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Post by adamwarlock2099 on May 18, 2016 13:15:52 GMT -5
I've read that there are three major factors in the decision to hire a freelancer: 1. Is their work good? 2. Do they meet the deadline? 3. Are they easy to work with? If the answer is "yes" to two of those three, the freelancer will probably get hired consistently. So, if you're crabby, you better be good and meet your deadlines. If you're slow, you better be good, and congenial. If your work isn't very good, you better meet the deadlines and be easy to work with. Which artists fit which category is left as an exercise for the reader.  I wonder if Travis Charest couldn't meet his deadlines or was hard to work with. For me there was no denying the talent. And besides being in a lot of different books/titles and publishing companies, not much else did he stay on. Wildcats Vol 1 was probably the most and that was only probably a dozen issues. He has an especially small amount of work if you only include interior art. |
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Post by berkley on May 18, 2016 15:52:14 GMT -5
One reason I'd love it if long-standing Marvel and DC characters were in the public domain is that we'd possibly get to see more of our favourite writers and artists working on them - and without having to make them fit in with the current Marvel/DC treatment of those characters.
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Post by Icctrombone on May 18, 2016 17:08:47 GMT -5
Recently DC did that with their former artists and writers. I'm thinking that it didn't sell well.
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Post by Icctrombone on May 18, 2016 17:09:49 GMT -5
I've read that there are three major factors in the decision to hire a freelancer: 1. Is their work good? 2. Do they meet the deadline? 3. Are they easy to work with? If the answer is "yes" to two of those three, the freelancer will probably get hired consistently. So, if you're crabby, you better be good and meet your deadlines. If you're slow, you better be good, and congenial. If your work isn't very good, you better meet the deadlines and be easy to work with. Which artists fit which category is left as an exercise for the reader. I wonder if Travis Charest couldn't meet his deadlines or was hard to work with. For me there was no denying the talent. And besides being in a lot of different books/titles and publishing companies, not much else did he stay on. Wildcats Vol 1 was probably the most and that was only probably a dozen issues. He has an especially small amount of work if you only include interior art. Yes, I remember reading that Charest was super slow. |
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Post by Nowhere Man on May 18, 2016 19:34:36 GMT -5
Some modern artists just labor a bit too long on their pages I'm afraid. Ethan Van Sciver, to his credit, said in a podcast recently that he's changing his philosophy when it comes to this because he wanted to turn in monthly work faster. Basically he came to the conclusion that even by speeding up his process, the work was just as good.
Conversely, someone like John Byrne could stand to spend a bit more time on the art in my estimation. When you look at Byrne's recent highly detailed commission pieces, they're gorgeous and as good as anything he's ever done. However this level of quality doesn't seem to translate to the pages of his recent comics work. The last thing he did that was truly great art wise, in my opinion, was Batman/Captain America.
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Post by dupersuper on May 18, 2016 22:17:55 GMT -5
On the other end, there's artists like John Romita Jr. He seems to have no trouble getting work on high profile books, despite the fact that I don't really know anyone that actually really likes his work. Whenever I hear people talk about their favorite artists, I hear a lot of names but I rarely ever see his name mentioned. It's like he's just there. It made a whole lot of sense though when I read that he was very easy to work with and always hits his deadlines. From an editor's standpoint, I can see how that would make him a go-to guy. He's no Cooke or Rude, but I like Romita Jr.
As to being easy to work with, I'd say that's definitely an contributing factor in Cookes limited exposure. Even the testimonials and tweets coming from his friends in the industry are often mentioning his temper.
