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Retcons
Sept 1, 2016 8:25:07 GMT -5
Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 1, 2016 8:25:07 GMT -5
I thought of it as an elaboration rather than a retcon. Doom's origin wasn't fully formed at the time of his debut but nothing was changed when it got spelled out. I agree. It's like revealing after a few issues of X-Men that Hank McCoy was more than an acrobat but also a brilliant student using big words. It was normal character development, not rewriting the accepted truth.
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Post by chadwilliam on Sept 1, 2016 8:38:42 GMT -5
I thought of it as an elaboration rather than a retcon. Doom's origin wasn't fully formed at the time of his debut but nothing was changed when it got spelled out.
I know what you mean - it's sometimes hard to differentiate between retcons and "We can't say everything we want to in a single issue you know".
I'm sure there are numerous instances of Doom and Mr Fantastic meeting up after that second FF Annual where no mention is made of their history together, but it seems like something would have been made of Doom's grudge against Richards had one existed at that point especially in those early adventures. But you're right - Doom's personality in those issues remained unchanged as did Mr Fantastic's once those details were introduced.
Can we perhaps agree that Doom was a little more polite in those issues to his greatest enemy?
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Retcons
Sept 1, 2016 19:53:47 GMT -5
Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 1, 2016 19:53:47 GMT -5
I was reminded of this one when someone asked about Arion... I though retconing Aqualad into being the decendant of Arion (and thus, magical) was a much needed re-tooling of a painfully boring character. Tempest was actually interesting!
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Retcons
Sept 1, 2016 20:01:51 GMT -5
Post by Slam_Bradley on Sept 1, 2016 20:01:51 GMT -5
I was reminded of this one when someone asked about Arion... I though retconing Aqualad into being the decendant of Arion (and thus, magical) was a much needed re-tooling of a painfully boring character. Tempest was actually interesting! I was really afraid you were going to say when he was made part of Power Girl's origin. And I was going to have to challenge you to a duel.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 2, 2016 5:23:39 GMT -5
I was reminded of this one when someone asked about Arion... I though retconing Aqualad into being the decendant of Arion (and thus, magical) was a much needed re-tooling of a painfully boring character. Tempest was actually interesting! I was really afraid you were going to say when he was made part of Power Girl's origin. And I was going to have to challenge you to a duel. Although her being equipped with built-in flotation devices now makes all sorts of sense...
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 2, 2016 8:38:24 GMT -5
I was reminded of this one when someone asked about Arion... I though retconing Aqualad into being the decendant of Arion (and thus, magical) was a much needed re-tooling of a painfully boring character. Tempest was actually interesting! I was really afraid you were going to say when he was made part of Power Girl's origin. And I was going to have to challenge you to a duel. No, definitely not. That was one of those denial-of-multiple-Earths band-aids, wasn't it?
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Post by hondobrode on Sept 30, 2017 3:41:26 GMT -5
I'm for some of this, like Barbatos, the big bad of DC's summer event, Metal, having influenced Bruce Wayne from another dimension to become Batman.
It sounds sacrilegious, but I like it.
OTOH, I absolutely hate the idea of this new, supposedly critical Avenger none of us has ever known about (Voyager), going clear back to the group's origin.
I remember the Sentry, another really bad idea.
What characters or concepts have you liked or disliked that have been retroactively inserted into continuity ?
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Retcons
Sept 30, 2017 6:38:34 GMT -5
Post by Icctrombone on Sept 30, 2017 6:38:34 GMT -5
They all suck. Why mess around with a hit?
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 30, 2017 8:27:09 GMT -5
Disliked:
Sentry, to be sure.
The Illuminati.
Vulcan and the whole "second team" of X-Men.
Avengers from 1,000,000 BC.
Liked:
Stick, Elektra
Swamp Thing is a plant elemental
The Celestials are the reason for the Destroyer and the Odinsword, made from the Ring of the Nibelung (that's so cool that just typing it gives me goosebumps).
The Invaders
Vision is the original Human Torch
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Retcons
Sept 30, 2017 9:00:38 GMT -5
Post by Icctrombone on Sept 30, 2017 9:00:38 GMT -5
Disliked: Sentry, to be sure. The Illuminati. Vulcan and the whole "second team" of X-Men. Avengers from 1,000,000 BC. Liked: Stick, Elektra Swamp Thing is a plant elemental The Celestials are the reason for the Destroyer and the Odinsword, made from the Rong of the Nibelung (that's so cool that just typing it gives me goosebumps). The Invaders Vision is the original Human Torch You've changed my mind, I had forgotten about Stick and Elektra. But usually they change continuity with failing books not books like Batman and Avengers. I'm seeing solicits adding a female member to the original Avengers, I don't think that's necessary. And why change Batman origin ?
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Post by The Captain on Sept 30, 2017 9:40:21 GMT -5
Jessica Jones - liked the concept (failed superhero with major issues), hated the idea she had relationships with and ties to major characters we never knew about (Carol Danvers, Peter Parker, Tony Stark, Jean Grey).
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Post by String on Sept 30, 2017 10:14:26 GMT -5
The Illuminati is the worst. The concept itself maybe okay and if they had formed such a group right now at this very moment, then it may even be fine. But to try and retro-act them into previous canon (especially with all the major events) is ludicrous.
As with the current effects on Batman's origins, this idea of some dark demonic force influencing Bruce seems odd and forced to me. Yet King's revelation that a young Bruce once considered suicide changes and strengthens the whole tone and dynamic of his solemn oath to his parents and in keeping with the general themes of Batman being a hero that you can most relate to, I can relate to his contemplation of such an act on more than one level, far more than some mysterious dark demon.
Another retcon I like is Tony Stark being adopted and having a brother. It adds new layers to the character without directly altering his origin. I just didn't like who Bendis eventually revealed as his true parents.
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Retcons
Sept 30, 2017 10:46:28 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2017 10:46:28 GMT -5
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Post by Cei-U! on Sept 30, 2017 10:58:32 GMT -5
Disliked: Sentry, to be sure. The Illuminati. Vulcan and the whole "second team" of X-Men. Avengers from 1,000,000 BC. Liked: Stick, Elektra Swamp Thing is a plant elemental The Celestials are the reason for the Destroyer and the Odinsword, made from the Ring of the Nibelung (that's so cool that just typing it gives me goosebumps). The Invaders Vision is the original Human Torch I agree with every one of your likes. I can't comment on the others because I've never read the comics they appear in (nor do I have any plans to). Cei-U! I summon the guarded neutrality!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2017 11:17:00 GMT -5
I think my favorite retcon of all is that Cap was frozen in a block of ice and Bucky seemingly killed on a mission before the end of WWII that was done in Avengers #4. Pretty much a large part of the foundation of the Marvel universe rests on that retcon.
-M
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