Colletta praises instead of bashing? Did I wake up in another universe?!? What next? Going to see the worship of Liefeld's art? My head is spinning....
With that, I want to chime in that Colletta is a very good ( I like most of his work) inker, when he puts his mind to it and isn't asked to do an overnight rush job or help clean up/correct an inexperienced newbie. He does shine better on some artists than others, especially if they have a bold, strong style which doesn't get buried under his fine, feathering style of ink work.
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Post by dbutler69 on Jun 12, 2019 13:19:58 GMT -5
Have you been reading that series on CBR where Brian Cronin and Eileen Gonzalez are reviewing the Avengers issues, starting form #1 (currently on #15)? I read a few of their reviews and they are spot-on, commenting on some of the same things I've mentioned (like how lame the Master of Evil are). I would be defending the Wasp if I was in the conversation. Probably not particularly effectively, but I would give it the old college try! I haven't yet read the commentary on #7. I hope they mention my favorite segment, that bit where the Enchantress is dressed very mod in green striped Capri pants and she lures Thor to her fancy balcony apartment and puts a whammy on him so he thinks the Avengers are EVIL! I love her outfit! I want to say "Hey! Laura Petrie wants her wardrobe back!" but the joke doesn't quite work because I can't imagine any of Laura Petrie's outfits in color. I've been thinking about the membership of the Masters of Evil and how it could have been a little better based on characters from the mid-1964 Marvel Universe. And you start to see the problem when you work on it a bit. For Thor, his rogues gallery was Loki and some really lame roustabouts like the Carbon Copy Man and the fake Merlin and Demon Duplicates. Maybe the Cobra and/or Mr. Hyde could have worked, but at the time Avengers #6 was published, they had just started their famous partnership and were appearing in a two-part story in JIM #105 and #106. For Iron Man, you have a great villain like the Mandarin, but he's not suitable as a lackey for Zemo. The Crimson Dynamo would have been a good choice if he hadn't died. TWICE, if you think about it. The other Iron Man villains are guys like Jack Frost, Mister Doll and the Scarecrow. (And I love the Scarecrow! A contortionist with trained crows! He's hilarious! But way out of his league here!) It's the same with Giant-Man, whose villains include the Porcupine and the Human Top. The latter would become Whirlwind, with a costume upgrade that would make him a much better candidate for the Masters of Evil. As the Human Top, he looked too much like the Human Turnip. I can see why they went with the Black Knight. (He also developed an unhealthy obsession for the Wasp, and I'm glad later writers managed to resist the temptation to have the Wasp say something like "Whirlwind would be very attractive is he wasn't infatuated with me and stalking me and drugging me and always planning on abducting me.") Well, that's an interesting point you bring up about how lame the Avengers' foes were at this point. That hadn't really occurred to me. And I don't remember if Brian & Eileen mention that scene in #7, but I'm sure you'll get to it. Their series is a fun read.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2019 15:45:12 GMT -5
You like the name Boltigon? Blackagar Boltagon ... I like this one even better!
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Jun 12, 2019 15:51:52 GMT -5
That entire first Inhumans storyline is kind of a mess, isn't it? My notes say "Character Designs: A +. Plot: D -" Their names weren't thought through, either: three were named for characters from Greek mythology, one for a city in Egypt, one for a rock, and one had a super-hero name that made no sense applied to the exiled monarch of a hidden kingdom (and which later gave us Gruenwald's excruciating "Blackagar Boltagon"). The only name that was both clever and apropos was Lockjaw.
Cei-U! I summon the nonsensical nomenclature!
That name is a crime against humanity.
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Post by brutalis on Jun 12, 2019 15:53:32 GMT -5
Their names weren't thought through, either: three were named for characters from Greek mythology, one for a city in Egypt, one for a rock, and one had a super-hero name that made no sense applied to the exiled monarch of a hidden kingdom (and which later gave us Gruenwald's excruciating "Blackagar Boltagon"). The only name that was both clever and apropos was Lockjaw.
Cei-U! I summon the nonsensical nomenclature!
That name is a crime against humanity. You could say even say it is INHUMAN(e) to giving a child that name to live with...
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Post by rberman on Jun 12, 2019 15:56:37 GMT -5
"Cloud Cuckooland" also appears in The Lego Movie as a place of cotton candy and rainbows. What a coincidence! But not really. I was surprised to discover that it's actually from ancient Greek literature.
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Post by Cei-U! on Jun 12, 2019 17:00:22 GMT -5
And don't forget the Vince Colletta inking! His delicate inking perfectly suits Colan's pencils here IMO. I don't think any art team has ever depicted her hair so well. Medusa looks strong and beautiful and the Frightful Four look suitably swarmy. MSH #15 was one of my cherished comics from back then; I bought it as a back issue some months after it was published (along with ASM #62, which also featured Medusa. She's always been one of my favorite Marvel characters). Fwiw you'll see when you "drag it out of the longboxes" that it involves Medusa braving the outside world in the hopes of finding a cure for Black Bolt's inability to speak. The Wizard promises to help if she will rejoin the Frightful Four and so she reluctantly re-teams with them. Seconded. Colletta was just amazing there. I've see Colan/Colletta collaborations that were less credible (canny?) but that Medusa story is just jaw-dropping. I say this with nothing but affection, but you guys are nuts. Colletta MASSACRED Colan's pencils on that Medusa story! Admittedly Gene's work is challenging for any inker but Vinnie's "delicate" penwork is a very bad match for his subtle, shadow-drenched pencils (as Colan himself stated on at least one occasion). I will say, however, that I like it better than Paul Reinman over Colan, as seen two issues earlier in MSH #13.
Cei-U! I summon the gentlemen's disagreement!
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