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Post by Randle-El on May 18, 2016 22:51:04 GMT -5
On Romita Jr -- So my thing about artists is that I will rarely say "he sucks" or "she's awful". I recognize that a lot of artists are skilled or have talent, but may have styles that just aren't my cup of tea, so if I don't care for someone's work I'll just say "It's not for me". JRjr definitely falls in that category for me. But neither does he seem to have a passionate following that I've noticed. A few folks have chimed in here on this thread and mentioned that they like him, but I rarely ever hear someone say that they are a HUGE fan of his, or that he's their favorite artist. As I said, he's just sort of there, getting the job done. And given the qualities I previously mentioned, I get why still gets work. What I don't understand is why he seems to consistently get really high profile books. Most recently, he's been assigned to Scott Snyder's All-Star Batman book. Before that, he was paired with Gene Yang on Superman. And not only that, but at the time DC was really touting him as this legendary artist making his debut with DC. I just didn't get the hype -- and not just because he's not my cup of tea, but because he doesn't seem to have a passionate following. Even some artists who catch a lot of flack for their work also have people who really love them (exhibit A: Image founders). I just don't think I've ever seen JRjr inspire that level of enthusiasm. I've read that there are three major factors in the decision to hire a freelancer: 1. Is their work good? 2. Do they meet the deadline? 3. Are they easy to work with? If the answer is "yes" to two of those three, the freelancer will probably get hired consistently. So, if you're crabby, you better be good and meet your deadlines. If you're slow, you better be good, and congenial. If your work isn't very good, you better meet the deadlines and be easy to work with. Which artists fit which category is left as an exercise for the reader. Maybe a fourth consideration might be "How do their books sell?" That might be the one that trumps them all. If their books have great sales, you'll be willing to let me miss a deadline or two because the fans will still buy it no matter when it comes out. You might not personally like their art, but if it has mass appeal, who cares what you think? They might be prickly to work with, but so long as they turn out art that drives sales, management will tell you to make it work. Some modern artists just labor a bit too long on their pages I'm afraid. Ethan Van Sciver, to his credit, said in a podcast recently that he's changing his philosophy when it comes to this because he wanted to turn in monthly work faster. Basically he came to the conclusion that even by speeding up his process, the work was just as good. Conversely, someone like John Byrne could stand to spend a bit more time on the art in my estimation. When you look at Byrne's recent highly detailed commission pieces, they're gorgeous and as good as anything he's ever done. However this level of quality doesn't seem to translate to the pages of his recent comics work. The last thing he did that was truly great art wise, in my opinion, was Batman/Captain America. I think the general trend now is that many artists draw in a style that doesn't really support a monthly publishing schedule anymore. I blame the 90s. Besides all of the usual excesses that people associate with that era, I think it also acclimated comic readers to a certain type of art style -- bombastic, detailed artwork with lots of lines and rendering that was time consuming to produce. And you had a whole generation of readers who grew up on that, some of whom later became artists themselves and further contributed to popularizing that look. And here we are today. |
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Post by Spike-X on May 19, 2016 3:59:46 GMT -5
I really don't think it's hard to figure out why Darwyn Cooke, who personified everything that was fun and joyful about superhero comics, wasn't getting any regular work from DC Comics, the home of All Gritty, All The Time.
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Post by MDG on May 19, 2016 8:25:33 GMT -5
I've read that there are three major factors in the decision to hire a freelancer: 1. Is their work good? 2. Do they meet the deadline? 3. Are they easy to work with? If the answer is "yes" to two of those three, the freelancer will probably get hired consistently. So, if you're crabby, you better be good and meet your deadlines. If you're slow, you better be good, and congenial. If your work isn't very good, you better meet the deadlines and be easy to work with. Which artists fit which category is left as an exercise for the reader. You forgot #4: Can we get someone just as good for less? |
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Post by String on May 19, 2016 10:09:31 GMT -5
On Romita Jr -- So my thing about artists is that I will rarely say "he sucks" or "she's awful". I recognize that a lot of artists are skilled or have talent, but may have styles that just aren't my cup of tea, so if I don't care for someone's work I'll just say "It's not for me". JRjr definitely falls in that category for me. But neither does he seem to have a passionate following that I've noticed. A few folks have chimed in here on this thread and mentioned that they like him, but I rarely ever hear someone say that they are a HUGE fan of his, or that he's their favorite artist. As I said, he's just sort of there, getting the job done. And given the qualities I previously mentioned, I get why still gets work. What I don't understand is why he seems to consistently get really high profile books. Most recently, he's been assigned to Scott Snyder's All-Star Batman book. Before that, he was paired with Gene Yang on Superman. And not only that, but at the time DC was really touting him as this legendary artist making his debut with DC. I just didn't get the hype -- and not just because he's not my cup of tea, but because he doesn't seem to have a passionate following. Even some artists who catch a lot of flack for their work also have people who really love them (exhibit A: Image founders). I just don't think I've ever seen JRjr inspire that level of enthusiasm. Some interesting points. For me though, I don't have a top favorite artist. Instead I have many artists whose work I enjoy quite a lot and Junior's art is among them. His longevity is a factor in this regard I think. For me, you can go all the way back to his teaming with Stern on Spider-Man and Nocenti on DD and he's been a workhorse ever since. As you suggest later, his books do tend to sell better which adds to his exposure and appeal. He also has one of the most distinctive styles seen in the industry which makes him even more recognizable. And let's face it, the name alone and it's legacy also has something to do with it as well in some cases. |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on May 19, 2016 11:35:52 GMT -5
I wonder if Travis Charest couldn't meet his deadlines or was hard to work with. For me there was no denying the talent. And besides being in a lot of different books/titles and publishing companies, not much else did he stay on. Wildcats Vol 1 was probably the most and that was only probably a dozen issues. He has an especially small amount of work if you only include interior art. Yes, I remember reading that Charest was super slow. Yeah I was reading on his wikipedia page that the Wildcats/X-Men: The Golden Age almost took a year to do. But damn if it isn't some of the most amazing art put in a comic book. |
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Post by Icctrombone on May 19, 2016 12:17:55 GMT -5
Yes, I remember reading that Charest was super slow. Yeah I was reading on his wikipedia page that the Wildcats/X-Men: The Golden Age almost took a year to do. But damn if it isn't some of the most amazing art put in a comic book. I'm more inclined to believe that Charest just didn't do the work and did other things. I mean, who takes a year to do a comic ? |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on May 19, 2016 12:44:35 GMT -5
Yeah I was reading on his wikipedia page that the Wildcats/X-Men: The Golden Age almost took a year to do. But damn if it isn't some of the most amazing art put in a comic book. I'm more inclined to believe that Charest just didn't do the work and did other things. I mean, who takes a year to do a comic ? Could be. The wikipedia page doesn't really give a exact explanation as to why other than that his process is unorthodox to a degree. According to Charest, the time he needs to finish a given page varies, depending on how fast his editor needs it, and what he is being paid,[14] though because he came to prefer producing artwork that takes longer than the norm to complete by the time he left Wildstorm, he no longer finds it feasible to be the regular artist on a monthly series.[15] He points to WildC.A.T.s/X-Men: The Golden Age as an example of a book that took him considerable time (under a year), though he stresses that he finished it on time. |
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Post by Icctrombone on May 19, 2016 13:35:32 GMT -5
I'm more inclined to believe that Charest just didn't do the work and did other things. I mean, who takes a year to do a comic ? Could be. The wikipedia page doesn't really give a exact explanation as to why other than that his process is unorthodox to a degree. According to Charest, the time he needs to finish a given page varies, depending on how fast his editor needs it, and what he is being paid,[14] though because he came to prefer producing artwork that takes longer than the norm to complete by the time he left Wildstorm, he no longer finds it feasible to be the regular artist on a monthly series.[15] He points to WildC.A.T.s/X-Men: The Golden Age as an example of a book that took him considerable time (under a year), though he stresses that he finished it on time.It's all about the work ethic for artists. I think most of the professionals of the past produced a page a day. I remember reading that some of the artists of the 90's wasted most of their days playing video games instead of hitting that drawing board. Joe Mediarera of Battle Chasers was one of those dudes. |
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Post by Cei-U! on May 19, 2016 15:42:25 GMT -5
Most Marvel and DC artists in the Silver and Bronze Ages averaged two to three pages of pencils a day, more if all they were doing was breakdown/layouts (there were, of course, exceptions in both directions). It wasn't until the 1980s that it was possible to work fulltime in comics and make a decent living producing only a page a day.
Cei-U!
I summon the brutal pace!
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